GET OUT AND VOTE THEM

GET OUT AND VOTE THEM OUT!
---------------------

Won't happen until Ms. James steps down and someone competent takes over the NDP.

Someone is wrong. Could this be another fudget budget? If so did the Libs win the last election by fraud and lies?

Lets do it

Note that the Dominion Bond rating agency stated Hansen's 2005 election budget where he claimed a $1 billion surplus was actually a $1 billion deficit ie a fudget. But the BC Voter gets his news from Canwest Global. If its on there its Gospel if its not it didn't happen.

There is a way we progressives can stop him if we unite.

The BC NDP is mess with a ineffective unelectable leader utterly incapable of organizing her party, her policies, her opposition and an election campaign. Her make nice parliamentary techniques resound with the voter and the hostile press as cowardly. Bloated Bill Good whips her ass in a one on one. She is driving progressives to the Green's who are utterly fed up with her and her current supporters. Until that party gets its act together, progressives can still take action.

It is very easy for determined special interest groups to hijack political party's in Canada because the electorate is so disinterested. For inspiration look at David Orchard a far left progressives who almost beat Joe Clark for Conservative party leader. Look at how the Gordo and his media wing was able to wipe out Gordon Wilson who was leader of an actual Liberal party until Neocon mass membership buys defeated him. Look at how Harper and Stockwell Day and the religious right were able to hijack the ReformaTories.

There are already lots of real Liberals in the BCLiberal party Ken Jones, Carole Taylor, just booted Gordon Hogg and myriads more still hanging on hoping a messiah will come along and save them from the suffering neocon yoke. If progressives start buying party memberships in large quantities we can easily within the year take back all Liberal party constituency associations and their executive, make massive changes at party policy conventions, force a leadership review convention, change the party name back to Liberal and elect a progressive MLA as party leader.

The Neocon's can join Wilf Hanni over at the BC Conservative party where they belong.

One Difference Between BC and AB/SK...

During the fiscal year ending March 31 2009, BC earned roughly $2 billion in natural gas land rights/drilling rights/bonus bids.

Alberta and Saskatchewan would record that $2 billion figure as a "revenue" for the 2008/09 fiscal year.

BC, on the other hand, records roughly only 10% of that figure ($200 million) for the current fiscal year.

Why? Because those natural gas rights are typically up to 10 year periods and BC accounts the revenue over the duration of the ten-year lease period, unlike AB and SK.

Different accounting practices between provinces. Using AB and SK's accounting practices, BC would have a HUGE surplus for the past fiscal year.

Knock on Wood...

It's time to re-iterate some facts from my earlier post:

BC Public Accounts will provide the actual figures, not StatsCan.

In that same vein, StatsCan shows a deficit for New Democrat Manitoba for the year ending March, 31, 2008 of $195 million.

In actual fact, Manitoba had a surplus of $576 million for the same period according to Manitoba Public Accounts.

That's a $771 million differential from StatsCan's numbers.

http://www.manitoba.ca/finance/pdf/annualreports/annreport_1_08.pdf

But since all the hardcore NDP'ers wanna slam the Libs, don't ya think it's time to slam your own? ;)

http://thetyee.ca/News/2009/04/10/NDPPlatform/

Throw in the NDP's support for the carbon tax and its apparent shift toward IPPs and it looks like most posters here will embrace a new Left Alternative Party for BC.

Hey guys? :D

Mackenzie King era trick

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

It was a trick first used in the Mackenzie King era. Find some frustrated Marxists, get them under Liberal control and discipline, often with the help of a small dollop of patronage or sponsorship, and then use them to embarass, entangle, and/or misdirect the CCF/NDP. In recent years it's been taken up by such luminaries as Buzz Hargrove and Ujjal Dosanjh. Sadly, even after all these years this trick still works, at least to a degree.

BC Public Accounts will provide the actual figures, not StatsCan

Not accurate. Public Accounts issued by governments serve one purpose, StatsCanada figures serve other purposes. Neither figure is inherently more accurate than the other.

Trying to Make Some More Sense of the Figures

BC - Budget/Fiscal Year 2008/09:

Revenues

Budgeted: $38.5 billion
Actual (Statscan): $41.8 billion

Actual Over Budgeted: $3.3 billion

Expenses

Budgeted: $37.7 billion
Actual (Statscan): $43.2 billion

Actual over Budgeted: ($5.5 billion)

Deficit: $2.2 billion

Add:

Forecast Allowance: $750 million
Budget Contingency: $375 million

http://www.bcbudget.gov.bc.ca/2008/backgrounders/backgrounder_fiscal_plan.htm

*** Deficit: $1.075 billion

*** Based upon Statscan "actual" figures.

I guess we will see.

Snake Oil anyone? Get your Snake Oil!

Legal nefarious activities-Politics!

NO worries the future is rosy according to the Liberals!

You get what you vote for! (at least those that voted Liberal!)

Would never buy a used car from Hansen!

Only driven on Sunday eh!

Budget fudge history

"......made in BC fudge-it-budget, so what else is new."

Yep, the Libs did their apprenticeship under Glen Clark, and have refined the method.

Rod Smelser

Ummmmm? CCF/NDP? That vaporized years ago. I don't know why people still think there is any connection worthy of mention.

Unfortunate Legacy of WAC Bennett

One of the unfortunate legacies of WAC Bennett are the populist financial nostrums he championed, many of which have become enshrined in the BC political culture. Budgets must always be balanced or in surplus, regardless of the business cycle. Capital projects are to be done on a cash basis, "pay as you go". BC is debt free. And so on.

Current political leaders are prisoners of these ideas, which date from the 1950s and 1960s, but would have been even more at home in the 19th Century. No one dares question them because the hotline hosts and pundits will soon raise a posse of irate ratepayers to smear and then slay anyone who strays from the received doctrine. It's not unlike the political climate in, say, Iran or China, for someone who might challenge the revolutionary wisdom.

So the question du jour is do we have deficit or not, and if so, how large is it? The real policy question, what is the optimal deficit given economic circumstances, cannot be asked by political leaders. And all the tenured economists at our B.C. public universities, dutifully worshipping in the thrall of the Premier's carbon tax, not to mention being personally contemptuous of Carole James and worried sick about the potential impact a tuition freeze would have on academic salary awards, aren't going to ask any critical questions either.

What can you say? It's the Best Place on Earth!

Well,what else is new?

Here comes the cuts,here comes the cuts...........

An interesting story about cuts to grade 12 math and grade 12 science......

http://www2.canada.com/nanaimodailynews/news/story.html?id=ff4f8678-86be-4dcb-8d21-f1794b2094c2

Makes perfect sense to Liberals,the whole bloody works of them are deficient in Science and Math..........

Rumour has it the courses are being replaced with a 3 card monty course and advanced baiting and switching

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

snert: Still relevant today

snert
Ummmmm? CCF/NDP? That vaporized years ago. I don't know why people still think there is any connection worthy of mention.

There's an obvious continuity between the history of the CCF and, since 1961, that of the NDP. The notion of a CCF/NDP is still relevant today, and I don't know why you would claim otherwise.

It's similar in a way to the obvious continuity between the Liberal-Conservative Coalition, Social Credit, and now the BC Liberals.

@seth

That's a great idea (take over the Libs). I'd love to be in the room when Scampbell and Failcon catch a whiff of commingled patchouli and the sweat of honest workers and realize the 'horde' is among 'em.

To be blunt...................

...........the Liberals were reelected by the completely incompetent performance by Carole James. Those NDP that were elected, simply had more constituents in their holding their noses, and voting NDP instead of Liberal. In one of the safest Liberal ridings in BC, the Liberal 'star' candidate was defeated, by the collapse of the Green and NDP vote.

Campbell's Liberals only garnered 23% of the public vote, in Iran today people are dying over such blatant corruption.

To be truly blunt

I have no idea what you're on about, Grumpy. Really.

@ Luke Skywalker

WRONG! BC uses GAAP, in which capital expenses are spread out over a long period, just as income from natural gas rights are. This makes capital expenditures seem smaller than they actually are. It doesn't make sense to spread out expenses but not revenue. BC has to do it for both, as proscribed by GAAP.

Look at the figures comparing StatsCan and BC Government surpluses/deficits provided by the author. Some years Statscan is higher, some years lower. Quoting only last years numbers indicates nothing.

seth

Good idea!

Thanks, Sunshine

I'll be keenly interested to see the spin and the placement. I would think it deserves pg1, front and center.

me too...

But we know what the chances of that are.

real democracy

I think that many Iranian citizens could teach BC a few lessons on civil disobediance and democracy. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hWoxNISdzCH6A5mt0n0coCRzxg-QD98SQ4Q03

Kirk Lapointe

"Thanks. We don't catch everything at first..."

You can say that again.

actually it can

The government (all of them!) can stop shovelling money at the big health care institutions and go back to smaller ones that did health care far more efficiently than the big behemoths.

I regret statistics aren't available since 1999 because they don't break them out by institition since they started their amalgamation process.

Fight for your small hospitals, people! Don't let the big ones waste your medicare system away!

Whups!

That was for R-man "This must STOP!" about 21 hours up. What happened to the posts in between? (I should have suspected when I saw nothing on a current story for that long)

LIbERalS

This government isn't interested in streamling anything in the healt care or education sector. The Pharmacudical companies, research companies and doctors make too much money from it and of course, donate to the LIbERalS to ensure the status quo. As for education, they want to privatize it as well.

When was the last time you heard of a private school running out of money or having a budget shortfall? Well they just submit their budget to the provincial government and the tax payers pick up half of it. Our public schools are subjected to tough budget restrictions and of course the governmemt is at war with the teachers. Guess who suffers?

zalm

You have the 'best comments' tab selected - 'all comments' doesn't include anything less than 20+ hours old...don't know if that's because the editors are asleep or simply disinterested.

Personally, I think one of the biggest changes for the positive that Tyee could make in the upcoming version revision is to dump that whole best comments/all comments farrago into the memory hole forever.

