Opinion

James Risks All By 'Riding It Out'

NDP leader should consider resigning and declaring a leadership convention this spring.

By Rafe Mair, 18 Oct 2010, TheTyee.ca

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The NDP is in deep trouble, which is good news for the Liberals and for any fledgling party of the "centre." Whether or not the NDP is in terminal trouble, in the sense of being probable losers in the next election, depends upon what they do now.

Bob Simpson's criticism of Carole James and subsequent heave-ho from caucus reminds me of Bill Bennett in the late '70s when just before the annual convention, the late Jack Kempf -- the bombastic backbencher MLA from "the great consistency of Omineca," as he would boom -- criticized the premier, closing with "Bennett had better 'pull his socks up'."

Bennett said nothing, but when he took the microphone at the convention, he ostentatiously bent down and pulled his socks up. It brought the house down! Problem thus dealt with.

The NDP has not got just one MLA pissed off but the party, always loosely kept together, is having a very bad case of indigestion. This is due to the leadership, or rather as they see it, lack of leadership, from Carole James. I know Ms. James and like her. She's bright and not a bad speaker. What she doesn't have is that streak of vindictiveness and belly-deep anger so necessary in our system. She has no killer instinct. Those things are not nice and hardly indicate good character, but they are essential.

Why James is channeling Skelly

Carole James is in the mould of Bob Skelly, the former NDP leader in the '80s, who wanted to make the legislature a better place with civilized polite debate. This is a most admirable ambition, but it's never going to happen as long as MLAs have no power, all of which rests in the premier's office. This fact makes debate useless and, for the opposition, gut wrenching. Because backbench NDP MLAs have seen Ms. James being a pussycat, not a fiery leader, they've seen the government get away with murder. They understand that they can't stop the government, but they want to protest, and do so in terms their constituents can relate to. With the mainstream media putty in the hands of the government, backbench frustration has reached the point where NDP MLAs see their party get whacked about, without the leader fighting back.

It's not James's fault that she is a conciliator, not a mixed martial arts person -- in fact, she should be praised for her decency. Unfortunately, her character is utterly unsuited to her job, as it was for Mike Harcourt. Harcourt was used to scandals always being associated with Socreds, and when he saw that his own party was mired in scandal (the so-called 'Nanaimogate'), he couldn't stomach what he saw and stepped down. Which is what Carole James must do if she wants to see the NDP in power in 2013.

There is precedent for this.

In 1986, Bill Bennett, seeing that even with his baby Expo 86 being a huge success, read the polls and saw he was very unpopular (he was never liked by the public, but admired). He stepped down in the interests of the party, which then won the election that fall.

On the federal scene, in 1983 Joe Clark saw that he was unpopular especially amongst backbenchers, and, not getting enough support to satisfy him, calIed a leadership convention and lost to Brian Mulroney, who won by a landslide the following year.

Learning from Vander Zalm

What happens if a leader tries to "ride it out" is clear in the Vander Zalm case.

From the outset of his leadership, Vander Zalm was in trouble. At the 1986 convention in Whistler, I was on Bill Good's CBC TV (ironically, given our later mutual dislike), and I said that if Vander Zalm was elected, he would destroy the party within two years, which was exactly what happened.

By the fall of 1988, Vander Zalm had lost two major cabinet ministers, Grace McCarthy and Brian Smith, and then saw five backbenchers leave caucus.

The Social Credit constitution called for a leadership review by secret ballot. When the October 1988 party convention was held, the "old guard" played a trick and moved that the question as to whether or not there should be a leadership review be put to an open vote. Delegates opposed to Vander Zalm were reluctant to vote yes publicly, so the motion failed and Vander Zalm was saved. But the party wasn't. Things went from bad to worse, and the Socreds were smashed in the election of 1991.

Inevitably, when an unpopular leader hangs on it gets worse and worse. Experience ought to tell party president Moe Sihota that once the wheels fall off either you stop, repair, then start again, or the vehicle crashes. This is the stark reality facing the NDP, a situation made worse by James's overreaction to Bob Simpson's remarks.

Carole James ought to announce her resignation as party leader and call a leadership convention for the spring.

In my judgment, this won't happen. With Moe Sihota leading the pack, James will stick it out. She will be told that the majority of caucus support her, which might be true, but insufficiently so for the leader to be able to make tough, controversial decisions.

Parties of the left are generally made up of various groups, none of which like one another much, but will come together, loosely, at election time. One only has to see an NDP leadership convention to see the open fissures within the party. This means that at the very best of times, an NDP leader has trouble providing the glue that keeps the party together. All political parties have factions, but none so fractious as in the NDP.

Why Libs are rooting for James

If James stays on it's manna from heaven for the Liberals, unless they too tough it out with Campbell. His unpopularity is not only substantially great but permanent. In my judgment, there is nothing he can do to be popular again. It's like my mom would say if I got jilted: "You can never fan the coals of a dead romance." My sense of it is that Bill Bennett, with whom Campbell maintains friendly contact I'm told, will advise him to put the party first, leave for one of the cushy energy jobs he likely carries in his hip pocket, and call a leadership convention for the spring of 2011, leaving someone like Mike de Jong in charge in the meantime.

There is another scenario here which may be played out -- the arrival of a new party in the centre. The window of opportunity is only a few months, but it's there. What is needed is a credible leader who has the necessary stomach for B.C.-style politics and can rally and lead people. As I have said before, the Conservative party revival is on the wrong side of the political spectrum and, to make it worse, the leading names for the Tories are political washouts and have the political appeal of a dog who has just encountered a skunk.

Hold onto your hats, folks -- politics has always been blood-soaked and fun to watch.

As the old vaudevillian hoofer and comic Jimmy Durante said, "you ain't seen nothin' yet".*

*Sorry baby boomers, Bachman Turner Overdrive said it much, much later. [Tyee]

Rafe Mair's column runs every second Monday on The Tyee. Find his previous Tyee columns here and more of his writings on The Common Sense Canadian.

67 Comments:

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  • Bobby Peru

    1 year ago

    NDP Scorched Earth Platform

    Rafe Mair, Tielman and Allan Garr are hold over dinosaurs of the old, labour union dominated NDP that wanted to kill the rich and anyone else who opposed their drive to show us their version of the workers' paradise. It is they who must leave the political scene because they are out of touch with the economy and the people who make up today's BC.

    Most working BC people aren't in govt or resource based unions (that have declined in membership over the last 30 years) and don't necessarily buy into the well worn slogan peddled by the thuggish union back room boys that the NDP is the sole saviour of working people. It's evident to everyone that the NDP is the political arm of govt unions.

