Just the beginning?

Occupy Wall Street was a "Rosa Parks" moment. It could still go either way. Like Rafe said it could be just the beginning of huge changes or as Wake Up said it could be squashed.

But unlike you Wake Up, I don't think its up to the upper class to decide if things are bad and need to be fixed. Its up to the poor and lower middle class to decide that.

I'm hopeful that over time the Occupy movement will be an educational experience for many and they will decide they want real change in how our economy and democracy function because they will learn that poverty, environmental problems and a declining standard of living are systemic.

Many of us who have studied

Many of us who have studied history, not as stories, but as causes of the ever recurring tragedies, have been warning about this for many years.

But why is everybody, including Rafe, ignore the real causes of present and past tragedies, which have always been "faith" induced into people's minds to follow leaders to self destruction ?

There's no point in blaming the ruling sectors, or the politicians who give them the right to commit their crimes, going back forever in history, when it was always the priesthoods who gave them the faith based licence for their crimes.

I started reading economics in 1982 and was astonished by its idiocies, literally from the first page of the first textbook.

By 1985 I had enough proof that neoclassical market economics, taught in our universities, were a fraud and will bring major disasters on humanity.

Consulted with scientist contacts, by snail mail, from all over the world and copyrighted my :

"Principle for the application of physical efficiency to economics" in 1991 to establish the date.

I had it on this blog several times over the past 6 years.

Unless the protesters are going to demand answers from the universities over the garbage they permit to be taught as "economics", there won't be any changes.

Why is this so difficult to understand ?

While it is a necessity for academic freedoms to express views and opinions, it is also part of the same freedoms to question what is being taught and forced on students if they want to pass.

The Conquistadores murdered tens of thousands, colonized and enslaved millions by permission of the Vatican, "giving" South America to Spain and Portugal.

The same is happening now all over the world under the licence of the fraud of monetary economics, with the use of imaginary money as weapons.

Will the world ever wake up to the biggest fraud and crime wave in history ?

Ed Deak.

Corporate Welfare

Corporate Welfare Bums!
Remember that slogan?
If voters would have listened to David Lewis back then, we would live in a better society now.

If you are behind on your credit-card payments you get soaked anywhere from 19 to 28% interest, but if you have a "high Interest" savings account, you get about 1% interest!

Unfair you say?
Well, which political party did not get a chance to run this country-----(NDP) ----- take the hint voters.

Alive, if I'm not mistaken I

Alive, if I'm not mistaken I think it was a fella named Watkins who coined that phrase "corporate welfare bums". And I remember too the denial, outrage, and hypocracy that came out of the establishment after that. As for any political party to get voted in and stay in power, they have to play along with the establishment or they get drummed out; and that easy when the mass-media starts to gang up. Case in point, look what happened to Dave Barrett's Government

The media should stop treating this as a riot or a crime

There is no connection between the Stanley Cup Riot and this wave of public disgust at the criminal activities of the financial institutions. I have never marched in a protest, not even against the Vietnam War, because it wasn't my fight, but this is different.

The absolute arrogance of our politicians and bankers is beyond the pale. We bail them ourt, so they give themselves fat bonuses. It is but one symptom of their contempt for us, their customers and their constituency.

Canada is not in the same league as the USA, where the banks are foreclosing on mortgages with no reason, but as a business strategy. We are, however, in the same ball park and we need to change some attitudes, whether it is by ballot or bullet. If the former doesn't work, it will have to be the latter, which would be unfortunate, since bullets do not discriminate once they are released.

I do not say this lightly. In BC we have the Squamish Five as part of our heritage, and two Stanley Cup riots to boot. Extreme events like this may be like an extreme flood event; stochastic but powerful. One good flood wreaks more changes to the watershed than 20 years of steady erosion. I would hate to see that happen in the Canadian financial system. Steady change is good, but revolutions are like bullets; you can never tell where they end up.

The politicans and the bankers may lead, but we are the ones in charge. A democracy is not the same as an oligarchy.

"the failure of capitalism"?

We are not witnessing the "the failure of capitalism".
This is EXACTLY how capitalism is meant to function!

The biggest cause for the

The biggest cause for the failure of the NDP has always been the lack of communications skills, plus a certain sector that didn't want to rock the boat....for reasons known only to themselves.

Barrett called a snap election, long before he had to, which pissed off voters.

I think, it was in 83, when the NDP was leading in the polls, Barrett and his wife were taking a walk on some country road and got into a media scrum. He was asked about Bennett's "restraint".

He replied: "The restraint is off!" and the numbers went down like a rock.

If the NDP could come up with people who understand communications, know how to and dare to explain things to the public, they could run circles around anybody.

Ed Deak.