And, you're right about the quality of health care going down as the size of health care institutions increases....hang onto small local hospitals at all costs – they’re likely a lot cheaper too.

It will be interesting to see what happens under the Falconator though.

Have you ever taken some time to look carefully through the CVs of the members of the Executive Council?

It’s a scary thing that such a bunch of unqualified and minimally-experienced people should have such responsibilities. Falcon’s lack of qualifications for his current position is particularly apparent…..mind you, he wasn’t qualified to be minister of things that move either!

Perhaps People Here Would Be More Happy...

... If the government reigned in and did not increase health, education, and social assistance spending by a total amount of $2.95 billion (above budget) in the 2008 - 2009 fiscal year according to StatsCan!

Voilà! Instead of a $1.438 billion deficit (according to StatsCan), BC would have a $1.51 billion surplus.

Imagine that!!!

That seemingly would be the preference of most posters here on the Tyee. ;)

[EDITED. -MODERATOR.]

[EDITED. -MODERATOR.]

[EDITED. -MODERATOR.]

[EDITED. -MODERATOR.]

And From the Vancouver Sun...

Statscan v. GAAP

http://www.vancouversun.com/Business/Diverging+accounting+rules+lead+budget+GAAP/1706771/story.html

luke

Way to avoid the issue buddy!

Let me make a modest suggestion though.

How about we roll back the calendar to 2001 and NOT introduce the Campbell cutbacks in income tax...then there would have been more than enough jingle in the provincial jeans and health care would not be in trouble either.
By the way, I think zalm's point that smaller institutions would not only deliver better health care could be amended to suggest they'd do it more economically too....

G West...

Damn, I wish the NDP would make that their main platform plank. Can you say "Third Party status for the NDP?" :D

And again become the highest taxed jurisdiction in North America aside from Quebec.

Brilliant!

Just what economic growth, employment growth, and prosperity in BC needs. NOT! ;)

and Luke Skywalker

discovers his weapon is broken.

I believe it is safe to say that if spending on health, education, and welfare are to increase, then most would prefer this money to go to programs that make peoples' lives better - rather than salaries/wages/increases in departmental 'costs'/etc., etc. But it should also be said that there are many ways to lower costs, such as preventative medicine in healthcare, lower class sizes in education, and keeping low income people decently housed and fed. The reasons these lower costs is because they mean that greater costs are not borne in the long run...this has been studied to death and Wilkinson in "The Impact of Inequality" is one source. We know that it costs far more in taxpayer dollars to provide 'services' like policing and ER to the homeless rather than actualy housing them, and that it costs far more to support a high school dropout on income assistance than to ensure a relevant and meaningful education. Prudent government would be looking at these studies and numbers and planning for the future instead of the Olympics.

G West - I'm with you - the best comments/all comments is rather irrelevant and not true to the spirit of the 'public conversation".

@ Luke Skywalker

Poor Luke. As has happened so often before, you've missed the point of the article. The last paragraph, which you obviously did not read, states:

It's not clear that "a volatile global economy" would necessitate large increases in health care or education spending. Increased social assistance expenditures are another story.

Now if their income was less than expected, then Colin Hansen would have had some idea of the size of this drop long ago, and thus could have estimated the deficit. But instead of coming clean,

The issue is one of honesty of an elected official, rather than spending priorities.

Jimmy...

Strange to hear that coming from the left... the same left that always complains about not enough spending on health and education.

Now is it "not enough" spending or "too much" spending on health and education.

That's what I'd like to know.

It's kinda like... well... a never-ending oxymoron?

@ Luke Skywalker

Haha! Am I "the left", now?

I've neither agreed nor disagreed with this increase in spending. What I'm saying is that, unlike increased social assistance spending, it can't be attributed to BC's tanking economy.

Yes

Luke Skywalker

It's kinda like riding a bike uphill all of the way to Alouette Lake, ain't it Rod? :D

Yes, there is some similarity. You have to be prepared to work at bit, but it's worth it. [EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Social assistance spending......

Gimmee a break,Scampbell slashed and burned assistance,because of high CYCLICAL employment and a brutal policy Scampbell got away without paying assistance,don`t come crying now about social assistance payments!........

Here comes the early spin folks,can you see it in the crystal ball,Luke/Hansen/Scampbell are going to blame last years 1.8 billion deficit and this years 3 billion$ deficit on increased welfare payments.
Whats the matter? old Harper isn`t playing ball,no EI changes,too bad,Old Iggy has capitulated as well,NO EI CHANGES,sorry Scampbell,SUCK IT UP,the provinces are on their own.
Scampbell has one more excuse fest to limp through this fall and then he is adios,only to leave the smoldering wreckage to B team.

Scampbell`s daycare/toast--Scampbell`s all day kindergarten/caput--Healthcare/500 million$ shortfall this amongst the health authorities--Evergreenline/cancelled--BC place roof/not on the table--Golden ears bridge/empty parking lot costing Translink millions......

Convention center/losing money every month--New BC ferries/sitting at the dock collecting bird shit......

What`s left,if only Scampbell had a few million grizzly bears to offer up to gun toting tourists,speaking of tourists where are they?....
Maybe Scampbell could come up with a scheme to promote fishing adventures....

"Come to BC,catch a fish,plenty of chairs available,every cast will find a fish,all our farmed salmon get treated with the best antibiotics money can buy,"

Scampbell couldn`t run a lemonade stand!

P.S. Interesting story on the news last night,BC strawberry farmers on verge of bankruptcy,farming is too expensive in BC/taxes/carbon tax/fuel taxes(Translink),hmmmm,what better way to force the best farm land in BC to be sold to Bob Rennie n company

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

Hansen is a liar......

I read the story in the sun,the Hansen excuse,his numbers still don`t add up.....

Someone please explain WHAT BC HYDRO SPENT 800 MILLION ON LAST YEAR.....

You mean ENERGY CONTRACTS,upgrades at revelstoke and mica don`t come close to that,you mean south Delta house buy-outs?...
And where is the forcast allowance from Hansen? it`s vanished!.......

If the NDP used the GAPP system of three card monty the island highway wouldn`t be on the books,the millenium line skytrain/schools/ etc etc etc........That means the NDP had surpluses every year!

You know what happens next in Scampbell`s head(the GAP)---Everything thing that the Scampbell Liberals build will have a life of 200 years,that way he can amoratize out the debt forever........like a 999 year lease on a sold BC railway........

What a fucking con man!

Cheers

buc bay

What ferries are tied up?
Please provide some evidence to back this up other than 6 month old Tyee articles that were somewhat short on "facts" to begin with. Though long on heresay.
Let me get you started. Look at the BCF website. Then get back to us with the names of the boats that are "sitting at the dock collecting bird shit"
Shouldn't be hard to do, right?
Unless....

Gppd point sharing

In central point of the article - that a government just elected on the basis of its financial management chops has been exposed as a naked emperor - is entirely missing.

Not that it's a surprise.

As Kirk LaPointe noted in his response to sunshine coast girl (17 hours upthread from here) yesterday '...they don't "catch" everything at first' do they?

Happy, I take it you'll be defending the corp relative to the story posted this morning on The Hook?

Things look pretty grim for Campbell's navy from my vantage point....

errata

that subject line should be:

Good point sharing!

In my defence, the 'p' and the 'o' are next to each other on the keyboard.

West

I'm not defending anything other than the myth the new boats are defective.

Buc brought it up, lets discuss that.

I take it from your response however you are no longer disputing that they are all in full service and you want to change the subject?

Buccarroo Bay...

Forget about the $3 billion+ capital works program that BC Hydro has embarked upon.

From today's Vancouver Sun:

http://www.vancouversun.com/Hydro+third+Trail+area/1706350/story.html

So much for BC Hydro's "privatization" agenda. Damn socialists! :D

p and o

was that a Freudian slip, G West?

Maybe, who knows

Naw happy, let's just discuss the subject at hand - the smiling bastards who lied their way to re-election on a platform of fiscal prudence.

We can talk about how THAT has also affected Campbell's navy on another thread.

Personally, I'm more interested in the utterly irresponsible attitude of Pointy LaPointe and his rag - the Vancouver Sun.

If anyone needs to be embarrassed by how poorly he's served the interests of the people of BC - given what the fourth estate is supposedly all about - that's who should have a 'red' face.

Swith bait

West, you can bait me all you want with side trips, I'm not biting.

If you don't wish to discuss the statement that buccaneer bay brought up and I responded to, then please don't confuse the issue.

Are they in full operation (and have been since they became fully crew trained) or aren't they?

A simple yes or no.

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULTS. -MODERATOR.]

Nope

Hardly a side trip - this story is about the 'financial' management and government deception.

The BC Ferries dissatisfaction thread is on the Hook.

Cheers...

Happy.......

Hahn sits those boats down all the time,though lately they have been running,Campbell and Hahn can`t correct the fuel consumption,they can`t correct their capacity,they can`t fully load them because of too narrow car lanes on the main deck but at this point in time fuel consumption is the least of BC ferries concern and they don`t have the demand to load them up anyways........

Stats Can's "Cash-Based" Accounting v. GAAP

BTW, GAAP was the recommended accounting system of the BC Auditor General several years back.

A closer look at the statements of StatsCan's Vaillancourt provides some hints at the likely BC Public Accounts figure for the year ending March 31, 2009:

StatsCan's Math Unwound:

$1.44 billion deficit
add $ 3.1 billion (fiscal year full capital spending)
deduct $2 billion (amortization of capital spending from previous and current fiscal year)

Result: $340 million deficit

And that figure likely does not take into account other GAAP-related measures such as the fiscal year ~$2 billion in natural bonus bids and previous years' amortization of same moving forward.

So Hansen seems to be closer to the mark with his statements than one might believe.

No luke

Hansen is a liar; Campbell is a liar - you're just quibbling about the size of the lie.

Remember, NDP governments in this country run fewer and smaller deficits than either Conmen or Liberals.

You can look it up!

Luke.........

And which one of the last three auditor generals might that be.......