    The NDP's old ways are worn out and tired. Carol James represents a ray of hope to middle class, middle of the road voters who might believe that the party can reform itself and truly demonstrate it is a genuine alternative to the Liberals. That means the party needs to elaborate an economic and business platform that shows voters that the NDP believes that private sector wealth creation is the key to economic growth. And that it is a good thing for society.

    Instead, everyone can see the NDP diehards accuse her of "sucking up" to business. The fact is that many BC'ers need their jobs and can't afford the NDP to return to the old Glen Clark, bullying ways that turned BC into a have not province. But, even after several years as leader she hasn't been able to articlulate a business policy. And the rest of the party continues to watch reruns of solidarity marches from the 80s.

    No, the last thing the NDP needs is another old, white guy, street brawler, union thug leader who is looking to tear up BC and scare away investment and jobs. If you elect one of those the words "Glen Clark" will resonate again. The NDP needs a leader who can purge the disparate and non-sensible interest groups from its ranks and move the party towards the middle.

  • P. Markunas

    1 year ago

    Rafe Mair

    zzzzzzzzzzzz....

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    Bobby Peru

    The NDP has already moved to the middle, why don't you? As Campbell's support is so low it includes only friends and family one has to ask if you're Campbell's nephew?

    I assume you don't remember Rafe Mair was a cabinet minister in a Social Credit government and was never part of the NDP.

    As for who was responsible for turning BC into a have-not province, that would be Alberta. If Alberta didn't exist there would be fewer "have-not" provinces. Besides, it was Campbell who got the cheques for our have-not status, why not ask him where the money went?

    We're deeper in debt than ever, poverty rose, wages fell, services deteriorated. That's the kind of management only the right-wing can consistently deliver and explains why the Liberal brand is at 24%.

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    Rafe

    "Parties of the left are generally made up of various groups, none of which like one another much, but will come together, loosely, at election time"

    That is no longer the case. Many so-called leftists spend more time attacking the NDP than they do the Liberals and they don't show up on election day. Which of course means they are not part of the NDP nor of any left-wing "alliance".

    The NDP is a political vehicle, nothing more, and it is the vehicle of those that support it, no one else.

  • offended

    1 year ago

    For once I agree with Rafe.

    Carole James bores me to tears. She talks too much and says nothing. Kinda like a crummy TV show. Background noise. Not inspiring at all.

    Time for a change.

  • Crass

    1 year ago

    to Bobby Peru... Just

    to Bobby Peru...
    Just because your party, the BC Liberals, are completely dead in the water, don't expect the NDP to suddenly turn around and accommodate your vote by endorsing what you want: "private sector wealth creation is the key to economic growth. And that it is a good thing for society."
    But with Carole James at the helm, you just may have your way.

  • Camero409

    1 year ago

    bobby Peru

    EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULTS -- TYEE MODERATOR so far right they're almost out of sight. If anyones days are old and worn out it's Gordo and the boys. I have lived in BC since 1948 and never have I seen such destructive policies implemented in BC. Not even in Bill Bennetts worst days have things looked so black. It's time BP, (hmmm interesting acronym) for you and the rest of the far right to immigrate to the US and join the Republicans.

  • Fiat lux

    1 year ago

    There's a tremendous

    There's a tremendous difference between the real "private sector" and the collectivizing crime wave by the oligopolic multinational corporate mafia destroying the Earth and humanity with their power of deregulated money creation, used as weapons of colonization and enslavement.

    There's also a big difference between "jobs" that pay decent living wages and the part timer, minimum wage "jobs, jobs, jobs" the norm for our so called "globally competitive economy", with obscene profits to the corporations and the executives stealing multimillion salaries from the public's pockets

    So, where are the politicians to point out this crime wave going on all over the world ? All we can see are pimps dancing around the facts and issues, hoping for directorships with the biggest crooks.

    Ed Deak.

  • RickW

    1 year ago

    Rafe says:

    Quote:
    it's never going to happen as long as MLAs have no power, all of which rests in the premier's office

    And strangely enough, this "power" Rafe alludes to can only be exercised when the premier has the support of "lesser beings" (aka sycophants). In other words, the gang leader can only be boss when others are willing to do his bidding.

  • RickW

    1 year ago

    Fiat Lux

    Excellent point (as usual)! And here is something to backup your statement about win-win amongst the modern-day oligarchs:
    http://www.theledger.com/article/20101018/ZNYT01/10183000/1001/BUSINESS?Title=Banks-Shared-Clients-x2019-Profits-but-Not-Losses

    Quote:
    Banks Shared Clients’ Profits, but Not Losses

    I imagine though, that Bobby Peru would applaud this "astute business sense".

  • Jeffrey J.

    1 year ago

    Incisive As Usual, Rafe

    Rafe's knack for plain talking and plain writing is such a pleasure (and such a rarity). He nails the issues right on the money, replete with specific historical examples that are essential if we are ever to understand human events.

    His explanation about the bubbling unrest in the NDP and citizenry is about the best description I've read. I do think the NDP should address this issue head on, which ultimately means the opportunity to rethink the leadership.

    Excellent coverage.

  • Fiat lux

    1 year ago

    This could be the best thing

    This could be the best thing that happened to the NDP, provided there are people who know how to make use of the opportunity to wake up, not only the NDP, but the whole public on how they're being taken to the cleaners with the destruction of real democracy.

    Ed Deak. .

  • alive

    1 year ago

    need left-wing party

    Yes, the NDP has moved to the centre!
    Hence another centre party is not what is called for, but a new left-wing party!

    It is stupid to say that there is no need for a workers party, since work still is what most people do.

    It is natural that it should represent union and non-union workers and their cause ----- exclusively!

    The neo-cons openly support the wealthy, so it is natural that the poor should have representation as well.

    Unfortunately the NDP has dropped the ball here, so the left-wing spot is vacant.

  • seth

    1 year ago

    "She's bright" Bullshit

    The woman is dumber than bag of hammers. Everything she says is programmed into by her handlers, and then she repeats the dogma like an mp3 player getting buttons pushed. That's why she is sooooo boring, persuades union members to stay home on election night and gets routinely taken apart by nobodies like Bill Good. There is a reason she never got past high school - she was incapable.

    In the last election, all the polls were showing its the economy stupid - the last word directed straight at the retarded Carole. The electorate viewed Canwest/Gordo as being much better at maintaining the economy, when the facts were the opposite - do something about that Hello Knock Knock anybody there. Rafe himself, Will McMartin, and the Tyee and its commentors gave the severly challenged Carol all the ammo needed, showing economic performance was much better under Glen Clark.

