Canada is by World Bank

Canada is by World Bank figures the wealthiest nation on Earth. As "wealth is the control of energy", this means that Canada is also the most powerful nation, together with Australia, yet with huge child poverty figures and a million, many of them "wage earners", lining up at the foodbanks to feed their families.

Meanwhile the kids of the 1% of communist China are racing and tearing up our roads in their Maseratis, Lamorghinis and Aston Martins.

But, according to our "conservatives" this is all part of "competitive wealth creation by foreign investment",not to mention "individualism", meaning the bringing back of our monies we send them to fill our dumps with short lifespan garbage.

Yes, thanks to the priesthood of our so called "economists", brainwashed with fraudulent theories in our universities, and our "conservatives", using their criminal theories to sell off the country from under people's feet, Canada has indeed become a loser country.

The most powerful country on Earth begging for survival from a criminal element, controlling our lives through the gambling casinos of the stockmarkets with their programmed computers, deciding who should eat or stave, and live or die, or what jobs, professions and occupations people may have.

To be "globally competitive", of course, in the race to self destruction.

Like dear Harper is doing right now, promising 500 "wealth creating" mines in the North to send our resources to his brother commies in China and the 15 million slave labour kids in India.

In the name of "prosperity" of course. What Norway is doing, wouldn't be "individualism" at all, but some "left wing" conspiracy against "freedom".

Ed Deak.

What Canada has become.

"Something happened between the mid-'70s and the 1990s. I still haven't figured out what exactly but it happened all over Canada, not just Alberta. I realized that this was no longer my dream country."

Boy, can I testify to that!
I immigrated to Canada in the early fifties and saw my new country as a good choice and satisfied it would prove more beneficial to me, than my mother-country of Denmark.

Let it be known that many new immigrants did not come here because life was desperate elsewhere, it was a deliberate choice, in my case between 3 countries on 3 different continents.

As time passed it has become clear that the voters of this country has managed to spoil the potentials here! Do not blame politicians, they are a power hungry lot that often will sell their soul for a bit of "glory"!

Just like deciding to seek employement at one place, when several choices are present, that step tends to be binding.

By now I could not rearrange my life to fit in any place other than Canada, so all I can state is that I made a poor choice!
I did not count on the place being filled with ignorant people who would vote against their own interest!

Wiborg: Powerful, Refreshing, Deeply Sad

How many years has it been since we've heard this language? When Canada could be great. WAS great. Omigod. This could bring tears to ones eyes if you really think about it.

My god. We really were different in the 1970's. And we have lost SO much. We're now like a beaten dog, skulking around, sniffing for scraps, jumping at the slightest loud noise coming from US corporations and their minions in business suits. Led by Harper, a complete and total sellout to the oil industry (born and raised in Ontario whose father spent his life working for Imperial Oil).

This story is truly another watershed moment in the Tyee's history of journalism.

Bravo!

The points made in the

The points made in the article are all true enough but have a retrospective feel: this is what should have happened years ago.

Looking to the future we desperately need to stop burning fossil fuels. The only justification for developing the tar/oil sands should be as a stop gap measure with profits directed to developing alternatives.

The oil business is probably the most salient example of the way our economy is in direct conflict with our environment. Our big challenge as a species is how to have an economy that co-exists with the environment.

Sounds like

"It is these outside interests that Wiborg sees at play in Canada and Alberta. "There have been lots of plots created south of the border by people who would hate to have a strong Ottawa or strong bureaucracies in the provinces. Not necessarily the U.S. government, but the companies. Think of all the trouble they would have if they couldn't come to Canada and play God and get away with it. It's obvious and it always has been."

Sounds like a 'radical' influence on Canada eh Mr. Harper

a fractured country with a big for sale sign

Interprovincial bickering, elitist power concentrated in faraway places, a country so big only fools would try to run it from a tower in Ottawa. And then the unresolved land claims by First Nations underlines the illegitimacy, the theft, the deceit and the tragic follies that make up our national identity. No wonder we watch so much hockey, the reality of Canadian politics almost makes no sense at all!

Thank you Mr. Wiborg

What an awesome interview to brighten up my Wednesday morning. And thanks to all who agree that this is one great article that should be mandatory reading for all Canadians. Unfortunately most Canadians have contracted the dreaded usavirus which invades the brain and causes an intense focus on "me and especially me getting more money". With articles and comments by Fiat Lux et al I think I can see a revolution coming. It might not be pretty but it will be necessary because the greedy will not share their wealth unless forced to do so. I remember well the UBC motto - Tuum est! And indeed it will be up to each of us. Thank you Tyee.