No quote/no story, after all every auditor general according to Hansen has been wrong.

Luke..........

Very interesting..........

With GAPP all crown corporations and other goverment entities are shown.......

Really Luke,what about BC ferries,what about Translink?What about Vanoc?What about signed energy agreements?........

Your excuse doesn`t cut it,Hansen is a liar,what about BC`s 1/2 billion dollar share in olympic security costs?.......

Harper`s is picking up the tab in exchange for shorting BC on infrastructure money,how is that number accounted for?...........

And I am patiently waiting for an announcement on how much money BC will be getting on the next oil n gas auction.......
I guess a 30 million dollar announcement isn`t news worthy!

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

Accounting differences.

Hansen maintains we had a surplus last year by pointing out different accounting methods employed by statscan led them to report a $1.44 billion deficit.

These same accounting methods have ALSO reported earlier budgets from finance minister Carole Taylor as having a HIGHER surplus than she recored. This happened while capital spending for olympic projects, the goldenears bridge and the massively debt-ridden convention centre were on going.

Of course this government's dubiuos reporting of REAL capital spending may mean that statscan is only now discovering money spent years ago. Who really knows what is going on with this secretive, elusive gang enabled by an obsequious media the government of Iran would covet?

Nope to you too West

So if you don't want to talk ferries (should that be ferry's?) then I don't want to talk MSM.
Makes as much sense.
So no thanks, I'll just be a poor sport and stick to the subject that my Tyee neighbour buccaneer bay introduced.
Which, from the comments that followed would seem to indicate that you are both grudgingly admitting that the new boats ARE in full operation?
And buc-what is this about too narrow car lanes now? Tell me more. And provide your source. I've heard enough hearsay about the "problems" of the new boats on the Tyee from, ah, "experts"

Luke,interesting Tyee story.....

Some great quotes in that story....

"BC benefited from windfall transfers from Ottawa"

"Corporate tax cuts were more offset by unincorporated BCers" -"doubling MSP premiums,bringing in an extra 1.2 billion dollars"

"Tuition fee increases brought 948 million dollars,exactly double what tuition brought in the previous year"

"The BC goverment can boast about surpluses but the debt keeps rising"

And finally "Was the 2005 budget really balanced?"

Well,we know the answere Luke,no,it`s was one of many toxic fudget budgets.

In fact,I reccomend every regular Tyee reader to read that last story Luke posted a link to,everything predicted has come true.........

God,how can BCers be so god damn stupid,where is a grassy hill when you need one!

Accounting Differences....

Same goes for the roughly $2 billion in revenue from natural gas bonus bids/drilling rights for the fiscal year.

Instead of claiming that ~$2 billion figure as a revenue for the fiscal year (yes the cash was all in the bank), GAAP will only allow very roughly $200 million of that amount to be claimed for the fiscal year for accounting purposes.

Two sides of the same "GAAP" coin.

Makes me wonder if Stats Can took that figure into account because their spokesperson doesn't allude to same in the Vancouver Sun article.

Happy........

Car lanes are too narrow,employees directing traffic on the new ferries have to limit the vehicles on the main deck,people couldn`t get out of their cars(safety issue),so the next result is a limit on semi-trailer traffic,mind you if they can get enough mini austins the staff can compensate,it appears that the German ship builders didn`t take in account all us .......

Energy using,hummer/SUV driving Canadian car hogs,go figure!

You're being disingenuous

Don't talk about financial mismanagement if you like.

It's fine with me.

I just think, since there's a perfectly good story up right now about what a mess Hahn and Campbell have made of the fleet that that'd be the right place to discuss it.

I'm not grudgingly admitting anything - I'm just too busy. In the dozens of times I've been across the strait in the past 6 months I've never once had the 'privilege' of riding on one of the 'Dutch Zitrones' as Grumpy calls them.....

I have seen them sitting in port when we docked at the end of each of those voyages though.

I do find that a little strange - maybe the CEO is saving them up for when fuel is a little more expensive?

Cheers.

Just one more small but important point

NDP governments run fewer and smaller deficits than either Conservative or Liberal provincial governments in this country.

BC is just another example of this interesting but often ignored fact.

As for GAAP, you're barking up a dead tree luke - BC has been in deficit for months and, come September, we'll find out just how far....

Or maybe, of course

WE won't.

Not because Campbell hasn't bankrupted the place and sold off everything that he can - but simply because the man has a congenital problem with openness and accountability.

If you think adopting the CICA's GAAP means that the CEO is constrained from lying about what a mess he's made of the economy you haven't been following the program.

I'd also like you to take a look at what the Parliamentary Budget Officer Kevin Page has been saying about Stevo's plan to get the feds back in the black.

Remember, he's been saying the Feds were well into the red since last November...and he also says we're not getting out of the mess without increasing taxes and/or cutting services....

And, in case you're looking

Here's a link to an article about Page's problems with Flaherty's story telling:

http://www.nationalpost.com/related/topics/story.html?id=1690725

G West...

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Man, the former BC NDP and Ontario NDP governments have the worst historical financial reputation in that regard.

From a ~$17 billion debt in 1991 to a ~$34 billion debt in 2001... a doubling of same.

... and BC was one of the highest taxed jurisdications in North America at the time...

... and BC was at the bottom rung of the Canadian provincial ladder in all material economic/investment performance tests...

... and in May, 2001 the BC NDP received the worst political kick in the arse in BC political history.

We, the people spoke loud and clear... 2 seats outta 79 for the NDP.

End of story. ;)

Luke....

And Campbell has taken the BC debt from 31 billion in 2001 to 90 billion in 2009........

Even if you take out the P3s and energy agreements the debt has still risen from 31 billion to 55 billion in 9 years......

End of story.........

Campbell couldn`t run a lemonade stand...

Now back to the corner Luke

Look it up luke

NDP governments have better records than either Liberal or Conservative ones when it comes to running deficits - those are the facts.

How much is the debt in BC today Luke - all told I wager it's more than 80 billion beans...

End of story...

Too busy for the facts?

I'm sure you're not so busy you can't check the website, it won't take two minutes to see what ferries are on what routes and then this entire silly argument becomes moot.

As for the "mess" Campbell and Hahn have made-well if 86% approval rating is considered a "mess"...

And, while we're at it

Maybe you'd like to discuss the current Liberal government in Ontario...seems to me I read a story just the other day about them having an almost 15 billion dollar deficit this year....

McGinty is a LIBERAL isn't he?

And I believe that would be a 'record' deficit for an Ontario government wouldn't it?

Just like the debt here in BC under a CAMPBELL LIBERAL GOVERNMENT.

End of story... and Alberta too, seems to me they have a record $5 billion deficit this fiscal year.

Did you miss THAT news as well?

happy

You're not going to start posting polls too are you?

I could care less what some dumb survey says...but I did note the current debt situation and the costs of servicing that debt...

And, so far as I know, there's still that matter of unpaid excise tax.

BC Public Accounts....

Signed off by the BC Auditor General (and not opposed by the NDP):
-------------------------------------------
BC - Taxpayer-Supported Debt:
(the credit card debt)

ending March 31, 2001: $24.953 bilion

http://www.fin.gov.bc.ca/OCG/cfa/PA/00-01/PA%202001%20Debt.pdf

ending March 31, 2008: $26.579 billion

http://www.fin.gov.bc.ca/ocg/pa/07_08/PA_2008_ProvDebt.pdf

Wottt? An increase of only ~$1.626 billion in taxpayer-supported debt?!

-------------------------------------------

BC - Total Debt:
(Including self-supported BC Hydro, etc.)

ending March 31, 2001: $33.835 billion

http://www.fin.gov.bc.ca/OCG/cfa/PA/00-01/PA%202001%20Debt.pdf

ending March 31, 2008: $34.627 billion

http://www.fin.gov.bc.ca/ocg/pa/07_08/PA_2008_ProvDebt.pdf

Wottt? An increase of only ~$792 million in total debt?!

-------------------------------------------

G West... Buccarroo Bay... any of you guys interested in submitting your BC Auditor-General applications to Carole James? :D

Happy

Your spinning,read the story in the Hook.......

36% were happy with the fares,40% plus were very disatisfied,when people are asked about their overall experience they are taking into consideration the fine people they meet on the coast and the island......

People like Mr.West......And Me........

And as long as the visitors aren`t from the interior or the fraser valley their cars won`t be keyed or stolen!

Weren`t you selling bee honey and herbal tea last week Happy,I recognized your VW,isn`t yours the one with the honk for peace bumper sticker on it.

sorry bud

We've been through this before..you're wasting my time; total taxpayer supported debt includes a lot of items you're not including...

But don't take my word for it.

Search out Vaughan Palmer from April 22 of this year...for a start.

buc

Do you have figures on the new ferry lane width as compared to older ferry lanes?

Cause no offense but this is the first I've heard this one so I must insist on something more than hearsay.

Another beutiful day in G Bay you lucky skunk.

And luke

Maybe you'd like to start with what the 'final' costs of that little bridge - you know the one with the 'golden' ears (no kidding) are likely to be.

You're supposed to be up on these things aren't you.

Have you got any idea what Translink is on the hook for in terms of just operation and maintenance costs...each month?

Just another hole in the provincial treasury my friend - all courtesy of the CEO and his 'brand' of P3 financial management....

Luke,your pretty funny

According to the BC budget/2009/2010........

The BC debt by 2011 will be 47.215 billion without a forcast allowance and........

That doesn`t include energy contracts or P3s.............

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Here is the link

http://www.bcbudget.gov.bc.ca/2009/bfp/2009_Budgey_Fiscal_Plan.pdf

Check out page 48

And of course the revenue forcasts are out to lunch and so are the expenses.......

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT REMOVED. -MODERATOR.]

Cheers

Oops......

Page 48 of the BC budget

Try this link

http://www.bcbudget.gov.bc.ca/2009/bfp/2009_Budget_Fiscal_Plan.pdf

Happy? You shouldn't be.