    What better schtick than extolling the virtues of the Canwest/Gordo business plan - make BCHydro buy $65B in power from bis stockbroker buddies at 12.5 cents a kwh and sell it on the Columbia grid for three cents daytime and give it away free at night.

    Has Carole James ever even once from before the election campaign started, to today ever said anything about this - on Bill Good, in any interview, in a debate, anywhere?

    One of the most sexest comments I see on Carol explains it all away as she is a woman and thus has a differents style. What - Carole Taylor, Christy Clark, Jane Sterk, Hillary Clinton aren't women? They'd take Gordo apart with this.

    Nope Carole's nice schtick is simple cowardice. She is too stupid to engage in debate so pretends it is all too rough for her. Please don't beat me up I'm so nice.

  • stver

    1 year ago

    James Risks All

    Yeah Rafe, the NDP is in real trouble. They're at 48% in the polls, while the Libs are are at 24%. It's a disaster for the NDP. Give me break!!Sure some of the right wing vote is moving over to the Greens, but as soon as people realize that the Greens support the HST, their numbers will dissipate as well. Meanwhile Campbell's poll numbers are beginning to match his blood alcohol level.
    Rafe, the three points that you miss regarding Carol James are:
    1. Who is your replacement for Carol James? Sounds like Gregor is more interested in Federal politics with the Liberals, so there goes his accreditation as an NDPer. Who else is there?
    2. The media in this Province is so right wing any leader of the NDP is going to be crucified. The Vancouver Sun, The Province and The Corus Redneckwork are so blatantly in the Liberals camp it is impossible to get the message out there. So who within the party is going to penetrate that barrier? and
    3. I think you forget that on a leader to leader basis, Carol James has out campaigned Campbell in both the 2005 and 2009 elections. Sure, the campaign managers screwed up by not having a focused strategy, but Carol James for her part performed well.

  • Cool Hand

    1 year ago

    Pandora's Box

    Quote:
    Carole James is in the mould of Bob Skelly

    That's on the mark. Both are/were seen as flakey, uninspiring and school marmish. Bob Simpson has already received his scolding from Carole. MLA Norm MacDonald didn't like what he saw and stepped down as caucus chair.

    At least Bob Skelly saw the writing on the wall and stepped down for the good of the party. Interesting to note that the NDP under Skelly had a higher level of popular support in 1986 than Carole has ever achieved.

    It seems that Moe has now placed visions of grandeur in Carole's head. With a 25% spread over the Liberals (or is it actually 9% according to Mustel?) Carole and Moe think it's a done deal for 2013. Yep. With Carole only at a 27% approval rating compared to ARS' 49% party support that's called vote parking, which is very soft/tepid support.

    It will be just as easy for that vote parking to shed once the political dynamic has changed à la Campbell stepping down and replaced by either Taylor or Watts. As Rafe succinctly points out, one can point to similar fact evidence in the resignation of Bennett during July 1986. Carole will never be able to close the deal under those circumstances.

    The problem with the NDP is that Pandora's Box has now been opened in terms of Carole's leadership (or lack thereof) from various factions of the party and that will continue to linger and fester. The political narrative has shifted as a result.

    As the recent internal BC party executive meeting notes point out, NDP membership is below 10,000 (compared to 13,000 when Carole took over in 2003) and the NDP is on financial life support only sustaining itself through estates - that is, people dying and leaving a portion of their will to the NDP.

    1. Is that a political party exuding dynamism and optimism?
    2. If factions within the NDP don't believe that James is leadership material should BC'ers?
    3. If the NDP can't get it's own financial house in order, should BC'ers expect that it can get BC's finances in order as government?
    4. If James dumps former Liberals like Simpson should former Liberal supporters expect the same if they support the NDP thereby further shrinking the NDP's potential pool of voters?

    At the end of the day the James/Sihota combo are the NDP's biggest Achilles' heel.

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    Humpty Dumpty ?...

    Well, this story certainly has legs, as they say.

    Though I do disagree with Rafe in his conclusion that Carole is The Problem. My view, of course, is that it runs much deeper into the culture of the late, post CCF NDP, and its evolution into a second Liberal Party, a party of capitalism like any other currently in the system.

    Frank is at least partly correct:

    "That is no longer the case. Many so-called leftists spend more time attacking the NDP than they do the Liberals and they don't show up on election day. Which of course means they are not part of the NDP nor of any left-wing "alliance"." Frank.

    Though actually, this is a fairly recent development, beginning here on Tyee perhaps even, I don't know. And this is because after many years of the Left rather uncritically at least voting NDP, there is a sense in our milieu that the times really have changed... And over the course of that, while a more militant working class and other progressive response, including environmentalists, is called for, the NDP has shifted more radically to the centre-right and seeks to firmly root itself in the status quo.

    In short, it has entirely abandoned its CCF founding "reformist" raison d'etre, and is of no further use or hope to us on The Left, and a growing body of those "progressives" who don't particularly consider themselves "Left" as well.

    This country needs another party of the centre-right like we all need another body orifice.

    The problem with the NDP is NOT Carole, per se. And to insist that it is, is to miss the depth of analysis that is really needed here, if the NDP is to be salvaged. And my hope is that it will be. And without this depth of analysis, merely blemish hiding cosmetic changes will be made to the party, which may or may not work briefly, in the absence of other real electoral choices for the masses, one cannot know. Because there is a desperation in the province, for sure, for something... anything.

    But what is clear to me, is that if this is the course chosen by the NDP as a whole, there is only a relatively brief lifespan left to the party. Indeed, it MAY not be them that fills the desperation void in the end, but resurgent Socreds, already seeking to re-position themselves as the "private enterprise" alternative to the Liberals. They really are Blairites, at a changed time when Blairites are almost universally reviled. In which case, the NDP is even sooner charred toast, in my view.

    But as I've always said, there is a rapidly emerging need in the province, and indeed the country, for a more radical, distinct, serious Party of The Left, as well as Progressives out of the environmental and progressive nationalist movements etc. If the NDP cannot be re-branded to fill this need, then it will simply have to be found or created elsewhere. And it is appearing more and more like it will have to be elsewhere.

    The NDP is reading more and more like another tragic Humpty Dumpty story.

  • Stewart MacKenzie

    1 year ago

    "Harcourt was used to

    "Harcourt was used to scandals always being associated with Socreds, and when he saw that his own party was mired in scandal (the so-called 'Nanaimogate'), he couldn't stomach what he saw and stepped down."