Funny Money

Rafe asks "why so many billionaires?". The answer is because the banks create funny money: every loan is credit that expands the total money supply. This scheme has been running for over one hundred years now & the result is massive, planned inflation (e.g. large house c. 1935 about $5,000 - now about $2 million). This deliberately induced inflation benefits the banks & their rich friends who have collateral for their loans. It hurts the ordinary people.
Rafe also asks how anyone can accumulate billions (like Carlos Slim)? I might also add, how can an engineer like Schulick or David Black (Black Press) or Gwyn Morgan (Encana) who all started out with almost nothing as young graduates accumulate many millions in only 30 years? Anyone who has run a business knows how hard it is to accumulate profits like those. Perhaps they had special friends at the banks who gave then preferential loans. There is a lot of juicy stuff here for any investigative journalist worth their salt.

As OWS relates to Canada...

To respond to Frank's Quote:
...I don't think its up to the upper class to decide if things are bad and need to be fixed. Its up to the poor and lower middle class to decide that.

My thoughts:
I agree completely with you; on the other hand, we are really talking about a 'revolution' - non-violent of course in our own context - where the common person wants a complete reversal and change from the way things have been stacked against them for so long.

In order to have a successful revolution, the times have to be extremely bad not just for the usual exploited classes. The intellectuals/upper middle class, in addition to the poor have to be fed up and the media has to turn against the government as well. The extreme momentum comes from the "masses" - those who are most affected as Frank is saying.

Check out the Harvard historian's theory of revolution (Crane Brinton) which has stood the test of time when used to see if revolutions in various countries could be predicted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anatomy_of_Revolution

and another tongue-in-cheek discussion of the theory here:
http://learnearnandreturn.wordpress.com/2011/02/02/crane-brinton-egypt-and-the-anatomy-of-revolution/#comments

Brinton does say that "we must not expect our revolutions to be identical" but he also says, that the signs of change include: (and the page numbers refer to his book)
1. problems functioning — "government deficits, more than usual complaints over taxation,
2. conspicuous governmental favoring of one set of economic interests over another, administrative entanglements and confusions".
3. social problems, such as the feeling by some that careers are not "open to talents", and economic power is separated from political power and social distinction.
4. a "loss of self-confidence among many members of the ruling class," the "conversion of many members of that class to the belief that their privileges are unjust or harmful to society." (p. 65)
5. "Intellectuals" switch their allegiance away from the government. (p. 251)

Then he outlines four stages - which I sincerely hope and wish are not applicable here in Canada!! But strictly on a theoretical basis, it is fascinating to compare what is going on and try to figure out how far it is going to go.

More on Brinton's theory cont'd from above

Unfortunately, apparently, and I am going from Wikipedia here as I don't own the book! Brinton concludes that despite their ambitions, the political revolutions he studied brought much less lasting social changes than the disruptions and changes of "what is loosely called the Industrial Revolution".

At least let's hope that there is some "give" from governments to the common person in our current situation so we don't have to experience all of this. I personally think Canadians are not hurting enough Rafe -

and by the way - for those of us who have not experienced any sort of revolution... THAT IS THE PURPOSE OF SOCIAL PROGRAMS!! Of course, to feed the very hungry and bottom percentage who are unable to do so, but CYNICALLY, social programs are meant to reduce the gap of inequality so that the BOTTOM percentage doesn't increase so much it becomes 'masses' of economically, socially deprived people don't rebel.

Right wing ideology is actually very dangerous to itself. As it cuts back on universal support for its own people and feeds it into military and nationalist pursuits as well as big business (because apparently the trickle down theory works!), it is actually sowing the seeds of discontent amongst a growing number of people.

Weird how conservatism hasn't quite aligned itself to that truth.

Unfocused?

The media seems clearly unable, (or unwilling) to see the forest for the trees. The demonstrators, although unorganized and protesting about various injustices are clear about one thing. We are no longer going to be ripped off by government aided corporate theft.
Although clearly better off than our Arabian compadres, our standard of living is on a slippery slope. Mr. Mair has made the obvious point that all “democratic” societies are wide open to a leftward swing. That could well include a return to communism in Europe, perhaps even worldwide.
The Occupation is seen as the only alternative to electing millionaires who we know will not act on our behalf, regardless of the pre-election lies they spout.
Any government that finances a $300M stadium while abandoning the less fortunate needs no further introduction or explanation. The “Leakdome” (the one with a 1 year warranty) in Vancouver and the new stadium in Montreal are indications of insanity in government and we are done with it.
This is like preaching to the converted. My point is that we all need to do more in resistance to the outrageous taxes, fees and spending practises of our governors. That means influencing those who feel disenfranchised to get involved, learn about the issues and vote, if only in protest.