For at least the first six months of the year, one of the new german ferries, built in the ONLY non-union ship building company in germany HAS BEEN RUNNING SUNDAYS ONLY TO NANAIMO FROM SWARTZ BAY ON THE ISLAND. [EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.] My guess would be that the german ferry is perpetually under-used, because [EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.] it's a PIG for maintenance. [EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.] I had a very brief conversation with the globe's ian bailey, who could just not seem to hang up fast enough but who assured me that the $1.44 DEFICIT STORY would be in today's globe bc section which I've not yet seen, but perhaps the globe buried it in the financial section, just as the times colonist was partially successsfull in doing with the news during the election that bc under mr economic management, otherwise known as premier useless, HAD THE SECOND WORSE GDP GROWTH IN THE COUNTRY AT MINUS .3% IN 2008. [EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Ooops

Messed up the link again,must have had Ursula on my mind.......

Contractual debt........

http://www2.canada.com/vancouversun/columnists/story.html?id=be4c05c2-444b-4624-afbb-fb98ac8b799e

Buccarroo Bay....

Now you've convinced me!

Eureka, why didn't the BC NDP advertise their financial utopia to BC'ers during the election?

They woulda won in a landslide! ;)

frenchy mcswede:

¡Ay, caramba! The mindset of some people. :D

Thanks for the comic relief! :D

"Balanced" budgets and bc liberals.

Yes, vancouver board of trade, and phil hochsteen, there is a santa claus, only this is a BAD santa who steals from children and gives the money to fat, stupid old men -Gordo Claus!! Counting the just released $I.44 BILLION DEFICIT, AND THE "BALANCED" 2005 BUDGET THAT WAS ONLY "BALANCED" BY SELLING BC RAIL, AND THE TWO MASSIVE AND MASSIVELY UNDERESTIMATED DEFICITS PROMISED, THE BC LIBERALS BY SHORTLY AFTER THE OLYMPICS(AND NOT COUNTING OLYMPIC LAUNCHED MEGA-DEFICITS) WILL HAVE RUN DEFICITS FOR 7 OUT OF 9 NINE YEARS, A RECORD TO MAKE A BANANA REPUBLIC MILITARY JUNTA BLUSH SO HARD THEY COULD PASS FOR AN INFRA-RED LIGHT SOURCE IN THE DARK...but of course, bc liberals from toilet bowl washer to chief steward regard conscience as an impediment to, um, "modern business practises..."

@ Luke Skywalker

Really? I didn’t know that. Do you have a source?

All economic tests, eh? Just another of your lies, and one you’ve told so many times before on the Tyee threads. Who do you think you’re fooling?

Don’t bee too hard on the NDP. After all, with extremely optimistic growth forecasts, the total provincial debt is expected to rise by roughly 16 billion dollars (which includes the cost of the Port Mann Bridge) over the next 4 years according to the Ministry of Finance.

http://www.bcbudget.gov.bc.ca/2009/bfp/2009_Budget_Fiscal_Plan.pdf

As you know, this “debt” does not count billions of dollars of debt hidden as P3s …

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Liberals+have+locked+billions+long+term+contracts/1521643/story.html

… nor does it count the 20+ billion dollars in IPP contracts the Province has signed.

http://www.theprovince.com/Technology/Private+power+industry+booming+that+good+thing/1671621/story.html

Perhaps in four years they will :)

By the way Luke.........

Eveyone of the links you provided about the BC Debt are UNAUDITED(They are spin)

In other words,the links you supplied are bogus,there is nothing I enjoy more than reading a story on accounting that MAY or MAY NOT BE TRUE...........

@ buccaneer bay

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Reply to Fleet expert mcswede

Yes, the new Class was introduced in a measured manner. Crew training was the main driver, or do you expect that the employees just jump on board the day they showed up and get to work?
I'll just say to you what I've been saying for months-check the website before you open your mouth and claim they aren't being utilized. Try looking right now. Your word of mouth and shouting people down doesn't cut it. Try facts for a change.

Why is it that anyone who disagrees with many posters here is labled a PAB employee? Is that all you got?

Weak

Bathwater...

Luke....your endless, partisan spin on news stories finding fault with government claims suggests YOU are the one "drinking your own bathwater."

As a person concerned with public debt and governments maintaining a careful approach to spending tax revenue, you should be worried and asking some tough questions of this administration.

Partisan politics seem more important for you than the principals that you claim to espouse.

Buccarroo Bay...

So you are sayin' that BC Public Accounts, which have been signed off by the BC Auditor-General, and by Chris Trumpy, the respected (by all parties) deputy minister of finance, and approved by the NDP in committee are now spin???

Methinks that both you and Jimmy Laroux should join forces and open up your own dual accounting practice. :D

Could mean big bucks for you two guys. NOT! ;)

what kind of facts hap?

This kind maybe:

from the corp's own survey: 40 percent of passengers in 2008 were either dissatisfied or very dissatisfied with the value of money for fares, according to B.C. Ferries customer satisfaction survey released June 17. That's up from 28 percent of passengers who felt that way in 2005.

Great progess I'd say!

Similarly, while 46 percent were satisfied or very satisfied with the value they got for their fares in 2005, the number who felt that way dropped to 36 percent in 2008.

I think Hahn's definitely losing this battle - although from the corp's press release you'd never know it.

Facts like those are interesting too, don't you think?

Chris Trumpy!

My isn't that special!!

I guess you know Trumpy is sort of under a cloud too for his involvement in the BCRail fiasco.

Maybe better get a new hero my friend.

Document 00290224 to 0029238 and 0020071 to 0020085: titled "BC Railway Company Partnership Process Round Two Evaluation Criteria Background for Presentation to Cabinet for Decision" dated July 23, 2003.

The Mackay/Berardino letter goes on to say: The RCMP have advised that they would like to interview Garry [sic] Collins, David Morehart, Judith Reid, Chris Trumpy and Yvette Wells in relation to the above documents.

No wonder he took retirement.

Luke...........

Luke everyone of your links you posted has those words under the title .......in brackets.........

Just like this .....(Unaudited)

As for my good friend Chris Trumpy,he is running for the hills and..........

Lo and behold,for the first time in a decade........

There is no forcast allowance?How come?.......
Yes or no Luke,is last years budget going to have a 50 million$ surplus,is this years deficit going to have only 395 million$ deficit?
Well?
Answere this question Luke..........

Hypatheticaly,if the deficit from last year is over a billion dollars and if the deficit forcast for this year (we may find out in september) is well over 2 billion$ dollars should Gordon Campbell and Colin Hansen RESIGN?

A simple yes or no answere is required.

As for you lumping me in with Jimmy_Laroux I consider it an honour.........

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Cheers

A little more about your friend luke

...McCullough, representing former ministerial aide Bob Virk, alleged in court that senior government Deputy Minister Chris Trumpy and then-BC Rail vice-president Kevin Mahoney worked together to "stifle" a freedom of information request to access the transaction documents in the BC Rail deal.

Hmmm!

Buccarroo Bay...

From Keith Baldrey:

Sure you guys might now wanna dump on Baldrey, for whatever partisan reason.

But Chris Trumpy?

Speaks volumes about your motives. :D

Yowza! ;)

West

"I could care less what some dumb survey says..."

Apparently not!

But you're right, it is a dumb survey. We can all cherry pick what we want to advance our POV can't we?

But I'm not getting into a pointless roundy-round. I have to run, so I'll just leave the one question I asked earlier which has gone unanswered, frenchies rantings about dead orphans notwithstanding:

Are the new ferries in full operation, yes or no?

Cheers

@ buccaneer bay

Cheers! :)

happy -

don't know...

luke

I happen to know Trumpy personally...and I think it's a shame he let his once good name be tarred by his association with the Campbell clique...but that's what happened - anyone who touches the tar baby gets dirty.

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT.

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

as for your other quote

Baldrey hasn't got much of a podium to stand on when it comes to partisanship now does he?

And happy, forgive me for mentioning that you were the one who brought up the survey - to wit the part that was listed in Hahn's press release....

You know the one about the '86% approval'!

@ G West

In what way has it been tarred? And, as a civil servant, is it not his duty to work with whichever government is in power?

The allegation

The allegation at the trial is that he colluded with an attempt to frustrate the legal intent and purpose of the Freedom of Information Act...

All civil servants also take an oath to respect the law - not just their political bosses.

G West...

During the 1990's, the RCMP recommended criminal charges against former NDP premier Dave Barrett as well as former NDP cabinet minister and 1990's crown secretariat chair Bob Williams arising out of the NCHS swindle.

Ya don't think that's a tad bit more serious? ;)

G West..

Bmffff. Lawyers make all sorts of idiotic allegations in the courtroom. That's comedic. It's IRRELEVANT.

Especially the National Enquirer case that you are referring to.

@ G West

Oh, I see. I had not read your post above.

Trumpy

Was a civil servant - not a politician.

There is a difference.

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

G West...

Be careful. No charges of hanky panky against Trumpy that I am aware of.

Perhaps you enjoy the court room musings of lawyers too much?

Read again luke - read again

I never wrote that there were!

In fact, it was you who implied that Trumpy's imprimatur somehow legitimated Campbell and Company's lies.

Remember?

Now

Perhaps we can get back to the subject at hand - to wit: (a) the financial misnmanagement of the British Columbia economy; (b) the deception of the electorate prior to the recent general election; (c) the magnitude of the deficit and the accumlated debt accrued under the Campbell regime.

Among other things.

erratum

that's "mismanagement"

G West...

I can also go to trial and have a lawyer allege that "G West" did stuff, which is immaterial to the proceedings and also without any definitive evidence.

You remind me of many folk who view lawyers as "Gods". :D

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]
BTW, do you subscribe to the National Enquirer??? REALLY???

Boy, you're a patient person..

with Luke, G West. He's really quite annoying and not very intelligent.

Some BC voters are lemmings

Message to BC voters.You wanted these clowns back in well,you got your wish.

Hey G West

I agree with sunshine coast girl; you do show remarkable patience with Luke. You DO post logical, on point comments and I thank you for that.

brg61...