    Interesting that Dave Barrett and Bob Williams, who did have a huge part in "Nanaimogate" got to see their proteges Sihota and Clark take over the party after Mike, who bore absolutely no blame, stepped down.

    "Parties of the left are generally made up of various groups, none of which like one another much, but will come together, loosely, at election time. One only has to see an NDP leadership convention to see the open fissures within the party. This means that at the very best of times, an NDP leader has trouble providing the glue that keeps the party together. All political parties have factions, but none so fractious as in the NDP."

    Harcourt understood the necessity of keeping all the factions working together and personally participated in some of the more fractious discussions among labour, environmental and other interests. He was able to encourage us to work to find common ground and drew our better qualities out rather than trying to dictate. Mike could influence that kind of discussion subtly and positively, and when he resigned there was noone with his qualities to take over. Instead of working with all factions, Clark and Sihota chose to pick winners and losers, insiders and outsiders, within the party. When the Green Caucus saw the writing on the wall many left to become Green Party activists.

    Carole James' problem is not that she is too nice, it is that as leader she appears autocratic and as a public figure she seems programmed, robotic, and inconsistent as she reads whatever script of the day her handlers have handed her.

  • sunshine coast girl

    1 year ago

    What is the matter with us,

    that we have to bring Sihota back into the fold? What's happening in the party has his name stamped all over it!

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    I know that a few attempts

    I know that a few attempts have been made over relatively recent years, to bring together folks to explore the possibility of forming an alrernative party of the Left and progressive environmental and nationalist, poverty and womens groups. I'm assuming in the absence of evidence to the contrary that this did not in fact, on those occassions, prove possible. (Though I am quite out of it all geographically.)

    That said, IF there was enough interest in its potential usefulness, at least, I would be prepared to attend such exploratory discussions in some suitably centralized location. Though I fear it may still be some premature. In any case, discussions about the notion should be being going on already amongst individuals and interested groups, as part of a longer term preparing the way for such an attempt.

    coyote.mann@yahoo.com

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    coyote

    "And this is because after many years of the Left rather uncritically at least voting NDP"

    According to wiki that didn't happen. Much of the Left has stayed home for most of the last 20 years.

    And I agree with you its time for a new left-wing party instead of people complaining the NDP isn't what they want.

    After all, the Right has 2 parties, and if you count the Greens, 3.

  • the real ODB

    1 year ago

    stver & Bobby Peru

    Numbers don't mean a thing. The NDP should have won the '05 election after what the LIEberals did in their first 4 years of destruction. Sure, the NDP won lots of seats (they only had 2 to lose!), but did nothing in the next 4 years and ended up in the same spot. The Opposition. Same thing in '09. Time for change. As for a bunch of "Union Hacks" running the place-right on! Better that than some suit bending us over the barrel!

  • edoherty

    1 year ago

    It's the climate crisis stupid

    What is messing from this discussion is the fact that Carole James is seen by many to be a de-facto climate change denier. That is acceptable on the right, but it a huge drag on NDP credibility. So far the only environmental waves James has made are to oppose the carbon tax and flip flop back and forth on freeway expansion. These would be great positions for the leader of the provincial Conservatives, but not the NDP.

    Any NDP leader needs to have a credible position on the climate crisis, otherwise a crucial percentage of voters and campaign volunteers will stay home (or vote green).

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    The Chosen One...

    "And I agree with you its time for a new left-wing party instead of people complaining the NDP isn't what they want.

    After all, the Right has 2 parties, and if you count the Greens, 3." Frank.

    Welll, if we also count the NDP, 4. :-) Such as I do. lol

    But it's true, when the time is right... there needs to be a serious and credible party of the left, as I describe it; including Green Party disgruntled environmentalists, progressive nationalists, poverty groups, workers, progressive intelligentsia and such. I'm convinced it will happen. At issue is "when".

    No wine should be drunk before its time however. Attempting to "force" anything, certainly such a political development as the creation of a new party of the left, would almost lead to disappointment.

    Still, we do need to be ever testing the wind and discussing it as broadly as we can.

    What is not needed is another little vanguard ragtag bunch calling itself a party, running about on the fringes of the times, attempting to claim it is The Chosen One. :-)

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    coyote

    The NDP is the right political vehicle for a lot of us but one party can't be everything to everyone. I'd rather see new parties exist than see the NDP fall in support to the level of the Libs, Conservatives and Greens.

    The NDP won in 1991 because it was led by a federal Liberal who didn't scare people. Whether Gordon Wilson had appeared on the scene to split the vote or not the NDP would still have defeated Social Credit.

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    Luke

    Bob Skelly was a compromise between the left and right wings of the party. Each knew their own guy, Bill King and David Vickers, couldn't get the support of the other side.

    And like all compromise candidates he didn't appeal much to either. But then I don't have to tell that to a Liberal. How's Stephane Dion doing by the way?

  • G West

    1 year ago

    Bingogate/nanaimo gate = Bullshit

    There was nothing whatever scandalous obout what the party did relative to the Nanaimo Commonwealth Holdings Society - just like Glen's deck, it was a Gordon Campbell created false flag operation designed to push HIS agenda.

    The man is a black cloud on BC politics and public life - the best thing he could do is announce on the 27th that he's out of here. At 9% even Gordon can't have avoided THAT message.

    With Basi Virk over, he has no reason to stick around now - his ass isn't on the line any longer and he won't need the public purse to pay his legal bills.

  • Driftwood

    1 year ago

    Good Call Rafe!

    You say,'If James stays on it's manna from heaven for the Liberals', and the first poster out of the gate is a known liberal shill who calls James 'a ray of hope to the middle class.' and then proceeds to bash the very party she represents - almost as though it were pure accident that she finds herself the leader of such a band of 'union thugs.' So by his own logic he proves that Carole is the wrong person to lead the NDP and by his embrace of James he proves your point that James' staying on is indeed manna for the lying liberals.

