Vancouver needs the criticism.

I've lived in Vancouver proper most of my life. Living here feels more and more like being stuck in a bad chamber of commerce video reel. The Olympic hype is not helping matters.

Passed through Portland briefly last September and liked what I saw. The downtown university area is quite pretty. The suburbs are older, and the real estate market is within reach of mere mortals. The tram system looks well-developed. Some of the suburbs across the river are very nice.

There's a big city feeling that Vancouver doesn't have, and access to the Pacific coast that doesn't involve a round trip on a ferry.

And wowza, are the taxes ever low.

I admire you Christine McLaren!

I have to admitt I have been to many places in teh world, however I have never been to Portland therefore I cannot say it's better or worst compare to Vancouver. Nontheless, I did live in Vancouver (Blandcouver) for well over a decade +, and it is truly a piece of sh*t. Many young people either seek for an opportunity to escape this city but cannot affort to or already has escape. Fortunately, I was one of them that manage to flee to another city to start a new and I thank god everyday for that chance. "Van-pride" people might think this is ridiculous and believe this is one of the best city in North America. In reality, it is rather because they lived here for a very long time. Psychologically, they are bound to believe it is the best. Some of my peers in Vancouver depise Vancouver with all their might, want to leave but have to stay and endure it up under family circumstances. Vancouver is also known as VANSHITTY as people might not known. Vancouver diguise itself to be an Angel, in reality it's a blackhole that pulls you in and spits you out.

I am sorry if I offended anyone, you might think I probably some random person who does not even live in Vancouver. But, I did and it was hell.

Close enough to Paradise :- )

Since my primary interest has always been forestry, I have for a long time looked in awe at Oregon State University's School of Forestry in Portland, which has long looked at tree as part of a forest and not as just another merchantable log.

Their approach has long made me ashamed of Canadian forestry, in particular the purely commercial orientation found at UBC's School of Forestry.

Semilarly, Oregon State's atitude toward tourism puts local values before those of commercial interests, the opposite of Vancouver's Board of Trade, Chamber of Commece orientation.

Wherever one looks one detects a Zeitgeist far different from our Canadian one and that found in other US States.

So, although I've only spent a week in Portland twenty years ago, Christine McLaren's portrayal of Portland is accurate enough for me.

cheap beer does not a city make

What drivel. Measuring a city on its cheap bars, cheap beer, happy hours and easy underemployment? Wow. You really do aim high.
Try doing something that doesn't involve getting drunk. That's where to begin a comparison of the two cities. Like:
Grouse Grind.
Our waterfont.
Beaches, including Wreck where there's regularly 10,000 naked people.
Loads of jobs (check CL).
3 ski hills you can take a city bus to.
Multiculturism.
Multicultural food - everywhere.
Unlike Portland, which is primarily white, boring America. It needs cheap beer.

It's gotta be the freeways

that run through the city. Yup, that's it. That's what makes Portland what it is.

Collect all 20! Swap them with your friends!

Well said, Glen. The statues are an abomination.

It's pathetic that what little real estate we have for public art is used to display something palatable to consumers. You can hardly blame the artists – for some, it's the only public exposure they'll get.

A far more intriguing idea would be to turn the space over to the artist and let them decide what to display. I'l bet even the tourists would appreciate it more.

Vancouver is a great place to live....

....if you are rich and dumb. Well that's what i used to say before i moved out to Ladner 11 years ago. Now i guess i need to update it to- if you are rich, dumb and old.

Like

A thoughtful, provocative and surprisingly accurate analysis. Just the kind of discussion that most people would probably like to contribute to. Years ago, I recall seeing discussions like this in our mainstream press. Now, thank god, we have internet publications like the Tyee. I have been to Portland more than once and it has always had less intrusive regulations. Somehow, BC has adopted the worst of US disapproval and UK nanny state supervision. How to break this cycle is the task. We begin with authors like Ms. McLaren. Fascinating.