OWS

The basic problem in Canada anyway, that democracy is a sham.That a minority elects a dictatorship,that than imposes its beliefs and lines its own pockets. There is no accountability. The mayor media is also in the pockets of the rulers.

The cause of the economic crisis - comment by Jim Quail

Another excellent article, Rafe, but while you have identified all the parts of the puzzle, I don't think you've got them quite put together right.

The crisis is not really the product of banking failures. The things that were wrong with the banks were just one part of the real story. And your article describes that story well - all that's needed is to attach the bits together correctly.

I think it is clear that the real reason why we are mired in an interminable economic crisis is the maldistribution of wealth that you describe. De-regulated banks were one aspect of a policy of distributing wealth narrowly and spreading poverty widely.

The boom of the last three decades was based on consumer spending, but real household incomes were flat throughout that period. The top 1% were pillaging the economy, aided by governments (including via their banking policies, along with taxation, labour laws, and so forth).

The only way that the hapless consumers could keep buying more and more toys and homes, keeping the money flowing upward, was by borrowing - that's the only way you can increase your consumption without any increase in your income.

Perfect recipe for a massive bubble - a bubble in everything - land, oil, equities, everything. A hot air economy.

That means that the only way to restore any semblance of economic stability is not by socializing the private debt of banks, car manufacturers and bond-holders, but by redistributing wealth downward. That would require reversing the policy directions of the past three decades: restore meaningful tax rates on rich people, eliminate the barriers to unionization, socialize the cost of major household expenses like child care and prescription drugs, and so on.

Its your money

If you want to stop banks from taking your money don't put your money in banks.

Take your money out of the banks and put it in a local credit union.

Corruption is the root cause

Rooting out CORRUPTION, in all forms, should be the One Universal Demand. Everything truly bad in a society starts with some kind of corruption.

All of the dire problems facing our financial systems, the increasingly lopsided distribution of wealth, wars of empire, low economic growth, loss of industry and jobs, privatizing of public assets and their profits, socializing of private costs and debts, environmental destruction, etc. ad nauseum, can be traced back to ONE fundamental cause: CORRUPTION.

Corruption is apolitical. Politicians at all levels, in every party, along with many in the private sector, are acting against the interests of those they nominally represent, whose assets they are in care of, because they are being bribed ("legally" through contributions, or directly), are stealing, or both. They deregulate, grant monopolies, transfer public assets to, and refuse to investigate/or prosecute their bribers or brethren, and we all pay.

Corruption stifles investment and actually destroys real wealth, even as it creates billionaires. Solve corruption and the other problems will be sorted out.

The internal government rules and mechanisms for rooting out corruption have been steadily weakened, consolidated news media have abandoned their role as watchdogs, and the public has been distracted from paying enough attention to fully comprehend and react against even glaring evidence, and are now too disgusted to even vote.

The practical fallout of rampant corruption is now impossible to ignore. Locally, think about BC Hydro Accenture/IPP/Smart Meters, BC Rail, BC Place, the HST post-election flip-flop and Campbell as High Commisioner, Canada Line, post Olympic debts, SFPR, and dozens of other issues, and tell me that any of those scams and boondoggles would have been nearly as costly or even happened at all, absent corruption.

Overpasses collapse because of corruption.

Why should any dealing between government and the private sector be kept confidential, as most P3 contracts are? The BC Auditor General is chronically underfunded and hamstrung - any wonder why? Even prosecutors and the courts are understaffed and under-funded - no doubt that keeps bored investigators from looking into the complex machinations of high-level crime.

This website details the mechanisms and effects of corruption:
http://www.u4.no/helpdesk/faq/faqs1.cfm

Always, always, follow the money.

It's your money

If you want to stop banks from taking your money don't put your money in banks.

Take your money out of the banks and put it in a local credit union.

Occupy Nelson

I attended Occupy Nelson on Oct 15th along with about 500 other concerned citizens. It was heartwarming to see that people are starting to speak up against inequities within the Capitalist system. The message was clear to me; it’s time for our governments to start governing for the benefit of the people rather than the sole benefit of Corporations.

On January 11, 1944, President Roosevelt suggested that the United States should implement a second ‘bill of rights’. Roosevelt argued that the ‘political rights’ guaranteed by the constitution and the bill of rights had proved inadequate to assure us equality in the pursuit of happiness. Roosevelt’s remedy was to declare an ‘economic bill of rights’ which would guarantee;

Employment with a living wage
Freedom from unfair competition and monopolies
Housing
Medical care
Education
Social security

How times of have changed. Corporations are so emboldened they shamelessly stand before us and state their responsibility is to their shareholders to ensure profits are maximized. How quickly they have forgotten their responsibility to society and the environment. How shameful that our governments have allowed them to shirk their responsibilities.