    So the BC Rail trial has been called off! First, they stretch it out for 7 years hoping everyone would lose interest. Then when no more delays are available the liberal insiders make a plea bargain to prevent the damning details of just who was involved from being broadcast throughout the province. All we know, given the guilty verdict IS THAT THE DEAL WAS ILLEGAL and therefore NOT BINDING. I think we should get our railroad back!
    But the Liberals, being the guilty party, won't call an enquiry.
    So, while I agree with Rafe that there could be a better leader for the NDP, I think you're all wrong on tactics. 'Little more to the left there. No let's get aligned more to the center!' Meanwhile in other parts of the world ordinary people march in the streets until they get a real voice in their government. Just imagine how well they would do if they had the recall mechanism we have. You know and I know, my friend, that if they had that mechanism they would use it. The French would use it , the Greeks would use it. So why doesn't the British Columbia electorate, which disapproves of the Liberal party by 3 to 1 or 75%, use the recall to throw the bums out before they steal anything else which they may have so far forgotten to pocket?
    Rafe says politics has always been '... fun to watch.' Wouldn't it be much more fun and far more satisfying to become involved in a real Recall Campaign and kick the bums out? And if Carole James gets in as a result and doesn't measure up by immediately ending the HST, throw her out too. As one of the above posters said, 'it has never looked blacker' so what the hell have we got to lose?

  • Fiat lux

    1 year ago

    What's the difference

    What's the difference between a union thug and a multinational corporate thug with a multimillion dollar a year salary ?

    Ed Deak.

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    Thugs Compared...

    What's the difference between a union thug and a multinational corporate thug with a multimillion dollar a year salary ? Fait

    The union thug makes less money, and doesn't get to write off nearly as much on his taxes, and will actually go to jail if he's caught.

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    STEAL FROM THE RICH!

    The real thuggery that is the greatest problem, all others paling by comparison beside it is... capitalism. It is a system of organizaed theft and thuggery... which encourages it in all other aspects of social life and amongst all other classes.

    STEAL FROM THE RICH! THEY STEAL IT FROM YOU ALL THE TIME, SO IT IS MERELY GETTING YOUR OWN BACK.

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    Housecleaning Time...

    Judging from what I'm hearing here amongst NDPers and elsewhere, Carole is to be the scapegoat and sacrificial lamb for the failings of the party as a whole. I almost feel sorry for the woman. Almost.

    Too bad there can't be a thorough housecleaning of the entire Provincial Council that gets Moe and Co. as well.

  • shane.polak@shaw.ca

    1 year ago

    Tired Old James just won't step down

    After the last provincial election I was calling for her head. The NDP had a really good chance to jump all over the BC "Liberal" party and did not.

    In politics one must beat down the opponent. Just like those Tea Baggers in the States are doing to the Dems. The NDP in BC is like a festering sore. Over time it gets worse but you die a slow death.

    If I could choose a leader that would be a great pit bull it would be Dawn Black. She has the guts to put it to the BC "Liberals". She would attack that neo con party like there was no tomorrow. I think I am biased because she is the MLA in my riding. I have great respect for her.

    I have no respect for Old James. She had to step down when the NDP was defeated but she is a lover of power and has dreams of becoming Premier. She is a tired leader and needs to be put to pasture.

  • samuidave (not verified)

    1 year ago

    Rafe Mair proved correct in the first post

    Rafe Mair ~ "If James stays on it's manna from heaven for the Liberals"

    Bobby Peru ~ "Carol James represents a ray of hope to middle class, middle of the road voters who might believe that the party can reform itself and truly demonstrate it is a genuine alternative to the Liberals. ... And that it is a good thing for society. "

  • samuidave (not verified)

    1 year ago

    coyoteman ~ "The problem

    coyoteman ~ "The problem with the NDP is NOT Carole, per se. And to insist that it is, is to miss the depth of analysis that is really needed here, if the NDP is to be salvaged. And my hope is that it will be.

    Whereas my hope is that it cannot be salvaged. It has proven itself, repeatedly, to be a party without principle. It has a history of flakiness, and of being too willing to compromise due to threats by resource plunderers.

    BC need not prostrate itself at the feet of big business; they need BC resources to survive. BC is their lifeblood, for ALL wealth is derived from the planet.

    The province needs a new, visionary party that respects the necessity for ecological symbiosis; works for the majority of the people in a newly developed economic paradigm where sustainability is the paramount concern; and to develop this economy through laws, regulation and support which leads business along since business, particularly big business, refuses to lead itself.

    Full implementation obviously cannot be overnight, but it must start. Currently there is not a single party willing to take the steps necessary. They continue to walk the plank.

    If the people of BC are too afraid to accept this necessary challenge, thinking it may be too disruptive to their way of life, then we will all suffer irrepairably.

  • For a better world

    1 year ago

    Carole James Must take More Definitive Stances

    Carole James must take more definitive stances on several current issues. Either she takes on these steps boldly, or she gives up her leadership. These issues include among other things a Public Inquiry regarding the theft of BC Rail, retraction of the HST, restoration of the bank tax, and a much fairer Income Tax Structure. If she or the NDP Party do not address these primary issues, they are destined to remain a medioce opposition party.

    Carole James was chosen as the leader of the NDP party, because she did not carry any of Glen Clark's baggage. Unfortunately she now has the very sly Moe Sahota calling the shots. He was part of Clark's baggage and he should not be in his current level of influence in the party.

  • fairweatherfriend

    1 year ago

    c'mon Dianne

    Right on Rafe! The Libs are dead, NDP is gaining,but....., and the Conservatives are a non-event. Dianne Watts got fed up with this type of scenario in Surrey, and swept the old-style huff n' bluff politicos out of office. She then proceeded to bring together councillors of all stripes into a united governing front. And I believe she can now do it for the province under her own new politcal banner (BC Party?). We are all sick and tired of the old-style politics. Lets bring in a fresh unifying leader to get us out of this mess!

  • roady

    1 year ago

    they both suck

    why bother voting its all old news... gordons a liar and carole is a whiny old lady that never has anything new to say

  • carioca

    1 year ago

    Carole James

    I said before,nice lady but not a leader. She doesn't have what takes to rally the troops, to put fire under an issue, to emotionally fight for the right thing. She has to do as soon as possible. I want to see somebody passionate about what she of he is saying. She talks but no sound is coming out of her. Politically she is a dead fish and the long she stays, the smell will get worse.

  • shepsil

    1 year ago

    Rafe, you need more than your eyes checked, hang em up buddy!

    Carole James is riding a 49% BCNDP approval rating and some suggest she needs to step down. Rafe Mair's "Best Before Date" is clearly overdue. This is one columnist I won't bother reading anymore.