And I agree brg61, you also DO post logical on point comments and I also thank-you for that! ;)

Glittering Generalities

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

One of the classic ingredients in propaganda writing is the "glittering generality", the great claims of progress, etc., under the favoured regime. Turned around, it becomes the the "ominous generality", and in some instances the "drumbeat factoid", and we get several examples here:

Man, the former BC NDP and Ontario NDP governments have the worst historical financial reputation in that regard.

From a ~$17 billion debt in 1991 to a ~$34 billion debt in 2001... a doubling of same.

... and BC was one of the highest taxed jurisdications in North America at the time...

... and BC was at the bottom rung of the Canadian provincial ladder in all material economic/investment performance tests...

This latter claim is pure BS.

[PERSONALLY IDENTIFIABLE

[PERSONALLY IDENTIFIABLE INFORMATION REMOVED ALONG WITH PERSONAL SLIGHTS. -MODERATOR.]

when all else fails

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Of course

That simply underlines once again why some folks truly believe that on-line debate will never reach a level of either honesty or character as long as people are 'allowed' to post their so-called views anonymously.

Which is an argument I've seen you make quite effectively in some other places Rod.

I'm beginning to wonder if you're not right too!

Smelser...

Remember HSBC chief economist David Bond, the same guy who disparaged Campbell for moving to fast with his tax cuts in 2001???

Well, here's David Bond:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa4014/is_200201/ai_n9028727/?tag=untagged

Again, you may call BS on David Bond but that's your perogative. ;)

G West...

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

David Bond

You mean the fella who was sacked by HSBC and who also said the following about your heroes?

David Bond had his HSBC Bank of Canada contract terminated after he suggested that Campbell could not implement his tax cuts without creating a huge deficit. No one in the business community came to Bond's defence, not then, or even now that his forecast has come to pass. "I could be tempted to say, 'I told you so,' but I shouldn't," a vindicated but still bitter Bond said after Collins announced the coming cuts. "After all, Mr. Collins, who was saying there wouldn't be a deficit, is a certified flight instructor and all I've got is a PhD in economics."

Now what was it you were saying?

[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

G West....

Thanks for backing me up!!!

There ya go. After disparaging Campbell for moving too fast with his tax cuts in 2001, some unhappy folk made their voice known behind the scenes.

That certainly adds further credibility to Bond's assessment of the NDP government of the 1990's.

Thanks buddy!! :D

Luke...........

I asked you a direct question earlier and I am still waiting for your response....

I will repeat the question and wait patiently for your response.

The question) If it turns out that BC had a 1 billion$ plus deficit last year and a 2 to 3 billion dollar deficit this year should Colin Hansen and Gordon Campbell resign yes or no?

If no please give the reasons why you think they shouldn`t resign.

I remember it well

Release Date: 26 March 1997

VANCOUVER, BC>>> "In addition to failing to meet the Debt Management Plan targets, the B.C. government is adding to the total provincial debt by continuing to run deficits and by spending 'off-line'," said Fraser Institute executive director Michael Walker, in reaction to the NDP government's budget, tabled yesterday. Total provincial debt increased by $648 million in 1996/97, and will increase by $1.44 billion in 1997/98.

Spending
Spending per person in B.C. is $521 higher than the average of the other nine provinces. "The B.C. government has announced a token spending decrease of $131 million, when a decrease of $2.1 billion is necessary to get B.C.'s per person spending down to the average," added Dr. Walker.

British Columbia is the only province that had an increase in inflation adjusted spending between 1995/96 and 1996/97. The average decrease in spending in the other nine provinces was 4%, while spending in B.C. increased by 1.4%; the 1997/98 budget released yesterday shows a spending decrease of 2.4%. Still, the average decline in spending for the other provinces will likely outstrip B.C.'s, as Quebec and Ontario are on track to make their deficit reduction targets.

"Off-line" spending, which shows up mainly as increases in the debt of the Crown Corporations, is a large proportion of total spending in B.C. In 1997/98, debt issues for spending on ferries, highways, and transit will be $473 million. Debt issues for spending on schools and hospitals will be another $442 million. The worst example of "off-line" spending is for B.C. Hydro, which expects an $89 million increase in debt and will contribute $373 million to the government's general revenue fund.

"In other words, the provincial government is forcing B.C. Hydro to accept more debt when Hydro could have decreased its debt by $284 million," said Joel Emes, research economist at the Fraser Institute.

Provincial Tax Rate
The provincial government often claims that British Columbians have one of the lowest tax bills in the country. This claim, however, is not based on all the taxes that we pay. When indirect taxes are included -- liquor and tobacco taxes, license fees, corporate taxes that get passed along as higher prices, and Crown Corporation profits -- the average B.C. family has the highest tax burden in the country. The "Provincial Tax Rate" (B.C. government revenue per dollar of gross provincial product) has risen from 18.9% in 1992/93 to 21.8% in 1996/97, a 15% increase."

Thank god that's now ancient history.

And it did create a huge deficit

Remember?

The 2001 tax cuts.....

The tax cuts created a huge deficit which Campbell clawed back by doubling MSP premiums (That brought in an extra 1.2 billion).....

And tuition revenue(from students) doubled from 475 million to 950 million dollars.

25 court houses were closed,9 prisons shut down,now we have gang killings daily and an open drug bazzaar in BC......

177 schools closed and in the the election campaign Campbell dangled day care for young children,which was a big deal for families with both parents who can`t afford the tax load and daycare.......

And the new minister of education Mcdirmiad has said the daycare is off the table for multible reasons,it would cost 1/2 billion a year,a 1000 caregivers would have to be hired and there is no where to put them,they would have to build new facilities,gee,id only all those schools weren`t bulldozed.......

That`s Campbells legacy,that and being the biggest tax and spender and debtor in BC history!

And now we're well into another one

Deficit I mean.

Which is, after all, the subject of this thread...not that you care luke....

Lies upon lies upon lies.....as I pointed out time and time again...this government couldn't care less about anything other than their small circle of friends; they don't care about the law, they don't care about the people and they don't care about the truth.

but

As a wag once said...arguing over the internet is like competing in the Special Olympics - even if you win, you're still retarded!

So g'night luke, g'night r/man

David Bond

I used to see David Bond at APEBC meetings, and once at an SFU gathering. I think he's in Alberta now.

I find it typical of the PAB-propagandist mindset that they keep their own identity secret while trolling the web for anything they can find about someone who uses their actual name. Maybe my home phone number and address will appear in a future PAB posting.

I am a shop steward for CAPE. So what? [EDITED. -MODERATOR.]

G West...

Well damn it, G West, if only the BC NDP was elected we coulda had another $3 billion added to BC's debt on top of the debt promulgated by those pesky Libs:

http://thetyee.ca/News/2009/04/10/NDPPlatform/

I ask... What the hell is wrong with BC'ers... ???? ;)

Smelser...

Oooopppsss... Yuppers, My own home office situate on the beach. Ya know, me, myself, and I?? :D
[EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULT. -MODERATOR.]

Campbell is a dirty rotten son of a bitch

So here comes the the new found savings,Campbell really cares about kids eh.........
Disabled welfare kids have just found out that Campbell has cut funding that paid summer camp fees,no summer camp for poor children eh.......

And how much did that program cost last year? 360.000.00 $ or 1/3 of a million dollars..........WOW

What else was cut,no more goverment condoms for prostitutes,WOW,another 100.000.00 a year,how much will that move cost Bc health authorities......

Here is the link---Fuck you Campbell

http://www.vancouversun.com/Life/Disabled+welfare+kids+miss+summer+camp+after+funds+froze/1710609/story.html

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one thing is true

Luke's cheerleading garners a great deal of attention. I think that I will begin counting his postings. For every posting he makes here, I will write to a different newspaper or online source to spread truths that the BC Liberals so clearly wish to hide. Perhaps some others can do the same. We can become a volunteer PAB.

Buccee

It seems like only yesterday when you were up the coast a couple of bays and fascinated with tutu's. I might go into deficit spending here but what the heck, everyone does; I think you should have one since Campbellwearsatutu, as you reminded us, you should too.

Do you have a P.O. box up there?

Pink OK? I mean, it is the classic.

http://tiny.cc/8MbkL

Rman......

Yea I do,and who knows when I will get blocked again,blocked for swearing,threatening,intimidating,blocked for enciting terrorism,for being liableous,blocked for being too damn sexy,but mainly been blocked for exposing the truth!.......

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

I repeat "happy"

over a one year period the new german ferry that took one third of a billion out of the bc economy so your hero could attack unions (and of course, women, children, and the disabled, you know, all those nasty people that are STEALING from you) was tied up every time I went through swartz bay. What the ferry was doing on your website, I really don't particularly care...And it was tied up because, yes, you're damned right the german ferries are being "eased in." They're being eased in because they're badly designed and a waste of taxpayer dollars that the liberals didn't want to become obvious right before the provincial election.

And I don't know if you or luke ARE PAB or not, nor do I care...[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]. As far as I'm concerned neoliberalism is a form of parasitic psychopathy which should be treated as soon as possible before the odious infection spreads -we all know damned well what it's done to the states, what a disaster, a social infection, masquerading nauseatingly as a virtue it is, and the enormous harm it's done to all but the richest 5% to everything it's ever touched, but, most damnably of all to innocent children. [OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

Luke & Buck

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Camero409

You got it! They are. Just reading through the long rubbish postings from them on this would make that pretty clear. Hansen lies, but that's OK. They got elected by fraud, but that's OK, The debt is now greater, but that's OK too. Ask them to answer one question honestly and they duck, copy, paste and weave then change the subject.

Amen, Frenchy...

Sometimes people get so carried away with computers they forget to use their EYES!

"Provincial Tax Rate
The provincial government often claims that British Columbians have one of the lowest tax bills in the country. This claim, however, is not based on all the taxes that we pay. When indirect taxes are included -- liquor and tobacco taxes, license fees, corporate taxes that get passed along as higher prices, and Crown Corporation profits -- the average B.C. family has the highest tax burden in the country."