For me personally, I hope this is just the beginning of massive change for our society. We have let governments and corporations operate with immunity relinquishing control of our future well-being to those who have lost track of their responsibility to us.

It takes more than profitable corporations to create prosperous societies. We need leaders whose first concern is the well being of their citizens. It’s time for an economic adjustment, this time in favour of the people.

Turning Point

I truly hope we are awakening to the consequences of apathy.
This crisis could deepen,claiming more victims before needed changes occur.
The lesson we all should learn is how reckless we were in ignoring signals that laissez-faire policy wasn't working as we moved from one unsustainable bubble to another.
And as we emerge from the consequences of Reagan/Thatcher dogma, perhaps media will be transformed to independant players demanded in real democracies.

This is a good sign.

I"m optimistic about the result of this movement. When people get off their butts and protest it means they have been awakened to the possibilities. It seems that they thinks something is wrong with the world and they are worried about different things and want change. To begin the discussion about what needs to change is good. It is a beginning. There is no turning back and the more the establishment resists, the greater the force of change becomes.

I think it is a damn good sign that change, maybe even just the possibility of it, is in the air.

Elites Foolish to Dismiss Occupy Wall Street

Everyone should have been paying attention and up-in-arms when they allowed Corporations the same rights as a human being in Courts of Law.

Change

The one common factor in demonstrations around the world is a demand for change. The defenders of the status quo do not have enough fingers to plug all the holes in their corrupt, 'leaky' system. That's why they keep demanding to know what are our demands: finite number of demands, finite number of 'fingers'.

"...the failure of banking

"...the failure of banking institutions..."?

How did they "fail"?

Were they inherently "fair", ethical, efficient...?

They failed because the governments, through their central banks and fiat money, fed them cheap capital.

They went nuts with leverage. They used the gullible public's deposits plus zillions more in digital credit to make ridiculous loans to people who should never have received them.

They paid themselves obscene salaries and bonuses.

But the governments backstopped their bets. Fannie & Freddie (and CMHC), all arms of government, subsidzed bank losses.

GOVERNMENTS failed to control or regulate.
GOVERNMENTS are spending tomorrow's earnings.
GOVERNMENTS support the bankrupting welfare state.
GOVERNMENTS bailed out the banks with our money.
GOVERNMENTS enforce the use of paper dollars.
GOVERNMENTS refuse to regulate, or even to abdicate that responsibility and shout "caveat emptor!"

The OWSers simply want their own bailouts.

Why aren't they targetting the governments who allowed this?

Violence is inevitable

Violence will erupt at some point because the rich, the elite, the powerful money back room boys will never give up their billions. And the politicians who have been bought and paid for by those billionaires will not give up their reigns of power. History is full of revolutions that started just as this OWS protest has begun. Now the rich and powerful will bring in their thugs and police and eventually the army to use force and beat and kill the protesters. Then someone will pull out a gun and shoot some politician or some filthy rich executive and all hell will break loose.

Rafe, I don't think we have

Rafe, I don't think we have hit 1917 yet, this is more like 1905. Stay tuned.

What's up with you folks?

NOW it is coming on like a revelation that governments are in bed with corporations and all is not well?

The entire state is founded on corruption and crime. Warfare and theft of lands from, dare I say, sovereign nations is a fundamental economic policy of our capitalist state. Every single day the economic sanctions of capitalism are killing off people around the globe and little is recognized here in Canada. And then there is the warfare, and torture, and genocide, and the use of nuclear and chemical weapons, the more obvious vulgarities of our nation we barely concern ourselves about.

Our government is not legitimate, not in any conscionable sense. It's legitimacy is derived through force, at the end of a barrel of a gun. You do as the government tells you, or it crudely steals your property or throws your body in jail. It matters not whether you are right in the most just sense of the word.

So what do we do to make it all run, this machination of criminality parading itself as legitimate government? We pompously herd ourselves down to the polls and endorse the regime. And we turn over a portion of our earnings each year which continue funding its economic and barbaric crimes. For this is what we, the 'good citizen' does, do we not?

It matters not in our society to be accountable to something more than an imposed Constitution contorted hither and yon to serve the purpose of the state, or to something more than books of fable which have long lost their essence in our times.

We don't seek to think clearly, concisely or honestly with ourselves. We don't desire to dig too deeply inside lest we find out what we are all about. Our participation with the government through our vote and our labour makes us complicit in the crimes of state, it does not absolve us from those very crimes,

If we believe that we are more than farm animals, that we were not born simply to satisfy the greedy needs of the government farmer know as state. then we need to individually start acting like more than animals. We need to lead through our humanity. Only then can we live freely and be a good neighbor.