  • jim1966

    1 year ago

    BC Politics Needs An Overhaul

    Whomever leads this province needs to have some kind of platform that includes some of these keys issues:

    1)Restore integrity to our politics.
    2)Start Telling The Truth.
    3)Create a climiate of oppurtunity to seek and gain and keep good jobs in BC
    4)Fix some core ministries, like Education, Social Services and the Children and Families Ministries, these are just a few to mention. BC Has a lot of problems and if these "issues" are not dealt with the outcome is not very happy. Sick people will eventually get sicker and cost your local ER a whole ton of money, that apparently we don't have, If things don't change for everyone in BC then business will flee to Alberta and investments in our province will decline. We as a society must face some cold hard facts, even though we all live and enjoy a beautiful place to work, play and live in , this means nothing to anyone if all they get is constant financial stress and the like, and that can happen to anyone in any income group. I used vote NDP, but I cannot with Carole James. I like her she's a nice lady, she loves BC and what we can offer and show the world and I respect her for that but....no platform, no plan, constant infighting and turmoil is a recipe for disaster for any party, So like a lot of dis-enfranchised NDP supporters I might vote green or vote for an independent candidate. This province has been through worse times and we all will come through this but there needs to be some MAJOR changes to restore the average Joe/Jane voters. I haven't seen anything regarding this from the NDP, well so far at least.

  • Jerry Munro

    1 year ago

    Wishing who well... :-)

    "Whereas my hope is that it cannot be salvaged. It has proven itself, repeatedly, to be a party without principle. It has a history of flakiness, and of being too willing to compromise due to threats by resource plunderers." samovar.

    And I sure as Hell wouldn't argue with that. It's been my experience as well.

    But it's also been my experience that the problem lies primarily at the level of leadership, of the party and the trade union movement. There is where the heart of crass opportunism has beat most steadily and firmly... again, in my experience.

    On the other hand, I have worked with and found many of the rank and file to be the most honourable and well intentioned, and yes, progressive of people. And it is these folks that I actually wish well, to clarify the issue. These folks I would like to see take hold of the party and do a major housecleaning and reno job, so that it COULD be what they, and I, would like to see it be.

    Am I confident that this will happen?

    No.

    I think the crass political and labour bureaucrat opportunists would rather see the Party destroyed first, or folded into the Liberal Party of Canada.

  • Bill_Horne

    1 year ago

    the Emerson effect from the other side

    When David Emerson was elected as a federal Liberal and promptly jumped over to the Conservatives, many of his constituents were furious at him. When Carole and her handlers kicked Bob Simpson out of the NDP caucus, they alienated a lot of people in Cariboo North from the party.

    Many of us in this riding think highly of Bob. The longer it takes the party to find a way to bring Bob back into the fold, the more people are going to be pissed off at the NDP, which will be unfortunate for all concerned.

  • sicntired

    1 year ago

    Do the right thing

    James has been invisible through fire sales and scandals.She couldn't even find a"huge"RotR last election.I'm sure she's a nice lady,good neighbor,wonderful mother.Truth is as a political leader she has no personality.You just can't grow one of those.

  • sicntired

    1 year ago

    Do the right thing

    James has been invisible through fire sales and scandals.She couldn't even find a"huge"RotR last election.I'm sure she's a nice lady,good neighbor,wonderful mother.Truth is as a political leader she has no personality.You just can't grow one of those.

  • alive

    1 year ago

    Worth repeating

    sicntired:

    You can say that again!
    and you did.

  • DavidN

    1 year ago

    whah

    If we had a left wing party it would say something about the power, rail, water etc that is being sold off to multinationals. but I guess we do have a LW party, and they are useless. The designations are meaningless.

    At least we didn't have to undergo what happened in Chile or Argentine, but it is shame all the same that the NDP is asleep at the switch because it is more intent on paying off unionist forces than being an alternative to corporatist culture.

    Frank, get your head out...or at least your ears...the NDP is s dream intended only to eliminate public sector guilt for lounging at the trough. Anti-corporatist voters have no party, we have only union and anti-union and that is the fault line we have that is being plundered by multinationals.

    We require no war or economic disaster to be plundered because we are too busy arguing about crap that doesn't mean anything to notice that our pockets are being picked by both the NDP and their alternatives. It doesn`t matter if we have the NDP or the Libs, they are conveniently the same thing. Compliant and easily purchased.

  • oldstyle

    1 year ago

    Raife, are you a Liberal in disguise?

    There are so many mixed messages in this piece that's it's very hard to tell what the real motive is.

    First, Raife says "what she doesn't have is that streak of vindictiveness and belly-deep anger"

    Would you really vote for this kind of politicion?

    I see your hatred (too strong a word?) for the Liberals, but here you go aiding them from the sidelines. Who's side are you really on?

    Never mind, I don't care. It's just that your words and tone beg the argument for clarity sake.

    Then James dispatches Bob Simpson with a bite of steel and this is seen as confusion and party disparity. Maybe it is, and maybe it's something more. Could it be leadership?

    There are many ways to look at things and if you don't freshen up your act it's bound to stay stuck. Is there a present time Raife somewhere abouts?

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    DavidN

    You're right that many of you don't have a party to support. But that isn't the fault of the NDP. Just as the Canadian Alliance was formed because right-wingers didn't think they had a true right-wing party to vote for there is no reason why anti-corporatists can't do the same.

    If there truly are enough people feeling the same way then one day a new anti-corporation party could take over the NDP like what the Alliance did to the Pro-Cons.

    But at some point guys who feel the way you do have to make your voice heard, have to demonstrate you're willing to do the ground work and create a new party and then support that party with donations and by showing up one election day.

    The NDP knows its future isn't in begging perennial non-voters to show up. Workers and the far Left didn't support Tommy Douglas or David Lewis, or Robert Strachan or even James Coldwell and J.S. Woodsworth. So after 50 years why shouldn't the NDP get the message they can't please them and instead they should focus on being the political vehicle of choice for those that do support them?

  • ShortSummer

    1 year ago

    Bottom line is..

    The bottom line line is, to me anyway, " Is the NDP the party I think will represent my beliefs as the governing party of BC?"

    My answer is a resounding NO, Especially under the current leadership - including both CJ and MS.

    I believe in social support networks. I believe in public medicare, public education, safe roads, safe cities, mass transit and a government for the average Joe, not for or by the businesses and the rich.

    And, I believe we need higher taxes to pay for these things - Government is a process for the redistribution of wealth from those who have to those who need, not TO those with wealth.

    The NDP do not support these goals - as demonstrated by their courting of business, by their lack of deep support for 'workers', by their silence on the selling of the province, by their support of privatized education and healthcare,... I could go on.

    Occupy the Centre? isn't that the home of the "Liberals" (at least federally), it's never been the place for a "left"-leaning party... so why go there - why not change your name and stop lying to those who think you represent them. Let us find a more appropriate political venue.