Forgive me RMan if I point out that this sounds like it could have been written yesterday!!

Funny in a twisted kind of way

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

frenchie

Last week I crossed on one of those new ferries and sat in the front lounge where the sloping windows give one a strikingly beautiful view of the part of the best place on earth. There was a large group of children on board too, They seemed very happy running around and exploring this magnificent vessel, laughing and lounging on the upper deck. It was great to see these happy cosmopolitan young BC'ers enjoying life. Tomorrow's leaders, a bit noisy but we probably were too at their age. Sometimes we all need to remind ourselves - Life is good! Cheer up matey, go for a cruise on one of these ships and soak up your good fortune.

soyez joyeux!

sunshine girl

Yes, it was the state of the tax burden under the NDP in the 90's. As you say taxes are still too high. I agree with you, we should all press our MLAs to work on lowering taxes ASAP!

time opens all wounds

"They seemed very happy running around and exploring this magnificent vessel, laughing and lounging on the upper deck. It was great to see these happy cosmopolitan young BC'ers enjoying life."

Wait until they get a bit older and see the economic, social and environmental bills they'll have to pay due to the current gov't. That's gonna wipe the cheery grins right off their apple-cheeked faces.

Mind you Rman..

That was written before the Libs took over, cut our provincial taxes and then proceeded to tax and charge user fees for everything else! Never mind selling everything that wasn't nailed down. And they still can't balance the budget!

I miss the 90's.

Oops!

Forgot to add left us with a staggering debt for the rest of our lives! Those poor kids you saw on the ferry.

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED.

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

The Propagandist at Work

[OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

r-man, oh they were laughing and

lounging because the chocolate ration had just been increased and everything was double plus good! Yes, I've heard the new ferries are superficially luxurious, but that still doesn't change the fact they are badly built and designed, -what was it a month it took even to get the first one operational? And a double openended design is a pretty stupid choice for public safety period. And the $1.44 billion deficit -let's see One billion at least lost by building the ferries outside of bc counting pay roll, income and other taxes paid that would have gone to bc, a continuation of the ship building that built the excellent LOW MAINTEANCE SPIRIT VESSELS, -that's starting to approach the $1.44 billion deficit the vaqncouver sun tried to hide by printing the information in the business section, instead of on the front page in two inch headlines, where it belonged. (Very similar to what the victoria times colonist did with the news that bc's gdp growth in 2008 was a minus.3%, second lowest in canada after ontario's.)

Fortunately the news of campbell's disastrous econmic management in producing a $1.44 billion dolar deficit was published in vancouver's 24 hours, the third largest hard copy newspaper in bc, so there's a bit of limited comfort.

And, now, just as I said in my last post all the bc "liberal's current cuts are saving pennies, for a provincial government, but carefully targetting the most vulnerable as usual. Their first cut was the van that provides condoms, hot coffee, and bad trick info to what have to be the most vulnerable women in bc, the working women, or street prostitutes if you prefer, of the downtown eastside. This has to be not merely one of the basest and morally shocking decisions (especially after the picton trial) but one of the most grossly stupid as well, as the condom distribution lessens disease in mainstream comunities, males from which are often the girl's customers. The van also keeps track of the women if they should go missing. To give people like this a push to save $10,000 is simply beyond obscene.

The most recent target is summer camp for children with disabilities and children of the poor, just cut by mr sensitive, rich colemann, who as usual is cowardly unavailable for comment. This is causing quite a stir on one thread of the opinion section of the online edition of the vancouver sun, and some of the reactionary comments are truly horrifying. I still have seen no mention of the premier's $1.44 deficit on the globe and mail bc, as ian bailey promised me after hanging up as quickly as he could on wednesday, it was not in the globe bc in thursday's hard copy, at least not in the bc section, although there was a puff piece on campbell "Fixing" EI -god help ei...

Good point Rod

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Luke Sidewinder

I rather like the photo you've somehow copied from Facebook, but I am not amused by the general tone of your last two messages. [OFFENSIVE COMMENT DELETED. -MODERATOR.]

And yes, I do ride my bike up to Alouette Lake. I regret I haven't had time for it this Spring because I have been doing things around my late parent's home in Victoria, the home you see in the photo.

Luke

Luke, your attack makes no sense. Is there any point to it? Is this how G. Campbell is defended?

Ohhh.. I NEVER Attack... I Just "RESPOND"

And Rod, ya have alot of explaining to do about my previous posting vis-a-vis Usenet.

REALLY.

That "Sony Entertainment" response from years ago has a certain "stalking" smell to it.

And I am not amused... and I'm sure others aren't as well.

Remember, with your pithy comments, ya asked for it.

If ya REALLY knew me, I'm the fairest guy in then world, but that's irrelevant now.

Time for Bed

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Schmelzer....

You need to deal with your problems dude. SERIOUSLY!

You certainly are sensitive and insecure.

Perhaps a SHRINK might be in order? ;)

Pity the provincial Auditor-General

So you are sayin' that BC Public Accounts, which have been signed off by the BC Auditor-General, and by Chris Trumpy, the respected (by all parties) deputy minister of finance, and approved by the NDP in committee are now spin???

Even the Auditor-General for BC doesn't get to see everything, Luke.

Where in your links provided do you see any contract guarantees to InTransit BC, RAV, Canada Line, Protrans BC or any other entity that is guaranteeing the $1.5 - 2.3 billion debt incurred by this project? It isn't in there.

Yet it has to be there, because no financing entity - not even hedge funds - would touch a shell corporation like InTransit BC that had only a single asset - a contract to operate the line for 30 years - when it hadn't even been designed yet. Even MacQuarrie would only take on $600 million, and they insisted on securities offered by a guarantor - who we were also not permitted to know the name of.

And yet there HAD to be a guarantee, because BCIMC, the investment management group for many of BCs public pension funds, wouldn't have been permitted to invest in such a private placement without such a guarantee, because the pro-forma showed no possibility of return.

There's a $1.5 - 2.3 Billion debt that doesn't show up on the books that the people of BC are all responsible for, Luke. Why don't you go ask Gollum.... er.... Campbell where the GAAP rules are on this debt?

Incidentally, Chris Trumpy, who I have tremendous respect for, left under no cloud, which indicates that he was shut out of a decision taken on his behalf. And it's a decision that Brendan Dyck, one of the union trustees of the BCIMC advisory board likely knows quite a bit about as he was forced to leave a meeting at which this was discussed due to conflict. There's been dirty dealings with our provincial taxpayer's funds, not to mention our pension funds, and our public servants and trustees have been held hostage to it.

And the evidence is in the new operator with the brand new top-secret contract with a top-secret guarantor.

Imagine if the Coquihalla or the fast ferries were built with this level of business secrecy that prevented a true understanding of the damage the government of the day was doing to the finances of the province.

I think you owe us all, but especially Morfitt, Van Irsel and especially John Doyle an apology for your callous disrespect for their abilities. It's entirely unreasonable to expect an auditor whose budget has been slashed in real terms to uncover the crimes of a government bent on concealing them.

Just in case you can't remember...

Here are the 2007-8 figures from John Doyle.

Highways, ferries and public transit

BC Transportation Financing Authority $3,948,000,000
British Columbia Transit $84,000,000
Public transit $897,000,000
SkyTrain extension $1,153,000,000

Total $6,082,000,000

And just in case you want to play ignorant, that "Skytrain extension" above is for the RTP 2000 project - the Millennium line.

Good stuff Zalm......

Of course anyone with half a brain knows the books are cooked.
What about the golden ears bridge tolls,why so late in the game did Translink have to guarantee millions in tolls,what kind of P3 is that?

Have you noticed there is no Golden ears bridge cam,I`ve looked,funny,guess no one wants the public to see an empty bridge.

How did Translink need year over year an extra 150 million just to maintain service levels,not infrastructure,service..

The Canada line is automated,a new sea bus and a handful of busses,how many employees does 150 million per year pay for? thats like 1500 employees.
This Campbell goverment is up to its eyeballs in debt,look at some of these cuts......
Summer camp for poor kids(360.000.00$ per year)--Condom van(100.000.00$ per year)...And
No interest LOANS for leaky condo owners(who want to repair them) has been cancelled.
How much can that interest cost,think about the economic activity.

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Here are the stories

http://www.vancouversun.com/story_print.html?id=1211646&sponsor=

That first story has details on the toll structure for the golden ears bridge,about halfway through the story.......

But what I find very interesting on the toll structure that Translink has guaranteed is.......
Why the amount that Translink is going to pay is 360.000.00$ per month this year,rising to 5.000.000.00$ per month by 2011 ? An increase of 1500% in 2 years?.....
Could they be trying to hide debt in this fiscal year by diverting it to 2011?

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/fp/Leaky+condo+owners+left+scambling+repair+loans+after+provincial+well+runs/1714590/story.html

This second story is interesting as well....
The Provincwe states because of the slowdown in construction they can`t afford to LOAN people money to repair their leaky condos,but the interesting part is that the province was charging 700.00$fee per residential unit that was being used to fund the program.So really,it wasn`t the province funding it anyway,it was home buyers funding it,sounds a lot like who shot john.

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

Tyee editors:

Can't you ban Luke Skywalker? He's quite offensive and doesn't contribute much to discussion anyway. That exchange with Rod Smelser was downright creepy and threatening, in my opinion.

sunshine coast girl

I'm inclined to agree - and I've just sent an email to the editors echoing your words.

If Ya Dish It Out, Ya Also Have to Take It....

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Attention: Public Affaris Bureau

Please look at Luke Skywalker's entries. Are his the kind of remarks that our Premier wants to have representing the BC Liberal Party? For me, his are the kind of remarks that make me wish to work very hard to publish the truth about the BC Liberals' mismanagement of the public purse and lack of compassion for children, seniors and lower income people. If you happen to know Luke, please let it be known in your circles that his remarks are of the ilk that cause more harm than good for the BC Liberal cause.