It is not a man's duty, as a matter of course, to devote himself to the eradication of any, even the most enormous wrong; he may still properly have other concerns to engage him; but it is his duty, at least, to wash his hands of it, and, if he gives it no thought longer, not to give it practically his support. If I devote myself to other pursuits and contemplations, I must first see, at least, that I do not pursue them sitting upon another man's shoulders. I must get off him first, that he may pursue his contemplations too. See what gross inconsistency is tolerated.

~ Henry David Thoreau, On the Duty of Civil Disobedience (1849)

Occupy Movement

As Rafe says the problem is not the 1%. The concentration of wealth in the hands of so few is a symptom of something much more disturbing. For several generations Western governments have been colluding with the financial and corporate sectors to redefine the role of the populace. With the support of the media, we the populace have slowly but surely been transformed from citizens to whom government is accountable - to consumers to whom no one is accountable. This shift is pervasive throughout every sector of society. As consumers our role is to keep the machine running and running and running. Never mind that the jobs have been shipped offshore we are still expected to keep buying and consuming. No matter that we are exhausting our personal and planetary resources, being tossed from our homes and living on credit. Our capacity to consume is our only value to both the government and their global partners.

Each person who has turned out for the occupations has their own story of abandonment and disrespect. While the stories will vary the root cause does not. Whether we realize it or not, we are no longer citizens we are biological units who have been groomed to consume. If you are inclined to question this just take a look at the pharmaceutical ads. They are chilling. How do they get to sell that poison to us?

Fifteen things they don't

Fifteen things they don't tell you about money. I hope the 99% read this:
http://www.positivemoney.org.uk/2011/04/15-things-they-dont-tell-you-about-money/

Harper to the poor, no need to protest

Canada's Christian fundamentalist Prime Minister tells millions of poor no need to protest

http://chainthedogma.blogspot.com/2011/10/canadas-christian-fundamentalist-prime.html

[excerpts]

Here is what Stephen Harper said when asked for his comments on the Occupy Canada protests that began here on the 15th.

"Canadians understand that Canada has performed very well during the global economic recession," he said. "We've managed to create more growth and more jobs than just about any other industrialized country. We are extremely focused on the needs of Canadians and the needs of the middle class. We obviously have a very different situation here — we didn't bail out our banking sector. Our banking sector was the strongest in the world."

... it is not true that the situation in Canada with respect to the Occupy protests is different than in the United States. In fact, the situation is worse.

According to the recent report, "World Income Inequality", by the Conference Board of Canada: "The increase in income inequality has been more rapid in Canada than in the U.S. since the mid-1990s." Anne Golden, president and chief executive explained: “Even though the U.S. currently has the largest rich-poor income gap among these countries, the gap in Canada has been rising at a faster rate,” adding that high inequality raises both “a moral question about fairness and can contribute to social tensions.” The conclusions in that report are supported by the December 2010 study by the Canadian Center for Policy Alternatives, "The Rise of Canada's Richest 1%".

So, there is the evidence that exposes Harper's blatant lie that the Canadian situation is different and better than in the United States. The Occupy protests here, and where ever they occur, are focused on the inequities and corruptions of financial and political systems. That old truism, "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer", has never been so true or so obvious as today in Canada, so Harper is both ignoring the evidence, which he is well known for, and lying to the people he supposedly serves. I think that comes easy to Harper, because of his membership in the fundamentalist, evangelical Christian and Missionary Alliance church.

Occupy everywhere

The future depends on whether the 'Progressive' politicians are able to ally themselves to the Occupy movement or not. If Barack Obama, for example, can be the leader of the people, and not the tool of the establishment, then many of those in the Occupy movement will stop protesting and start working for change within the system. If the NDP and/of federal Liberals, or some combination of the two, can grab protesters' loyalty, then the same will happen here. However, if they cannot, or they are seen as tools of the elite, then the system becomes a hindrance to people's hopes and dreams. Then some radical leader will become the leader, and watch out then what happens. Instead of Russia, look to the French Revolution. First, moderates led the revolutionaries, and they tried to work with the King, but he tried to escape, so they failed. Upon the failure of the moderates, the radicals took over, and 'all hell broke loose'. In the Depression there were similar if not worse discrepancies than now between rich and poor, and yet, there was no revolution. Why not? I submit it was the appearance on the scene of Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who gave the appearance, at least, of trying to make the system work. Will Barack Obama or somebody else be the new Roosevelt? I sure hope so, or else we may get another Robespierre.

Susan McLoughlin - a different spin

I agree with what you wrote. That is that:
"Each person who has turned out for the occupations has their own story of abandonment and disrespect."

Every person who was not happy with his/her lot in life and wanted someone/thing to blame was invited to the protest.
In Toronto, with a population in the region of several million people, around two thousand people showed up.

These people do not represent that 99% to whom they wish to be associated. Make it less than 5%.