He is 100% correct

Just what is Canada anyway? Before the arrival of european settlers the land was used and occupied by various aboriginal peoples who had their own tribal economies, culture, systems of governance and normal squabbles. Prior to confederation they primarily allied with the English against the French and the Americans. The 'lands that now constitute Canada' were identified by the imperial power, the United Kingdom, who in turn provided for civil governance by authoring the 1867 Canadian constitution, entrenching UK common law, which all the Provinces essentially joined, which fact continues until today. The 1982 Constitution does little except to add a Charter of Rights and an Amending Formula. The founding peoples of Canada, namely aboriginal, French and English have never come together to make an entirely made in Canada constitution. We are mismanaged by design because the political architecture of authoritarianism which grants enormous, virtually unaccountable powers to the Prime Miniter/Cabinet Ministers and also Provincial Premiers/Cabinet is basically unchecked in times of majoritarian Parliaments/Legislatures.We are running a windows 3.1 'political software' riddled with errors, virus, dysfunctions of interoperability, etc. It is time to the significantly update the Canadian constitution legacy software. But democracy requires both virture and an engaged informed citizenry with the courage and persistent committment to re-design/reinvent a better system of democracy - and I don't think we are at the historical moment yet - and thus we are ruled and disempowered in our own home.

Our inferiority complex

is fueled by our elites colonial mentality. In the early part of our history we or at least our elite were proud to be the first among British colonies. Now our elite is proud to be the closest ally of the new global power.

The arrogance of colonial overseers knows no bounds and the interests of the locals always takes second place to the needs of the "Homeland."

In the brief period following WWII, after the vets returned home, Canadians built a new kind of society in Canada. For 20 years that generation brought in programs we now cherish. Then in the 1970's we got wage and price controls and then the first round of "austerity" measures in Canada started in BC when Mini-Wac adopted the Chicago economic model in the early 80's.

We have been gutting services for nearly thirty years in this province at the same time as the oil and gas industry has thrived under government policies passed for their benefit by every government, irrespective of party. We still allow companies to frack for oil and gas in our province and collect peanuts in return.

I agree we need politicians in Canada that do not adopt a colonial mentality and instead take citizens concerns as a priority. I don't agree that providing bitumen to the world is the way to a better planet although we need to get a better return on the current projects and not allow any further expansion of the filthy tar sands.

love it

That guy's got Viking blood. It's just amazing that we bend over for the oil and mining industries. We've got what they need!

"But I never figured out why

"But I never figured out why such a resource-rich nation would let foreign companies come in and take most of the profits."

Ever since I was a child growing up in a resource-rich town I have wondered the same thing. For a few years in the late 60s or early 70s, workers in that town had the highest per capita wages in all of North America. Yet I thought of my working class family as poor, living in debt from pay cheque to pay cheque.

Like Wiborg, I could never figure out how companies owned the natural resources that should have belonged to the people. And like Wiborg, my conclusion today is that Canadian politicians and bureaucrats have deliberately mismanaged the natural wealth of the nation.

However, unlike Wiborg, who thinks many good politicians "have been failed by their voters", I think it is the other way around. The political class has completely failed the voters, and the result has been electoral apathy, which led to a demagogic dictator winning a federal election in which only 60% of registered voters bothered to vote, and only 39% of them voting for the dictator, who then immediately began to destroy the country.

Of course, Mr. Wiborg is

Of course, Mr. Wiborg is correct, and good for him for speaking out, but he should know that not all Canadians have been duped; many of us have been aware of the resource mismanagement problem for decades. Unfortunately,those quietly in the know are not usually in influential positions.

The problem is, and always has been, how to get the message across to a gullible public - a Herculean task for a number of reasons, including massive media control and a lax education system that doesn't teach critical thinking.

Bias analysis

Hard to find a less accurate and bias analysis using out of context information than this column written by Mitchell Anderson. Everything changed in Canada when Trudeau attempted to pay off his supporters with money from Alberta, who only elected a few Liberal MPs, years before the NEP. Because Lougheed resisted the theft, Trudeau developed the NEP just in time for falling oil prices.