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Re-Reading the posts

There is no doubt that this story,these comments,have pissed off the upper brass of the Campbell regime..........

Obviously the PAB was forced to smell Gordon Campbell`s pink underwear,look at the tactic.......
Remember the leaked email about question period at the legislature.....

"It`s question period not answere period"

"Deflect the question and attack"

The tsunami is coming Gordon Campbell,the people are onto you,your failed policies,your lies,your sadistic attacks upon children,you will rot in hell along with Colin Hansen and many more minions,a peaceful olympics.......

Dream on,bring on the revolution!

frenchy mcswede...

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I just had the misfortune of seeing

the new vancouver convention center and I must say it is definitely one of the most breathtakingly UGLY buildings I have ever had the bad luck to come across. My first reaction is that they had taken the slightly triangular front of many mega grocery stores and blown up the design 600 times.

Upon more mature reflection, I realized a more accurate description would be that it appeared as if an enormous, piccassoid, rectangular and triangular cubist dog, the size of, oh, say shaughnessy and west van combined, had taken an enormous, brobdignabbian CUBIST DUMP and deposited massive steaming piles of glass laden rectangles and triangles upon the innocent precincts of vancouver's waterfront. So this is what the "liberals" do with 850 million. What a literal waste of space...it looks like they resurrected the ghost of a nazi architect from the 1936 olympics...beyond a shadow of a doubt the ugliest structure I ever seen, and HUGE to the point of terminal redundancy, (or rehaps redunDUNCEy if you catch my drift) although, like the german ferries, it may be nice inside... it was fronted by a policeman on foot who looked as though he had a lifetime job there, even as our streets overflow with crime...definitely a sight to induce projectile vomitting in a saint, see for yourself, bring airline sickness bags...

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How about the 2010 Deficit

I got the 2008 Deficit Right On
now lets guess how much the 2010 is going to BE? Scary you might think but its all in where you put your trust and your money. And right now British Columbians have neither,.

Liberal and PAB methodology

"Great is truth, but still greater, from a practical point of view, is silence about truth. By simply not mentioning certain subjects... totalitarian propagandists have influenced opinion much more effectively than they could have by the most eloquent denunciations."
...Aldous Huxley

"downright creepy and threatening"

Quote:

"Can't you ban Luke Skywalker? He's quite offensive and doesn't contribute much to discussion anyway. That exchange with Rod Smelser was downright creepy and threatening, in my opinion."

Totally agree, sunshine coast girl.

And isn't Luke's publishing of private photos without consent an illegal act?

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private lives

You see, Luke Skywalker, when you open that box...then we would have to look at all the private lives of BC Liberals, too. Are you up for it?

To paraphrase Trudeau: "the state does not belong in the bedrooms of the citizens of this country."

I think you are employing a smear tactic to distract from the topic of this thread which is: the massive I.4 billion dollar deficit ran by the BC Liberal government in BC.

I also think you are trying to attempt to engage Mr. Smelser in a fight so he (and consequently his pro-NDP posts) will be banned from this site.

You are not fooling anyone by these tactics...even if you think you are.

Again, let's get back to this article's topic: the massive 1.4 billion dollar deficit ran by the present BC Liberal government in BC.

Luke........

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Buccarroo Bay...

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the object of Luke's obfuscation

The point of the story is that the the BC Liberals' produced a grossly inaccurate budget and they have failed to talk about it. Further, the MSM have virtually ignorred this. The Sun buried it and their heading was cryptic. It did not mention the BC Liberals nor the amount of the deficit. There was nothing on Global, CTV, nor even CBC as far as I could see (though I could not watch but one channel at a time.)

Words of wisdom for Luke and the BC Liberals: "Pot, Kettle, Black"

Luke's work

If he can't shoot the message, he attempts to shoot (or in this case, smear) the messenger. Luke tried to do the same to me on an earlier thread. He wrongly tried to smear my credibility. Though I took the time to show both Luke and Tyee readers that he was wrong to make such claims, I believe that he is not worth our time. I wish to congratulate the majority of posters here for writing fine heart felt words. Please continue posting, as i enjoy your insights. That said, I believe much of our time could be better spent writing to (local) papers about the failings of this government. Perhaps the Frasier Valley would be a good place to start. I think the truth about Campbell needs to be posted there.

SIG...

Reread this again... ya might learn something:

And the beloved NDP wants to do this:

http://thetyee.ca/News/2009/04/10/NDPPlatform/

So what are ya complaining about?

That the BC NDP will put BC another $3 billion into the hole? :D

SIG...

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I re-itterate for luke

Luke, I think you have to open your heart and mind. I know that it can be tough with your father be Darth and all, but you have to try. Perhaps you missed too many behavioural therapy sessions with O. B-1 Kenobi.

On another thread Luke made remarks about my character that one could construe as negative. That thread has closed but it is related to this thread, so I respond here.

Luke Said:

"You're certainly an individual full of hate. Typical mindset of hard core left-wing NDP'ers IMHO. I feel sorry for ya."

We must be clear, To the best of my knowledge, I have never said I hate any person at any time in my life. However, I would go so far as to say I do hate certain specific behaviours and behaviour patterns I have witnessed put forward by this Liberal Government. I also have hate for the results of many of the BC Liberals' policies.

I hate having a premier that was drinking and driving let alone be caught doing it. I hate watching child poverty, alcoholism, drug abuse and violence increase under this Campbell government. I hate watching BC's resources and services being sold off (privatized) and farmed out to wealthy corporations (often owned and controlled by foreigners): BC Forest TFL licenses BC Rail, BC Hydro, BC Gas, BC Ferry contracts, and accounting, book-keeping and record-keeping services, net-pen salmon farms killing the native stock. I hate having our government conduct our business in secret, while it hire hires hundres of PAB readers and writers to manage public opinion.

I don't hate Campbell nor the BC Liberal elite nor their bootlicks; I wish them no harm just in the same way I wish no-harm to pedophiles and drunken drivers. If a person has been proven to be a pedophile I will never trust him or her alone with children. If a person has been a drunken driver, I will never trust him or her with the keys to my car. It is my belief that the Liberals have a pattern of destroying, pillaging and murdering the province of BC and I don't trust them. I hate what they have been doing with this beautiful place.

to be continued...

Luke's unlearnt lesson, a reposting

Luke said I was "fraudulant". Luke also said, "So ya said that you were gonna leave BC after the election and move to Nova Scotia. So much for your credibility. :D"

My credibility is intact, Luke. You have to be careful not to make assumptions. It weighs on your credibility. I will be moving to Nova Scotia.

As stated in a post I made some time ago, I will remind you, my lovely wife and I are professionals with school-aged children. Our kids do well in school. You wouldn't expect us to move them just before the end of a school year, would you? Our being successful community-oriented people, you must realize it naturally takes us a while to unhook gracefully from our long-term commitments to our employers, various boards and societies, sell our real estate in a down market, purchase a new home and secure new employment. Fret not, and slow down, Luke. It has barely been a month since I said I would leave for Nova Scotia, and you are trying to trash my good name for not having left yet. We will be leaving for Nova Scotia. I never gave you a time-line. You deserve nothing from me.

We have already purchased property. We have already secured a Nova Scotia mailing address and I have purchased a vehicle that is waiting for my return to Nova Scotia. I was deadly serious about leaving.

I was truthful when I said that I love this province too much to bear watching it be trashed by Gordon Campbell and his bootlicks. It is obvious to me that my beliefs are not in line with the slight majority of voters who bothered to vote in this province. I'm not as young as I once was, and I haven't the energy to continually fight this battle. I am moving to a polite land that is steeped in history and politeness. Luke, you and your kind can have your privatized BC.

Wanna buy a good house? If you buy my home, you can get rid of me all the quicker, Luke. Even when I am gone, from BC, I'll still send money to the Tyee, and I'll check in every once in awhile. Perhaps I can help Mr. Beers & his associates open an Atlantic Canada branch.

The Campbell government and the associated bootlicks are the frauds. Luke.

SIG...

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Thanks for the link, Luke

I hope everyone rereads the link, Luke.
I was particularly proud of the entire extended metaphor (typos and all).

I belong to no political party, nor have I ever received pay nor any other compensation from a political party. I have volunteered, however. I volunteer right now that the NDP have always governend this party far better than Campbell and his bootlicks. The BC Liberals are a disgrace.

Luke...........

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SIG....

Are you for REAL?? :D

I guess I better re-iterate another of my previous postings:

From the well-respected former HSBC chief economist David Bond after the NDP was turfed; (YES, he was even respected within the NDP. Go figure. :D)

Read again. CAREFULLY.

Again, ya just might learn something. ;)

Buccarroo Bay...

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Luke we are......

Not talking about the NDP,we are talking about the 3 billion dollar budget deficit,last years deficit.....

get out of the past

Wake up,smell the coffee

answer questions!!!!!!!!!!

@ Luke Skywalker

If the NDP proposes tax cuts which will increase the deficit, a “stimulus” to business in hard times, you seem upset. In 2001, your Fearless Leader tacked roughly 4 billion dollars onto BC’s debt. Some of this new debt was a result of tax cuts. My question is this: was Gordon Campbell wrong in 2001, or is he wrong now? Are you only an economic liberal when it comes to years when the NDP is in power?

Luke

Wrong again, buddy.

Quote:

For the last five years, the population growth rate has been declining, net interprovincial migration has turned negative and the number of head offices based in Vancouver has steadily gone down.

Your buddy Jock Finlayson and his BC Business Council reported a study in 2006 that showed that the period from 1999-2005 continued its slide, driving business out of BC pointing out that the number of major head offices in this period crashed to 38 from 54, and the worse yet, head office employment was the worst in the Canada, crashing by 29% in this period!