OSW is to test the depths of the waters by the "elite" . . . .

Unfortunately, all is NOT what it seems - the protests were organized and instigated by the very "elite", which is openly showing contempt to the demonstrators. A banker was seen standing on a 'balcony' in wall street, laughing at the crowd below and popping a bottle of 'bubblies'.
The laws that will enable the "elite" to smash heads are in place and will be used to 'amuse' the culprits, using corrupted police forces. - - -

Ed Deak

This time you are closer to the mark. To set the stage heading into the May 5, 1983 provincial election:

The Socreds were burdened with the "Dirty Tricks" scandal (Gracie's Finger, etc.), the economy was in a mini-depression (economic contraction, 15% unemployment, 15% interest rates, house prices halved, misery, etc.)

Bennett was also not well liked while Barrett was a populist - great orator.

The date that the election was called in April, BCTV interviewed people all over the province and the consensus was that former Socred voters were not happy with the Socreds and were going to move their votes elsewhere.

While public opinion polls were still illegal during an election campaign back then, it was a common consensus that the Socreds were well behind the NDP.

With that stage set, after week 1 of the campaign Barrett attended at a radio talk show in Cranbrook. A caller asked Barrett what he would do about the "6% and 5%" public sector wage restraint program.

Barrett responded, for the first time, that the NDP would scrap the 6% and 5% public wage restraint program, which was a shocker to most people as the NDP never took a position previously on same.

BCTV had a brand, spanking new satellite truck and reporter John Daley reported "live" from Cranbrook at the top of the BCTV NewsHour about Barrett's strategic political mistake.

Remember that private sector workers were either losing their jobs or facing reduced incomes. These same taxpayers would have to pay MORE than 6% and 5% to public sector workers?

The fiery BC Fed head Jim Kinnaird applauded Barrett's move and from thereonin, the NDP campaign began to collapse. It was later revealed that internal Socred polls showed that the Socreds were even leading in NDP strongholds such as New Westminter.

The NDP campaign was desperate and on the day before the election planted a phony story with the Province Newspaper that the Socreds would dismantle the ALR to no avail.

The moral of the story is that moderate swing voters determine elections - not political diehards. And with left-wing Adrian Dix and his baggage - like moderate Mike Harcourt stated in reference to NDP members about Dix: "You go left... you get left out!".

Until the BC NDP adopts the policies of the Manitoba NDP (which are virtually akin to the BC Libs) they will remain in the policital wilderness IMHO.

looking for a leader?

... maybe that is because you refuse to lead yourself.

All one can be responsible for is one's own conduct. Conduct yourself accordingly. Be responsible for who you are and what you do, however disturbing the facts may be.

You know the facts about government corruption, exploitation and murder. You know the facts about sociopathic corporations where profit is the ONLY concern, which calls immediately into question the sort of people operating these ghosts in the machine.

Are we now like the people in Latin America in the mid 1970s, so terrorized and oppressed by the state, where ""we did not know what nobody could deny"?

Thank you Rafe

for this article. When the centralization of power leads to revolution and violence - we forget about what we want and get caught up in the bid for more power. Life gets lost; so many souls are destroyed when the contest is about how many you can effectively incite to hatred and how many you can kill. Control, power, wealth becomes anti-life and all our previous references including civil society become redundant. Enter the next big lie to divert attention away from truth - World War III. Will you and I resort to violence or will we continue to work to tip the scales back to the reverence for life.

We are not witnessing the

We are not witnessing the "the failure of capitalism".
This is EXACTLY how capitalism is meant to function!
==========

Really? Then why were the so called 'to big to fail' given huge sums of cash? Not just Wall street but Automakers? Real capitalism they would of been allowed to fail..What we have is actually fascism where companies keep the money and if they get into trouble the tax payers bail them out..

Dan the socialist

He was making the point that increased income disparity, increased poverty, joblessness, no benefit for the worker/citizen from the selling of resources or increased productivity is how capitalism is supposed to work.

BC Liberal MLAs go rogue against their own party-part I

The growing clamour over provincial policies to care for the developmentally disabled has spread to the backbench of the governing Liberals.

In an emotional presentation to the legislature on Monday, veteran Liberal MLA Randy Hawes expressed deep concern that services being provided are inadequate, and adults with severe developmental challenges – to the distress of their families – are being moved out of group homes where many have lived for years.

“In the more than 10 years that I’ve been in this legislature, there’s no issue that’s caused me more loss of sleep or more concern for those most valuable people,” said Mr. Hawes, not previously known as a publicly independent voice within the Liberal caucus.

He rejected past assertions by the government and its service agency, Community Living B.C., that no one is being moved out of a group home into private residential accommodation against their will. “We know that hasn’t been what has been happening.”