I want to move to Portland

I just visited Portland last week, and I can attest to the awesome creative vibe and bike culture reported here. One thing I noticed is that of the dozens of cool bars all over Portland, many voluntarily close around midnight. This suggests to me that Vancouver's fear of re-creating mini-Granville Street abominations all over the city if they allow looser licensing restrictions is unfounded. It's often just more convenient for staff and better suited to neighbourhood needs to close shop at a reasonable hour.

In response to the person above who berates the writer for equating pubs with good city culture, I don't think she's suggesting that a good city is all about getting shitfaced. It's about people, and lively conversation, and community, and knowing your neighbours, and local art venues, and live music...all of which are facilitated by neighbourhood pubs. Good beer helps, but it's ancillary.

Great article Christine.

please don't move to Portland

I've lived in Portland for over 10 years. There's a lot this article didn't (couldn't) cover about what makes Portland such a great place to live, particularly the history of regional planning, the investments in public and non-motorized transport, and a long cultural history community participation and liberal-tinged libertarianism. Portland's an exciting, vibrant place, and I love it here.

That said, I strongly DISCOURAGE people from moving to Portland, at least right now. There are no jobs here. Statewide unemployment is third-worst in the nation (12.2%) -- I have college-educated, experienced friends in their 20s and 30s who have been unemployed for over 18 months. The rolls for subsidized food, housing and health care are full and are being trimmed. Frankly, the absolute LAST thing we need are more people who are "young, creative and low on cash."

There are plenty of other cities that are just as interesting and in some cases just as (relatively) affordable) as Portland. Move to Seattle, Chicago, Austin, Philadelphia, Montreal, Toronto, wherever... Or better yet, stay where you are and make your own city a better place. But please don't move to Portland unless you're bringing funds to live off for two years.

downtown Vancouver

I lived in the downtown eastside many years ago. It was a beautiful thriving community then. Artists and wannabes occupied warehouses illegally and fire marshals made faint efforts to oust them. The warehouse parties were amazing - I was one of the lucky few who were connected to this underground and got to audience many great musicians/bands who were just starting out. It was an exciting time. I wonder though - if there isn't that underground somewhere else in the city now - but the numbers on youth in the city do tell a story?

And, all the warehouses I used to visit in the wee hours have been cleaned up and are now mainly occupied by 50 somethings and up, wealthy and well, boring. I think it is called gentrification? It is so disheartening to see that I have stopped visiting the area. It is all stark contrasts now - the abjectly poor and the very rich. How banal. There is a song I heard recently that sums it up - where the artist asks where the artistic vision of the future went to. It certainly has been boxed up and signed over to a dull lot in Vancouver.

Great article, although I am not sure easy access to liquor licenses are the best solution. I am also not sure that that shelters should be left to the police to run them - another Portland specialty. Portland also has a lot of housing - that may have something to do with underemployed youth population and some of their innovations in housing people living with low incomes. But I think that has been covered.

why portland beats vancouver

I appreciate the critical nature of this article but find it based mostly on the wrong things. I visited and biked in Portland recently and believe that the city is open to innovative ideas and certainly is more affordable than Vancouver ... but why this centrality of bars and liquor licensees? There are loads of "things to do" in Vancouver and the setting is clearly not matched by Portland a city on river without a harbor. Vancouver's main problem is affordability,affordability, affordability... It certainly is not "dull" and this epaulet might be worn more by the writer than the subject... this is good if shallow article about something that is not a competition... Portland has some great qualities and I applaud those ... Vancouver does too ... and not just for the old and dull but also for the young, who paint life with a brush that extends beyond bars and liquor licences

Ocean Falls could be new creative city...

Greetings all, this if my first post...just joined thetyee.ca today. In the last few days i've been researching the history and potential of Ocean Falls on the central coast. After doing some research regarding Canada's abandoned/destroyed cities...i'm convinced that Ocean Falls could rise again and become a new, creative-class city in BC/Canada. The population went from 5000 people 40 years ago to 50 today. Ocean Falls is connected by BC Ferries. The hydro generation plant was built almost 100 years ago by a forestry company and still provides power today. The capacity of the dam is 14.5 Mw (with potential up to 34 Mw), yet only 2 Mw is currently used. Looking at old pictures of the city, it's amazing how walkable the city was. For an idea of the layout, and to see pictures of Ocean Falls past and present check out oceanfallsmuseum.com or oceanfalls.org.