I guess the BC Fiberals weren't so good at creating the business climate they said they would huh? Lower taxes just didn't do it? High land prices didn't help business - it drove it out, huh?

http://www.bcbc.com/Documents/EC_200612_CorporateHeadOffices.pdf

There are so many gaps in this study's conclusions that it's laughable, but the facts are based on StatsCan and, frankly, all I can do when I read them is laugh at you and your silly diatribes as you hang everything from Big Mining's demise and Nortel's bankruptcy to sunspots on the NDP.

Gordo's heading into a 4-6 year period of very bad business for resource-based countries; he's staring doom in the face wondering how he's going to get out of trouble, and the answer, like Gollum looking for the ring, simply won't come to him. He's about to find out that the worm of global economy turns on the righteous libertarian and the righteous socialist alike. And Gord, having sold off so many assets, now hasn't the resources - whether tax-based, income-based or otherwise - to weather this terrible storm that has just crashed onto our beautiful beaches.

But you don't get it. You'd rather play petty politics than admit that maybe one side doesn't have all the answers. You're a joke, and I for one, and quite sure you're NOT with the PAB. They have some standards, however low, and you don't.

By the way, I'm still waiting for your apology to the BC Provincial Auditor too.

SIG

Still moving to Nova Scotia, huh? That's starting to look like the promised land, especially of late.

For one thing there are no really, really large and wasteful hospitals like VGH there.... which is always a good thing.

Wow!

Pretty spooky exchange between Smelser and "Luke Skywalker" above.

Those poor Tyee moderators are gonna just *LOVE* sorting through this thread.

@ Luke Skywalker

You bring this up over and over again. I'll repeat a reply I gave on a previous thread.

As BC’s economy waned in the late nineties, some people moved out the province. It’s interesting to note, however, that BC’s population grew much faster under the NDP than it has under the Liberals.

Between 2006 and 2001, BC grew by 5.3%.
Between 2001 and 1996, BC grew by 4.9%.
Between 1991 and 1996, BC grew by 13.5%.

http://www.bcstats.gov.bc.ca/data/cen06/c2006bc.asp

Similarly, Vancouver’s population grew much faster in the early nineties that it has since, and the growth in the late nineties is not terribly off the current growth.

http://cuer.sauder.ubc.ca/cma/data/Population/population-pctgrowth-vancouver.pdf

Would you say this strong population growth is a sign of a strong economy, or a weak one?

Wish I was moving

to Nova Scotia.

Vancouver Head Office Growth/Employment

VANCOUVER

Head offices

2002: 74

2007: 80

+8.1%

Head office employment

2002: 14,515

2007: 17,852

+23.0%

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Competing+with+Calgary+tale+cities/828634/story.html

Shaaaaaaaa.. zalm!

The Alabama/Mississippi of Canada??! 1000 comedians in this world and you're tryin' to be #1001. ;)

Yo Jimmy...

That's a statement from none other than former HSBC chief economist David Bond himself.

Frankly, I'd rather rely on his wisdom than any of your histrionics.

Sunshine and Zalm

After we get our Nova Scotia geothermal house built, you will always be welcome at our door. It will take a couple of years for me to get the job done; after all, I have to sell my BC home first, but I will be good for my word. There will be hot coffee or tea (and/or a cool beverage) and a meal waiting for you when you arrive.

SIG

@ Luke Skywalker

Can you really be so stupid? Really? It seems so. How sad.

The numbers I posted are from from BC Stats. They show a population growth rate which was far higher under the NDP. Bond is correct in stating that the "population growth rate has been declining" through the late nineties. But declining from a very high rate, in fact from a far higher rate than at any time since 2001. On avergae, the population of BC grew quite a bit faster while the NDP was in power than now. That's according to BC Stats.

Luke

The article you quote from regarding head offices was a comparison of Calgary and Vancouver. Once again you selectively cut and paste your data. Here is a bit more from the same article.
As a magnet for new head offices, Calgary leads Canada by the proverbial country mile. It’s total went from 68 in 2002 to 109 in 2006 — an astonishing 60.3-per-cent increase, almost three times the pace of second-place Edmonton. And the areas of growth were in things like communications and financial services, not just energy. You shouldn't be so selective with your data.

"Vancouver didn’t exactly snooze during this period, but we still managed to lose, at least in relative terms. We went from 74 head offices (six more than Calgary) in 2002 to 80 (29 fewer) in 2006. But that’s still a much better record than Toronto, Ottawa or Montreal, which all lost ground.

And

CALGARY

Head offices
2002: 68
2007: 109
+60.3%

Head office employment
2002: 16,167
2007: 20,175
+24.8%

VANCOUVER

Head offices
2002: 74
2007: 80
+8.1%
Head office employment
2002: 14,515
2007: 17,852
+23.0%"

You shouldn't be so selective with your data.

Umm! it tends not to lend itself to simplistic statements

Head Offices and British Columbia:

http://vancouver.ca/commsvcs/planning/corejobs/pdf/research/13headoffices.pdf

Nova Scotia

My brother, who was born and raised a Progressive Conservative lives in NS. Several months ago, I asked him about Dexter, the new NDP premier. My brother is not impressed with Harper nor the former PC premier. He said that Dexter is an "issues man." he discusses the issues and does not make ad hominiem attacks on his opponents. He showed the people that he cared about what they are concerned with.
Much unlike here in BC where we have a govt that does not want to discuss issues at all. The most classic case in the last election was the recognition and reconciliation legislation. There was draft legislation but it was withdrawn and not discussed at all during the election. An election campaign is the ideal time to discuss a piece of legislation but not in BC. MSM do not discuss it nor did they try. They just attacked the NDP because they had the audacity to call the BC Liberals on their record. Of course this was the plan of those running the BC Liberal campaign and the MSM - attack your opponents and don't discuss issues.
Of course this is still occurring in some circles.

Thanks SIG...

Get out the Digby clams and the rum because us CFA's are on the way!!!

North of Hope,

I know Darrell Dexter. He's just exactly like your favourite uncle. The man can walk into anybody's house and put everyone at ease. He listens when people talk. He doesn't attack. He's totally normal and the genuine article. We could use a few like him out here, that's for sure.

Golden ears bridge boondoggle......

Here is onther example of Gordon Campbell malfeasence.

Translink(BC goverment) had to sign financial guarantees to the consortium who built the bridge,here are some disturbing facts.....
#1) Translink will pay to the builders 316.198.00$ each month for maintenance/operation and re-hab

#2)Translink will pay to the builders 500.000.00$ each month for tolls (but only this year)

#3)The amount of money Translink pays to the builder each month rises to 4 million dollars each month in 2011 (plus 316.198.00$ maintenance each as well)

#4)The toll amount again rises to 5 million per month(plus 316.198.00% each month)

#5)The tax-payer also has to pay to collect/administer and operate toll collection through ICBC and motor vehicle

#6)Why are we the tax-payer on the hook for everything on a P3?

#7)If the bridge was to be profitable the P3 would just collect tolls but the builder did the exstrapolation of traffic volume and realized they would lose money

#8)Why is the amount Translink pays to the consortium(500.000.00$ each month) so low compared to what it is rising to in 2011(4 million per month)-It is an increase of 1000%

#9)Why is there no golden ears bridge cam? Translink doesn`t want people to see an empty bridge,even during rush hour

#10)To pay the builder 4.316.198.00$ by 2011(in 18 months)--The volume on the bridge will have to be 50 Thousand crossings daily

Presently even the port mann has only 130 thousand daily crossings,there is no way the golden ears bridge will come close to 50 thousand daily crossings.

So there is only 2 answers

#11) Translink will be bled dry by the bridge builder/or the toll amount is going to skyrocket

Could this be the reason the airwaves are being flooded with Translink ads asking for funding? Now we know why Translink is making the claim that they need 150 million more $$ each year JUST TO MAINTAIN CURRENT SERVICE LEVELS

Hang onto your hats folks-Translink is raising the already highest transit fares in Canada/adding a 150.00$ car levy/raising property taxes and adding 3 more cents per liter

Bill 42-The act-By law Translink can`t raise fares alone-They have to,by law raise property taxes/add 3 cents a liter and raise fares in tandem,none of those items can be done individualy.

Campbell Liberal malfeasence,you bet

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

sunshine coast girl and SIG

Please don't forget the lobster! And don't over cook them.

Wake up people......

What you going on is this,the Campbell Liberal goverment is/has created a de-facto taxation department doing it dirty work,raising taxes for the goverment,raising taxes in leaps and bounds yet Campbell.......

Is going to keep spouting off about low taxes in BC claiming it is not the goverment,it`s Translink..........

Have you noticed that Translink is paying(we the public are paying) for over-passes in Langley/bridge construction/road maintenace/including......

The pattullo bridge fire repair and re-paving the pattullo bridge,interesting,no busses even cross the pattullo bridge,with the exception of 2 late night crossing after skytrain shuts down each night.

Eventually,Translink under these phoney Liberals will be responsible for all road maintence,all bridges,all staging event costs for any lower mainland activity,what else is Campbell going to dump onto Translink`s plate? ...........

A de-facto taxation without representation undemocratic Translink,but don`t blame Translink,blame Campbell,where is the media,where are people`s brains,......

The same thing is happening with BC Hydro,a de-facto private power buying entity(being passed on to users)-At triple the going rate.........
Come on home owners,speak to truth,have you looked at the exhorbinet fees on your bill lately,two tier power/levies/there is like 6 different fees on your bill,and......
Why are people being punished for using hydro with this phony two tier power scheme?
People in my neck of the woods are burninh more firewood than ever,the reason,high utilities,my hydro bill has doulbled over the last 6 years.........
And,if we are building all these PRIVATE(for profit)RUN of RIVER they should be encouraging hydro use against firewood or even natural gas........

Wake up people

Cheers-Eyes Wide Open

Typical Luke Blue-skyer

Can't even quote the statistics correctly.

Don Cayo's statistics are unattributed, and therefore suspect. StatsCan on the other hand, as you are so fond of pointing out.....

What else would I expect from a bleepety-bleep nimrod gargley-gargle doofus flibbertygibbet space cadet like you?

You don't want to argue fact, you just want to insult and bluster. You're not worth the time.