    I could mention how Carole James looked me in the eye during the last election twice, once telling me the NDP would NOT undue Liberal labour laws (HEU and so on), and then a second time - in public saying the exact opposite to a union gathering.

    I could mention how the NDP only forms a government in BC when the right is split - which it isn't right now...and won't be in 2 years.

    Last election I held my nose and voted for my local NDP candidate - as I have been a long term NDP supporter (no longer a member, as a result of the leader) - but not in the next election. I may vote Green, I may NOT vote, or I may vote 'none of the above' - BUT I WILL NOT BE VOTING FOR AN NDP PARTY WITH CAROLE JAMES AT THE HELM.

    You can all continue to debate the next election and the NDP's future under CJ: are you paying attention to those who will vote, or are you simply absorbed in your political rhetoric?

    The polls I've heard about place CJs popularity below that of the party - she's not a leader. I've also read often in these very "pages" how the success of the NDP has been a result of the hatred of Gordon Campbell, not of the popularity of Carole James.

    Carole, if your reading this, its time to look the sword in the eye and fall on it.

    And fall hard enough to leave room for Moe to jump on it too.

  • ShortSummer

    1 year ago

    Punting those who don't agree with you....

    Organizations who smother dissent, who exclude those who speak out are doomed to tunnel vision. Problem with that? Trains. Fighting trains is never a good idea.

    Organizations who have many views and opinions at the table come up with better ideas.

    I don't know what really happened 'at the table'. Somehow I think it was the behind the scenes actions that lead to the expulsion of Mr. Simpson.

    Why is it that I feel he spoke out against Ms. James in private too?

    A muzzle is a muzzle, no matter who owns it.

    We'll never know the real truth will we?

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    ShortSummer

    "I could mention how the NDP only forms a government in BC when the right is split - which it isn't right now...and won't be in 2 years."

    Why is that relevant? Its just reality.

    "Occupy the Centre? isn't that the home of the "Liberals" (at least federally), it's never been the place for a "left"-leaning party... so why go there "

    The NC NDP draws its support from federal Liberals as well as federal NDPers. Just look at the BC results of a federal election. The NDP doesn't get anywhere near 45% of the vote in BC in a federal election, a lot of our support provincially comes from federal Liberals. That's why the BC NDP has to lean towards the centre.

    If you don't want the NDP to have to draw support from federal Liberals how is not voting for them going to change that? If anything it just supports my view that as the Left has abandoned the NDP and sat on its hands the NDP has had to become what the people that show up want it to be. And who can blame them?

    The NDP have come close to winning the last 2 elections in spite of the Right not being split and in spite of half the voters not showing up. If some of those complaining about James had instead been more concerned with voting against Campbell maybe BC wouldn't be in the trouble its in today. Yet even that is somehow James' fault.

    People want to blame Carole James while forgetting that she wasn't even the leader yet when the NDP was reduced to 2 seats. Back in 2001 there must have been some great holiday packages available because for some reason a lot of left-wingers stayed home. Maybe Ujjal was an even worse leader than James? Perhaps.

    As for Bob Simpson, he wouldn't even be in the NDP if we had had a more left-wing leader. The guy ran under the Campbell banner at one time.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    Jesus, Rafe

    "Bob Simpson's criticism of Carole James and subsequent heave-ho from caucus reminds me of Bill Bennett in the late '70s when just before the annual convention, the late Jack Kempf...criticized the premier, closing with "Bennett had better 'pull his socks up'."

    "Bennett said nothing, but when he took the microphone at the convention, he ostentatiously bent down and pulled his socks up. It brought the house down! Problem thus dealt with."

    Is your memory shot? Bennett did so much more than "pull his socks up” - firing Grace McCarthy as Deputy Premier without so much as a "by-your-leave", threatening Bob Skelly with a lawsuit when Skelly compared him to Marcos, totally unable to pull the trigger on Peter Hyndman when he was caught swigging Pouilly Fousse on the public tab. Bennett wouldn't confront anybody except in the press or behind their backs. He’s the wrong example for you to give, laddie boy.

    But let's deal with your bigger delusion. It's not just you, but many readers on this board appear to have missed the gaping vacuum that's opened up in the political centre of this province, and the NDP is stepping into it big-time. Enough British Columbians aren't scared of Carole and the NDP that they might actually think about voting for her as an alternative to the right-wing rot that the Fiberals have decayed to in the clear-cut of their own making.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    ...wake up!

    All except the doctrinaire left. The hairy-eyed 911-conspiracy-mongers and bankster-conspirators, the raging special interest groups of a hundred members and two hundred decibels, and the ones who simply sit there and complain, mostly without getting off the pot they’re pissing in to try pissing out of the NDP tent for a change - these are the only ones who are outraged.

    Many union members - led by IUOE Local 115 (construction cranes) - are big-time supporters of right wing parties like the Fiberals because they give them assurances that the gravy train of slush-money will always flow for big projects like the ones they work on. Now the NDP is occupying the centre, saying "Maybe the gravy-train for the Big Business-types has rolled to a stop, but you're welcome to come aboard and start it up again for yourselves."

    And I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the constructions laggards found it in their hearts to switch their votes back from the right-wingers to someone who's trying to play it a little fairer on behalf of all BCers.

    Carole has taken the NDP into small-l Liberal territory, occupying the political centre, and she's taken 48% of the province with her. There's no place left for the hard left to go, a rump if there ever was one, so it's time for y'all to STFU. You've got your choice - start a new party that matches your ideals, take your 5% of the vote and participate, or vote NDP.

    Sitting on the sidelines complaining how you will not vote for anyone who doesn't exactly match your own narrow special interest is not an option. That's chickenshit citizenship, a disgrace to freedom.

    And Rafe, being an experienced political pundit, you should be able to see this for yourself. Why you can't see James has marginalized the doctrinaire right in the Fiberals by occupying the centre turf is simply beyond me.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    alive

    "Yes, the NDP has moved to the centre!
    Hence another centre party is not what is called for, but a new left-wing party!

    Unfortunately the NDP has dropped the ball here, so the left-wing spot is vacant.

    Not so fast. Maybe some of the left thinks that, but who else do you see standing up for people in poverty or public education and health care? Maybe the Greens? Only if you can get them all together to sing from the same song-sheet.

    No, it's not the NDP that has left them behind, it's they that have moved out of the big tent that the NDP has become. Yes, they're bound to fail at some things, because they're trying to be all things to all people, and that never works well.... but it does work, after a fashion - and there are scores of clever successful politicians to prove it.