The hotel in Ocean Falls almost 50 years ago was one of the biggest in BC. The school/gym built in OF 30 years ago was one of the best in BC. The school and hotel are still in OF today...yet they're abandoned and in pretty rough shape. There's also a 6 storey apartment tower that's empty...and quite a few houses. There's potential to rebuild the city around the assests that currently remain. As mentioned above, there's more then enough hydro power for at least a few thousand new residents to move in. There's good connection by BC Ferries to move people/products regularily and affordably. There's old buildings to build upon to affordably house artists or other creative class, outdoor types. Yet, there's still outside connections via wireless to get tv/phone/net access. Food...fish and wildlife are plentiful. Creative types from the west coasts of Canada and the US could/should move to Ocean Falls en mass and create a new kind of artistic/nature living environment. Bring your bikes, canoes and kayaks....laptops, tv's and cellphones...and create a new community from old foundations...

And yes, it rains alot in Ocean Falls...but with a walkable, compact community that could be covered (literally:). And, besides the rain...living in Ocean Falls you might also worry about the dam bursting behind you...avalances from above...earthquakes from below..tsunamis coming to the city from the front...not to mention all the grizzlies on the hunt :). But such a living environment would be half the fun of residing in Ocean Falls. Creative type people bringing their new ideas for community organizing would be the other half....

I visited Portland for the

I visited Portland for the first time in May and loved it. I'm not in the age group of the writer (bit older) but still can barely afford to live in Vancouver any longer... just hanging on for the nature, really. The writer didn't mention the free public transportation in the downtown core (the tram), and dog-friendly at that!

I found peoople to be friendlier and less pretentious than in Vancouver, and the prices of food in restaurants was amazing!! When I got back here I was on a mini-kick of "I should move there" and went so far as to compare living expenses and jobs in my field. The result- cheaper rent and the same pay in US dollars...hmmm. As for multiculturalism, I noticed a huge Spanish population (even on the tram loudspeaker- English and Spanish) and who are we kidding, Van is white and Asian and little else, hardly multicultural in the way Toronto is.

My verdict: if I weren't here for the access to the wonderful outdoors surrounding Vancouver- Portland would be my choice for a city, hands down.

I completely agree

I've never been able to put my finger on it but whenever I visit Portland I get this sense of quality of community where everything seems to work very well. And also a strong sense that this is what Vancouver could be but isn't. Simple things like the free LRT zone downtown. The LRT (so much more accessible than SkyTrain). The bike hooks to hang your bike. The bike lanes. The zoning that works so very well. The friendly panhandlers. The water fountains. The arts. It's a great town.

Ocean Falls Rises

Here's how many people could move to Ocean Falls and establish a creative class city in a hurry. It's too bad all those buildings were torn down.... but new structures could be built very fast. In fact, maybe the first habitat should be considered regarding the pioneer people who make the first move to Ocean Falls to rebuild the town. The first shelter was a canvass tent with a wood stove. If you go to armytents.com you can see that one can buy an almost 18 foot by 18 foot by 10 foot high "arctic" tent for $450. A woodstove goes for another $150. So for under a thousand dollars a living environment could be constructed. The old "Martin Inn" could be transformed into a 400 unit office building for the new inhabitants....a confortable, affordable work environment for the new OF residents to meet and mingle. Some people may be thinking: "live in a tent?...in the middle of no-where...why?...". Because with electricity (which OF has an abundance of) those tents could be powered to provide tv, net, phone, lights, heating, cooling...anything a modern living abode needs. Maybe plumbing (water/sewer) might not be provided immediately to these hundreds of new tents/residents of OF...but if there's nearby toilets/showers/kitchens (perhaps located in old Martin Inn converted into new 400 unit office building) then that not need be a big concern right away. Even if just only a big tent...residents could still have electricity and wireless connections to power modern technology. Perhaps some form of compost toilets could be considered for the temp infrastructure. The whole point of rebuilding Ocean Falls would be to provide the absolute most affordable place for artists (or those who can do work remotely) to live/work/play. If CPI numbers say the average Canadian spends 46% of income on shelter/transportation costs...maybe new residents of Ocean Falls can cut that number in half.... and build the type of place that would attract people far and wide...