Also I am a Canadian and I own oil company stocks yet Anderson claims that "Canada and the provinces have virtually no equity share of our nation's petroleum production". What he means is that the federal government reliant on Ontario and the BC government hasn't used legislation and taxpayers' money to "buy" equity in Canadian oil production. As for sharing of the benefits, Alberta and Sask are the largest per capita providers to federal equalization funding, so only uninformed Canadians do not know "that developing the tar sands was going to put food on their family's table and take care of their parents when they are sick,".

Rolf has changed lots since we went to the U of A, but most of his comments have been taken out of context by the author to push his own personal bias.

Many years ago

I started investing with Investors Group many years ago. I talked to a financial advisor and decided on some mutual funds to buy for both an RRSP and a couple of RESPs. I chose some that had good returns in the past but had high fees (approximately 2%). Year after year after year it seeme like my investments were mired in the doldrums. At the beginning of both major economic downturns in the last 10 years I wanted to move my investments to something safer but my advisor said "Oh no, you'll lock in your loses". I had a few real dud funds, but my advisor told me great riches were just ahead.

About a year ago, I took a close look at the TSX and realized that it had advanced on average about 2% per year, which explained why my investments were mired in the doldrums....any gains I made were scooped up by Investors Group through their fees.

In the end, I ignored my advisor, pulled my money out and put it into a GIC at 2% per annum. Not a lot, but at least it was something.

So what happened to me was that I was taking all the risk and Investors Group was making all the money...sort of a microcosm of what is happening in BC and Canada. Big industry is making all the money while everybody else takes all the risks.

Peter Dimitrov

The founding peoples of Canada are not only the grouped "aboriginals" and those who traced their origins back to France and England, that is a stretch taught to children to ensure control by southern Ontario and southern Quebec. Like so-called Europeans, aboriginals are not a homogeneous group by people who lived in North America before the Europeans invaded. They looked different from each other (like a Greek and Swede), had different lifestyles and cultures and spoke different languages. As for the French and English, their were just the colonial masters for forming Canada with many other people living in Canada from former black slaves, other Europeans like Germans, Slavics, Spanish and Vikings, plus a sprinkling of Asians. The "founding peoples" concept is racist and is used to keep other ethic groups as second class citizens. The forefathers of ethnic Canadians had as much of a role in building Canada as the "founding peoples". Funny that you don't mention that the northwestern territories was not part of Canada in 1867 and most of northern Ontario and Quebec were not part of those provinces until early in the 20th century.

Corporate greed and destruction

Rolf Wiborg is right about one thing. Politicians have sold out Canada to corporations especially under Mulroney and now Harper. But thinking it's a viable option to develop the tar sands to become a rich nation ignores all the scientific data about climate change. Burning fossil fuels is responsible for much of the increased heat in our atmosphere and according to recent polls 98% of people now realize this to be true. Wiborg is still thinking and speaking like an executive of an oil corporation who can't see past the billions of dollars being made by the industry. He fails to acknowledge that the earth's eco systems can no longer tolerate the huge amounts of CO2 emissions into the atmosphere. Crops are failing around the world as record setting heat causes droughts, wild fires, floods, melting of the ice caps and Wiborg thinks money will somehow make up for that. Just try eating a dollar bill and see if it nourishes your body. In my opinion he's a fool selling snake oil.

There is also propaganda and the media

how many Canadian's go for neo-liberalism and think socialism is a bad word? A few on this board I would imagine. And in Alberta that is all you get where I live we call it Yankee Bullshit. We used to holler yankee go home when we were kids. How about that.
Not nice but right.
RR

Neo-mercantile or what

Too bad the politicians are practically on their knees, begging for foreign investment.

Besides Potash and the Canadarm, when was the last time foreign interests were refused investment takeovers here?

Perhaps it should be called neo-mercantilism.

As when we sent Quebec (New France) logs to France or maritime lumber to Britain (oh yeah, those furs), much like the Voyageurs and First Nations share, compared to the HBC factors and shareholders. Beavers were exterpated from many regions. Or the demise of the Canadian Seamen's union and our large merchant marine after WW2. Seems very little has changed except the magnitude of removing resources for very little relative gain,

John A. had many flaws, but he really tried to get this young nation out of the colonial frame with his National Policy.

Although many conservatives, especially in Alberta, disliked Trudeau, his NEP was established as a unifying force and PetroCan would have been a state owned oil and gas company, much like Statoil.