The Abbotsford-Mission MLA, who appeared close to tears at one point, was speaking during debate on a motion by NDP MLA Nicholas Simons. The motion, which called for a moratorium on further group home closures, was talked out before it could come to a vote.

Gordon Hogg, another Liberal backbencher, also expressed concern over the situation, which has prompted the demotion of former Social Development minister Harry Bloy and the firing late Friday of Community Living CEO Rick Mowles.

Mr. Hogg said some of the decisions made by CLBC have hit at society’s core values “and [they have hit at] them in a way which I’m not comfortable with.”

The MLA for Surrey-White Rock was referring to well-publicized recent examples which had distraught parents questioning removal of their developmentally disabled adult children from group accommodation, where they had been comfortable, to private homes.

“They give us all cause for concern – perhaps more than cause for concern,” Mr. Hogg told the legislature.

In his address, Mr. Hawes referred to the disabled daughter of a single mother. Once the daughter, who needs round-the-clock care, turned 19, there were no more services for her. “The mother was told: ‘If you have to give up your job, I guess you have to go on welfare.’ That’s not right.”

He called for a “top-to-bottom examination” of CLBC, to include parents, advocates and government experts, and better services for the disabled.

“We need to give [hope to] those families that today aren’t seeing hope … and we need to give it to them now.”

Newly appointed Social Development Minister Stephanie Cadieux rejected NDP accusations that the system is under-funded and in crisis.

“[The CLBC] is an organization going through a period of change, and definitely, there are bumps in the road,” Ms. Cadieux said in an interview. “But I am confident we will see them resolved.”

Part II

She said Mr. Hawes’s criticism is evidence of concerns felt by both sides of the House, though she contended that many are also happy with the current direction. “It’s really a very good system, but there are challenges, and we have to work through the challenges we face.”

However, Faith Bodnar, executive director of the long-time advocacy organization B.C. Community Living Action, said the situation is as desperate as anything she has ever seen. Disabled individuals are being re-evaluated and stripped of services, at the same time as others are moved out of their group homes.

“We are in crisis here,” Ms. Bodnar said, adding that for the first time in memory her organization is receiving calls from CLBC employees stressed by what is happening. “If they are calling us, I’m saying, ‘That’s serious.’ ”

She said the government needs to halt ongoing changes and involve all stakeholders in a re-evaluation of CLBC policies.

“Let’s press the pause button,” she said. “People are desperate. It seems the system of services and support is being dismantled before we really realize what we’re doing.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/british-columbia/bc-politics/liberal-mlas-join-call-to-end-group-home-closures/article2204395/

The rate are bailing on Christy Cluck Cluck Clark.

Good Day

Hey Frank, I really like my handle

"The truth about your handle is that you come across as both desperate and pathetic." My handle is ridicule of your joke of a movement. Silence me and I will prove my point.

See... one man tries to "express my opinion" and is almost shut down by the OccupyToronto movement: http://youtu.be/W7ZTM0Z2Nec

The more that comes out about the Occupy movement, the less rationality I see. The less strategy. The more hate. I mean, calling our Premier names, making comments about the Premier's genes and bullying the heroic pundit of the BCLibs.

Worked in a couple of

"disaster zones".
I used to say (when the locals asked just how they could access the "Yellow Brick Road"):
"You have the stuff here we have lost."
'Cause they knew their neighbour - did not always like him/her but they would shake hands or kiss each other on the cheek whether a friend or enemy.
We are the benificiaries of this system. I'm glad I got to see it for this short time.
That does not translate into any sustainable future.
Screw the rich. They could not pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were printed on the heel.
It is up to us

Equality

read this book: The Spirit Level, a few months ago, on why more equal societies are better for everyone...great read...

The authors have a society they have set up here is the link....http://www.equalitytrust.org.uk/

Wouldn't it be great if something happened ...

Well, Rafe

"I have written about billionaires recently, asking how in hell can anyone accumulate 70 thousand million dollars -- that is 70 billion dollars -- as has Carlos Slim, from Mexico would you believe!"

Maybe you'd like to write about just what it is that they do with all this money? No doubt there is a certain amount of frivolity but what about the rest, huh?

This whole issue of "Occupy Wall Street" is so lop sided that's it's doomed to failure.

For those calling for upheaval, be careful what you wish for. Human nature is such that causes dealt with in that manor rarely wind up ending as the minions planned.

snert

snert : "Maybe you'd like to write about just what it is that they do with all this money?"

And that's important for what reason? If there's a society where I have a million dollars and 10 other people have $1 why does it matter what I'm doing with my money since whatever I'm doing is not helping the other 10.

snert : "For those calling for upheaval, be careful what you wish for. "

We're on a downhill slide, change needs to happen.