    Just not in the US, where the blood sport continues unabated as millions die in poverty and want each year. Maybe the hard left should move to the US and find out what it's like to really have your issues ignored.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    Miscellaneii...

    Seth: rejoin reality - it's dark and stinky where you are.
    _____________________________

    Shane.Polak:
    "In politics one must beat down the opponent. Just like those Tea Baggers in the States are doing to the Dems."

    Wrong tactic. Politics is the art of giving your opponent enough rope to follow his most ridiculous thoughts to their absurd end. When not even their own press and supporters can stomach their abysmal logic, your victory (and the election) is complete. Think Harcourt over Vander Zalm, Gordon Wilson over Harcourt AND Johnston, Mulroo over Turner.... the list goes on and on.

    The A-bomb is not your greatest weapon - the truth is, if you can only shut up long enough for everyone else to find it.
    ______________________

    And everybody else who is complaining that the NDP "isn't talking about my issue in the press"

    The reason you're not seeing your issue in the press isn't that the NDP isn't speaking it - it's that the press - right-wing wretched toilet paper that it is - doesn't want to print it. There isn't a single newspaper worthy of the name in BC. And as long as y'all keep buying it every day looking for evidence "your views" are being represented in the provincial political discourse, and not finding any, why should they change? They've got your money, and they've got your balls. What more do they need?

    Stop blaming the NDP for the sun going down in the west every day. Everyone "knows" it shines out of Gordo's ass, and even he has to sleep sometimes.

  • G West

    1 year ago

    Nicely put zalm

    And pretty hard to disagree with.

    Cheers

  • realisticman

    1 year ago

    Moving to the Centre

    Tony Blair would be proud.

    It will perhaps be interesting to see how the business community responds to this profound NDP move to the centre. The new overtures to the business community. The message to the citizenry and to business is that the market economy system is no longer hated.

    This all reflects Jack Layton's statement dropping the word "socialist" for "social democrat".

    It will be interesting to see if this new posture is believed.

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    r'man

    Apparently so far its doing better than Campbell's strategy of moving from the far Right to the farther Right.

    You, happy and Gidget are pleased but there doesn't seem to be very many of you.

  • G West

    1 year ago

    Socialist

    Love it - the Socialist hordes are at the door once again - Laissez les bons temps rouler...I see the Globe's poll on the subject is 96% against the 'resolution' of the BC Rail Case.

    That makes even the CEO's current 9% solution look good!

  • trylogic

    1 year ago

    Carol James' vision

    Carol James' whole vision is holding on to a job she cannot handle and applying a third time for a job she will not get. Sadly, she just "does not get it" and "does not have it". Her vocabulary, intonation and demeanor remind me of a preschool teacher talking to three year olds.
    As for the future of the NDP if she does not step down (soon) before the next election anybody's guess might be as good as mine which is the following:
    Gordon Campbell rides into the sunset and Carol Taylor will be floated in directly from the banker's boardroom. It will be a (no) contest to become the first female premier between a well groomed Queen Bee and a clueless Working Bee...

  • realisticman

    1 year ago

    Don't believe everything you read in the papers

    96% against the payment of the guilty parties legal costs in the Basi/Virk corruption trial. The 'resolution' of the case came about when the accused confessed! How could anyone be happy that the taxpayers pick up the tab for the guilty? How would you collect it?

  • G West

    1 year ago

    That's not the only point

    They have assets which could be seized - exactly as Willy Pickton's assets were seized to pay for his defence...The resolution of the case came as a result of the fact that two political appointees - guys who loved to go into the ruck for the boss - made a deal in return for their guilty pleas - a deal which leaves their assets intact and puts them on a par with the average working housewife for two years.

    You call that punishment?

    I call it home free. If there's nothing to hide then let it all hang out. The Chris Trumpy emails and the purloined bidding documents which ended up in CN's quiver but never got to the other bidders...the purblindness about everything of Martyn Brown and Kinsella, the sleaze of the political hacks who managed the bribes – one of whom seemingly grassed on his fellow liberal insiders, the secret witness who Berardino went all the way to the SCC to protect.

    There is shit all over this file and it needs a public airing - if the citizens can stomach Russell Williams in drag they can handle the real story of what happened to an important public asset and how badly Campbell's brand of one man government has screwed up this province.

    People with nothing to hide aren't afraid of opening windows.

    And you have no idea how appalled the vast majority of legal professionals are about this result too. I'll make an exception about never revealing anything personal about myself to mention there are two practicing attorneys in my immediate family and both of them (and virtually 100% of their colleagues) are sickened by this parody of justice.

    They're unhappy about a lot more than the cost of this farce, believe me.

  • Frank

    1 year ago

    r'man

    "How would you collect it?"

    Guess Basi and Virk should have thought of that before ringing up the bill. If I want to go to court cost is a fact, why wasn't it for them?

    That said, Basi has assets that could be seized.

    I'd follow the logic Revenue Canada uses when they fine somneone. They don't give a rat's ass about your ability to pay.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    Don't believe 100% of what you read

    Test everything.

    "It will perhaps be interesting to see how the business community responds to this profound NDP move to the centre. "

    This is a popular fiction foisted on the public by the ink-stained wretches in the press to make it easier to write their stories and give them the authority of knowledge. There is no monolithic "business community" - there's developers who will scream blue murder anytime anything resembling a political party that even thinks about income redistribution even glances their way; there's major forest business that welcomes the NDP's insistence on standing up for home-grown industry against all comers, while they bemoan the same NDP's inability to cut a deal with anyone; there's self-employed single-issue conractors such as couriers and taxi drivers who welcome the NDP's reduction in basic business expenses such as gas and maintenance while leaving their deductions untouched.... there is such a wide spectrum to the "business community" that a more appropriate term would be "business United Nations".

    Anyone dealing in this term for argument's sake is a prevaricator, regardless of which party you favour.

  • zalm

    1 year ago

    So true!

    "There is shit all over this file and it needs a public airing - if the citizens can stomach Russell Williams in drag they can handle the real story of what happened to an important public asset and how badly Campbell's brand of one man government has screwed up this province."

    Couldn't have been better said by Plato or Oscar Wilde! The grotesque details of Williams' confession have been airing all day on radio and it's nauseating to listen to.

  • RyanB

    1 year ago

    Rafe Mair NDP?

    Bobby Peru,

    You do know Rafe Mair was never NDP right? I have a hard time reading the rest of your "point" when you made such a huge error.

    As my grandfather use to say "Nice try! Try again!"

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