Mulroney canned it, and with Cretien, began the sell-off process with so-called Free Trade agreements, and with this Harper govternment's accelerated actions, we suckers have been sold out to foreign interests for a few sheckles (or was it a few piecs of silver). Note reduced environmental regulations, dismantling of worker negotiations, lower corporate taxes, etc.

Harper is now pushing all out arctic development, but just who will do the developing, who will be disenfranchised or hurt and what will be the share of benefits to who? Win-win does not divide 80%-20% or more skewed, especially after most risk factors have been externalized.

Just what will be left in the next 50 to 100 years? HBC is now defunct. Those foreign corps will leave very quickly when these non-renewable resources are mostly played out.

Our "problems" are that

Our "problems" are that natural resources are a provincial responsibility, and the national government likes it that way for reasons made clear by other commenters. BUT Alison Redford has suggested the provinces get together to define a national energy policy. We should all be leaping at this (especially the BC NDP, not only because it makes sense, but because Christie Clark has stupidly refused to play). We should at least try to get the provinces to agree to some tough guidelines on royalty rates, and to reinforce their morale not to give in to "competitive" pressures (such as happened when Stelamach proposed relatively minor increases in royalty rates, and the companies said they'd all switch to BC). Time for our politicians to grow up. (I'm not holding my breath, though.)

Our so called "economists"

Our so called "economists" and politicians haven't figured it out yet that when you have resources and assets, you have capital and don't need so called "foreign investments", which are nothing more, or less, than the sale of the country.

I had dozens of bankloans when I was in business, against my assets, but never sold anything and paid off the loans, without anybody lording over me, as these "free trade" racketeers do.

On top of it, much of this "foreign investment" is created from the air by Canadian banks, selling off the country, using imaginary Canadian money.

Brilliant! No wonder "conservatives" want more of it.

Ed Deak.

har, har, har...

"Wiborg feels that Canada's comparatively meek politicians and public servants are allowing billions of dollars to slip through Canada's fingers."

Sorry, I'm not buying the 'meek'. They have no trouble finding their arrogance in responding to impertinent questions from TROC's citizens, who feel they have a stake in the future. Now we with an inquisitive mind are being branded as un-Canadian and subversive.

So, I cannot help thinking, if the 'meek' does not hold water, as it seems not to, then what could motivate these people to undersell Canada's resources?? Think about it.

To Alive: I have been through the same set of reasonings, but to me, it is partly a question of having made my children into Canadians, albeit very sceptical people in this regard. They have never bought the hype. Their patriotism is very localized, in fact centered on the neighborhood. Who said the village is gone?

I have followed assiduously what happens in Denmark, and frankly don't believe I would care to live there today. The Denmark I cherished was the one that could have, but didn't, develop after the 2nd WW. This country (Canada)offers potential for a good life, but mostly for the resourceful. Compared to Denmark, there are so many questions that nobody ever asks you here, so many fences that are not surrounding you, and you can actually build something new on your own. There is plenty of room for the viking-spirit, if you care to educate those around you. So, don't feel bad because you can't go back. Here and now, the only way is up. Every little bit counts, so keep writing!

Scandinavia rocks, Canada sucks!

Dorothy is correct when saying that Denmark failed some of its potentials, however they do look after their people and to me that counts.

Maybe I am burdened with a strong social conscience, so it is not enough that I personally have made good here, because I could have made good many other places where at least my potential fellow citizens gets a decent share of the wealth.

Perhaps the differences lie in the attitude of the citizens? Here it is a dirty word to "admit" to being NDP or heaven forbid a communist!

While in Scandinavia, people recognize that only by working together, as being in a union, can the greedy be held at bay.

It is really silly that the majority of voters feel they are part of the "elite" and so must support the "job-creating" bastards!

The very same people who sell their factories to overseas buyers and thus create jobs elsewhere!

Of all the good comments made here

I think those of Arthur_Rolfs are the most insightful. As I read through the article I felt the lack of empathy by Wiborg for the environment. The "people" of Norway are probably just as environmentally friendly as we are in BC. I come from Alberta where their lack of environmental concern is pathetic. We in BC have the beauty of nature towering over us and so it is more evident that we should care more about our natural surroundings. So do Norwegians, I would think, but it is certainly not evidenced by the thinking of people like Wiborg, or so it seemed to me as I read Anderson's commentary. Having said that however, the bottom line for nearly everybody is their paycheque -- that's why folks from Newfoundland endure the hardships, loneliness and the mosquitoes and move to Fort Mac, and ignore the fact that the product they are producing will eventually destroy all of man-kind. Or to Tumbler Ridge to work the coal mines that end up in China, that will increase the pollution there and make it intolerable for the children to breath clean air.