"We're here, we're unclear. Get used to it"

I like that parody of the gay movement by the Occupy crowd. If the occupiers ever get their act together, they will be a formidable movement. Till then they are like the Rhinocerus Party; horny, but hard to take seriously. I hope and think it will gel soon enough.

The real poor are the folks making under $20,000.00 a year though, not the professionals like, for example, the teachers.

What has really happened in my opinion, is that house prices have risen so far so fast, that they are now about ten times the family income. This only means one thing; the value of money has declined. Between rising house prices and gas prices, disposable income has fallen drastically and no one wants to accept that.

Many people have used debt to finance their annual vacation and their second car, and the crunch is on. Everyone is spending money they have not yet earned, including our governments. Fun, isn't it?

How much do you make?

Fish-counter you eat fish-children. How do you know who the "real" poor are? Just to go to work, there are a few necessary things which blow your $20,000 comment out of the fish tank. I would argue that "poor" includes the $45,000 gross earnings.

Car (I'm not on a viable transit route because I can't afford to live in Vancouver):
$1200 insurance
$2200/year gas
$500 maintenance
TTL: #3900

That would leave 16 000 approx to survive and pay RENT - consider that for a family of four - and FOOD - and CLOTHING - and I guess there would be no EXTRAS for the kids like field trips, school supplies, christmas presents.
Rent: $1000/month X 12 = $12,000
Food: $400/month X 12 = $4800
Clothing from Value Village = $300
GRAND TOTAL: $20,900

Hmmm. I'm not sure of the reason for your limited concern for only people under $20,000. Things are getting much harder for EVERYONE. It's hard to provide the things that kids need to reach their full potential unless you have a bit of disposable income to expand their horizons. The numbers I've used above are EXTREMELY low as most will tell you. Where do YOU live - another planet?

If you can NEVER get ahead and are living paycheque to paycheque without wasting money, you are POOR.

Play this game and read about its creator:
http://www.playspent.org/

Wake up

Bickering about who is or isn't poor aside, I am perplexed by your statement:

It's hard to provide the things that kids need to reach their full potential unless you have a bit of disposable income to expand their horizons.

First, 'full potential'. What is that?

Second, 'expand their horizons'. Funny words to choose because there have been many great thinkers throughout history that barely left their towns and, relatively speaking, most never left 'their province'. I am not sure how a bit of disposable income is going to breach this gulf of a sheltered life in one's favour, particularly if there is no substance to their viewing in the first place.

Maybe what we should be striving to accomplish is to 'deepen our horizons'. A huge part of that is entailed within critical reading. Knowing that most of the best ideas about living have already been written and thought about, a huge works is available for free at the public library. And, of course, there is the internet.

Face it, our country is littered with actual and effectual illiteracy. I don't know the statistics, but I've been around long enough to see it in play. The majority of people do not read anything of note, if at all.

Reading adult comics and tales of adventures like Harlequin Romance or Louis L'Amour or other such feeble-minded pieces of typing is not 'reading' any more than gobbling up a Twinkie is having a meal.

I think there is plenty of learning and experience to be had which will advance peoples as human beings - and for free! We seem to have little interest in the classic written works anymore, and I can't help but wonder how big of a role our education system plays in deadening our desires of inquiry.

Cheers.

Igbymac...

I do agree with you. There is NO point setting boundaries for who is and isn't poor. The truth is that most average families are feeling squeezed. That's why when Fish-Counter responded like this:

The real poor are the folks making under $20,000.00 a year though, not the professionals like, for example, the teachers.

I had to respond to him much like you are responding to me. FC is a joke and really quite malicious towards the teaching profession - here he is still trying to make his/her point about teachers from the other article, and he/she appears to be making out that there aren't that many suffering. I think he is plain wrong.

Support from the upper middle class

As a member of the upper middle class, I can tell you exactly what we need to start emphasizing in order to get more people in my income range on board. We need to communitate the other messages of the movement - environmental issues, human rights issues, all the stuff listed on shitharperdid.ca. The less it looks like this movement is asking for handouts, and the more it focuses on collective good, sustainability of our health and existence on this planet, the better. I want to stop being ashamed of Canada on the world stage, and I don't want to be afraid of living in a toxic waste dump!!

Elites figure they will hunker down

behind police lines, gates and walls!

When unrest does break out though; most often the first place the marginalized go to seek vengeance is thos elite police lines, fences and walls!

Right On Rafe

I keep thinking what's wrong with people? Why can't they see what a lie tax cuts and "help" for the rich is. What we need is good old fashion socialism to even things out again. I don't mean communism I mean socialism like Tommy Douglas preached. That it's wrong for families to starve while the rich feed off the fat of society. Tax em more I say! End the new era of Robber Barons!