I don't think Rolf Wiborg

I don't think Rolf Wiborg lacks empathy for the environment at all. He says "they should be allowed to do it but only if they do it right. Protecting the future of Canadian nature and human life, looking out for local residents, providing jobs and wealth to Canada."

The greatest barrier to the approach suggested by Rolf Wiborg is the loose nature of our federation and the ease with which the unscrupulous have capitalized on regional resentments to prevent us from acting together as a nation.

Owning shares in an oil company does not give us control over how the resources are extracted, the rate at which they are extracted, or any control over the supply, and therefore the price of the product. We don't get to create valuable long term infrastructure and expertise in the oil industry, and in other types of technology that could be developed to reduce the environmental impact of developing the resource. It only gives individual Canadians who can afford to own shares in an oil company access to a fraction of the profits, and the tax paying public is left with the responsibility, and the bill for most of the environmental degradation.

In a recent post at Crooked Timber, Henry Farrell pointed out that

"Max Weber, who thought long and hard about how to resolve an ethic of Nietzschean self-realization with the everyday realities of politics emphasized that the true political vocation lay in the reconciliation of heroic ends with the often sordid realities of political struggle and bargain-making."

I think Trudeau and Peter Lougheed were the last politicians in Canada to fit that description. It's too bad they couldn't work together. If I am pessimistic about the future for Canada it's because there is so much needless ignorance and misunderstanding from region to region. I've lived in just about every region of Canada except the north, and we have far more in common than we have differences, but the suspicion and prejudice one encounter from region to region is staggering.
Quebec seems to be the only part of the country truly capable of acting like a nation, and they threw in their lot with the rest of us in the last election, in record numbers. Maybe that's a hopeful sign.

All these problems and the

All these problems and the inevitable disaster that's coming are caused by the teaching and use of the fraudulent neoclassical market economic theory forced into our universities and then on the public some 40 years ago, replacing realities with imaginary figures.

This is basically the same religious belief, without any logically acceptable reality, that sends suicide bombers to blow up the "infidels" of the same religion to earn a fast trip to heaven.

There won't be any change, or improvement, until this criminal theory and its effects are wiped out once and for all for the benefit of the human race.

We can't have 2 opposite, contradictory definitions of "efficiency" within the same system, designed to have imaginary figures overrule realities for the benefit of a dictatorial power elite, and get away with it.

The presently ruling economic system is just another religious war to enslave humanity, as so many others before in history.

Ed Deak.

Amen

"You can't export the Norwegian system without exporting the thinking that goes with it. You have to give up this idea that someone else has the right to tell you what to do with your resources or how your society should run. It's bullshit. You want to come to our country and produce our resources? Then you play by our rules. You sign here or you leave."

This guy has it exactely right. In Alberta I am reminded of the Beverley Hillbillies almost every day.
Since Trudeau, our last strong and idealistic leader, Canada has been sold and Canadians have bought into the great American corporatist ideal of money is everything and more money is more better. It's taught in our schools and preached from the pulpit. Those who disagree and say so are criminalised. And as the man says we now have this Faustain bargain of jobs or service, but the foreign shareholder is not to be bothered.
The thinking is revolutionary. We need a revolution.

ranger... This is exactly the

ranger... This is exactly the point I've been making about our monetary system, which is now a typical pseudo religion, where realities are replaced by imaginary figures, used to colonize and enslave.

The issue is not whether we should have money. We obviously should. I've experienced life when money was worthless and it was hell.

But in the present, fraudulent system, a special interest sector is permitted and legalized to "create" unlimited amounts of imaginary money from the air to be used as an overruling weapon against humanity and the ecology.

Until humanity comes to grips with this criminal reality and replaces this fraudulent, imaginary system with another, based on realities, there are many theories and plans on how to do this, there`s absolutely no hope and humanity will be enslaved and destroyed.

Ed Deak.

Rolf Wiborg's Tough Love For Canada

Canada needs a nationalist party.

Wiborg's recommendations for what to do in our oil industry are excellent. But remember, Tyee, that Canada is being betrayed not just by sleazy oil companies and our quisling political class.

It is also being betrayed by our mass immigration lobby and their supporters. For 20 years, Canada has been taking an average of about 250,000 immigrants. Ottawa has never provided any sensible justification for taking all these people. It has been madness to allow this policy to continue through 3 serious economic downturns, particularly the last one.

Remember this, Tyee : Nationalist policies don't end with standing up against oil companies. They also mean standing up for Canada's unemployed. You have been negligent in the latter.

For details, see www.ImmigrationWatchCanada.org

Ed, when I read your comments

Ed, when I read your comments regarding universities the more I understand the implications of what our educational institutes are up to. Like the $15 million donation to Carleton University by a Calgary businessman for a Graduate Program in Political Management; with strong ties to Preston Manning. The donation guranteed who gets to decide course content and who is hired to instruct.

I was exposed to asbestos as a teen in my place of employment and have an interest in what goes on with this industry.

Recently I came across an article concerning McGill University and Dr.John Corbett McDonald and his ties to the Asbestos Industry. There appears to be a documented history of the Asbestos Industry manipulating medical professionals and medical evidence. Asbestos companies have been doing this at McGill since the 1930s.

Ties between universities and unethical corporations are not new.

Hmmmm, No is NOT the answer?

"The tar sands is all about providing secure supply for the people south of the border. And they should be allowed to do it but only if they do it right."

No should very seldom be the main option. Doing it right makes far more sense.

It usually can be done right.

We are a country of

We are a country of rubes.
Who else would sit on their hands and let foreign interests screw them so badly.

Maybe

I can explain The Tyee's negligence to Daniel Murray:

I move a lot in union circles, but am always the odd one out, for I am not an NDP'er, but I know that being anti-immigration, at least at the insane rates we are dealing with now is considered the next thing, no, it's considered synonymous with being racist, fascist, nationalist (whatever is suddenly wrong with that), and generally worthy of contempt. I don't know if it is impossible to make it understandable to people, that we have an obligation to leave something worth having to our children. There is a blockheaded do-gooder thing built into the heads of most socialists, which will sometimes turn out strange things. I remeber in a forum having a discussion about the labor movements in poor countries and how we could help them. Some people had it in their heads that we should share, that we should make do with less so that there could be more for them, equalization was the idea. I couldn't help saying that I could not see we helped anybody by averaging, so we would all be equally poor and powerless. Rather I thought we should keep our own labor movement strogn (and wealthy if you will) so we could truly give sombody a helping hand in the way of education and perhaps our presence if warranted, as well as funding for specific projects. I am in ageement with Saul Alinsky on this one. Maybe also with Niccolo Machiavelli, but that's OK. He is not the monster people would have him be.

Likewise, trying to speak for limiting immigration is seen as an unwillingness to share the supposed wealth by excluding others from 'getting in'. I have had it thrown in my face that OK, of course I was against further immigration, now that I had 'got a place at the table'. Actually, I pay my dues and came with my own resources, but aside from that, there is a rational reality in this, which is over and above any partisan and possibly self-serving notions. We invite people into Canada today, whom we cannot offer a real future. That is not cool.

To alive:

Yeah, there is that about taking care of people. But I guess it was all too 'finished' for my taste. I have not grown up with much taking care of, but rather were made to understand that this was my own job. I think I found life in Denmark too circumscribed, and so the wide open spaces in Canada, both metaphorically and practically, is something I really cherish.

We could grow more civilized, and I am fascinated to see this happening. So many issues that were not even on the table, when I arrived here have now been picked up and churned into bits and are being put together in new ways. Whenever something is burning, people come out. They use their voice, and they find likeminded people, and they do something together. In denmark, the saying was that you could not get people out for a demonstration if it rained or was too close to a mealtime.

I will not agree that Canada sucks, or if it does it's up to us to change that. Scandinavia is good, but the best thing about it is that you can go out in the world and be scandinavian, and things will go well for you. Settle down and clean things up, and share your thoughts with others. I work with colleagues from all over the World, and we have furious (but never nasty)discussions about culture and politics. .

The following quote is from the introduction to 'The culure of the Teutons' by Wilhelm Groenbech. It neatly accounts for your social conscience.

"This firmness of spiritual organization which characterises the Northman as a personality is no less evident in his social life. Wherever he goes, he carries within himself a social structure which manifests itself in definite political forms as soon as he is thrown together with a crowd of others speaking the same tongue. He is not of that inarticulate type which forms kaleidoscopic tribal communities. However small his people may be, and however slight the degree of cohesion between its component molecules, the social consciousness is always present and active. He is a people in himself, and has no need of building up an artificial whole by the massing of numbers together."

http://www.northvegr.org/secondary%20sources/religion%20culture%20history/the%20culture%20of%20the%20teutons/001.html

Honnest to Goodness, where do you see a whole section of town filled with mostly Scandinavians? I think the man has it right.

Rolf Wiborg

Rolf Wiborg for Prime Minister !! Please.

About a social conscience

Sorry to occupy these pages with this interchange.

Since the article is about the different ways two countries have choosen to handle their rescources and the consequences thereof, I feel on that subject indeed Canada sucks!

Obviously if Denmark had filled my every goal, I would hardly have bothered to immigrate.

Wilhelm Groenbech leaves me high and dry, I am not a poetry person, rather a hands-on type who observes what is happening around me (and have no problem speaking up when it irritates me).

About Canada: I too was fascinated with the wide open spaces etc., but when you then see the "dirty side" of it all, you begin to wonder why the wealthiest country in the world has to abandon its citizens to poverty and misery?

Let's not forget that Denmark has absolutely no natural rescources, but still manages to survive and have a thriving industry.

Yes, There were many who left for Great Brittain to avoid the taxes on their factories and ventures, but just like Norway, Denmark also maintained that the good of the people come before any easing of regulations to the rich.

As an aside I agree that both countries have shot themselves in the foot by their immigration policies not to mention the refuge problem.

Again a country simply has to be more concerned about its citizens that some sweatshop owners need for cheap labour.

As a European born immigrant,

As a European born immigrant, survived the depression and as a WW2 vet, I've left that human zoo after 7 years at Cambridge, and never returned even for a visit.

What Canada has are the 2 "R"s, "Room and Resources"

We`ve left Vancouver after 24 years, Where we had a business and brand new home, when it started become a disgusting mess, already in the 70s. My wife haven`t been back since 1979 and since 1988, when I had to deliver something I`ve built.

What we`ve established here is the highest degree of self sufficiency, with the highest degree of individualism and independence almost impossible in most parts of the world, but very much so here in Canada.

We can see and, having lived under every ideology, understand, what is going on in the world, ruled by a criminal class, calling themselves "conservatives", but here we can look at it from a bird's eye view, once again, almost impossible anywhere else, but still very much so here in BC.

One of these days people will wake up and this will becom a Paradise on Earth.

Ed Deak.

Thank you som much, Ed!

This is really what I was trying to say. Can't brag of having reached a super degree of self-sufficiency, but my family and I do deal in unorthodoxy in our approach to many of life's tasks. I would have liked to leave the big city, but the mix of job and family health makes it darn near impossible. I do have plans for the future, though, and I do believe in it just as you do.

There's no need for thousands

There's no need for thousands of words. What happened was the forcing of the neoclassical theory on our universities and then on the public, topped up by the deregulation of the banks.

"Wealth can not be created only taken from others the environment and future generations."

What all the complaints and horror stories are about is "wealth creation".

The communists have been doing it with weapons, the capitalists with the "creation" of imaginary money.

Ed Deak.

Norway's Perfect--not quite!!

So Norway controls the petroleum industry to benefit it's people.
However Norway is not above destroying the environment in other countries or making money from this destruction. What about the Norweigian Fish Farming industry which is and has destroyed environments in Scotland, Chile, and Canada to name a few countries.

Norway's Perfect--not quite!!

Norway is able to control the Petrochemical Industry in order to benefit it's citizens.
However Norway also exploits other countries lax environmental regulations for profit. Norweigian Fish Farms have or are destroying the environment and fishing industries in Scotland, Chile and Canada to name a few countries.

Fish farms are just another

Fish farms are just another form of "wealth creation", similar to thousands of other rackets, and very good examples of "taking"

Ed Deak.

Doormat

Stephen Harper treats Canada like a doormat for Chinese and American oil companies. The "man" is a coward and a traitor. The people who voted for him are fools. We need a leader who works for Canadians, not for oil companies.