Visiting is different than living...

I lived nine years in Portland and then moved to Vancouver four years ago. So I do speak from experience, albeit my own personal impression. Whenever I tell people I'm (most recently) from Portland I get some of the same ooohs and aaahs as outlined in the article. Actually the qualities mentioned are not the abundance of bars (I agree, a rather dumb way to rate places), but things I consider more substantial:

1. While the setting is not spectacular as ours -- basically one sees a flat horizon with the distant cone of Mt. Hood -- the city itself is much more beautiful on the ground, chiefly because they haven't cut down most of their hug, leafy street trees, which seems to be the case here. Next time you're biking there, ride east or west on Knott Ave. and enjoy the spacious, arching tunnel of green.

2. Yup, real estate is cheaper. (Not so apartments and studio space. There are few alternatives such as co-ops, and the police-run shelters mentioned above are about the only form of social housing you'll find. Remember, this is in the U.S.)

3. And like almost everywhere in the US, for most items, things are a lot cheaper.

But....

Live there a few years and dig a bit deeper. Portland is the whitest city of its size in the U.S. A writer above talks about all the "Spanish" people he saw (Really? I guess the Anglos were all British, since they spoke English...). Unlike California, Oregon still doesn't really acknowledge the existence of Latino communities, and blacks are generally confined within fairly rigid boundaries, only now being opened from the outside to allow gentrification.

Yes, Portland and Portlanders are years ahead of Van and almost all of N. America in environmental issues, and one could argue that's all that matters. But they also love their guns. And they're provincial. As far as the arts, both cities share the same general Northwest provincialism. The difference is that while Vancouver realizes there is a wider world out there, Portland believes it's the centre of the world.

Transit? Great if where you want to be happens to be on the MAX line with those bike hooks. But forget it if you have to ride a bus to get to the line. Vancouver's beats Portland's, and of course both suck when compared to East Coast cities and don't even mention Europe.

And..... since make-nice-to-Republicans-at-all-costs Obama is clearly not going to rock the boat much on this one... just be sure to stay young, healthy and carefree if you move to Portland. Get sick? You're on your own.

Portland undoubtedly surpasses most U.S. cities (except the Bay Area, where I've also lived). But I'm glad I moved to Vancouver.

Good Work

Christine -- great story concept and super writing -- clean, clear, lots of facts and interviews to back up your premise, and enough of a featurish feel to make it real but not so much it becomes trite -- a delicate balance. I look forward to your next two stories in this series.

I don't live in Vancouver anymore, have never hung out in Portland and am several decades older than you, but know from friends (even ones my age!) that Vancouver, for all its real-pretty scenery, is thought upon as dull.

It's people like you, young people in their 20s and 30s, who, given a lively and encouraging environment, will download your creative expression and bring true life and vibrancy to any city.

I'm glad you call Vancouver home. You know the soul of the city could be so much more. And are doing something about it.

Write on.

Fun can also be what YOU make it!

I really appreciate Ms. McLaren's eye-opening experiences that took place whilst visiting Portland, Oregon. However, I would say that relying on an editorial from one person's brief experiences VISITING a city does not make for a case for moving there.

Whether or not Ms. McLaren is a fan of Vancouver or not, she sure paints a bad picture of Vancouver; or at the very least paints a much greener picture of Portland. I'm not sure about you, but I relate city living to relationships. It's easy to fall in love with a city in the early stages. Everything is new and exciting. After years of finding your little niche you start getting comfortable in your surroundings. You have your core group of friends and you have your favourite hangouts alongside your daily routines. For some people, after a while this becomes mundane and tiresome, and all the city's flaws are shining brighter than its more charming qualities. These people get in a rut that they want to escape from. Anywhere else seems more interesting than their city. I guess this would be the "affair" stage of city living, where one looks elsewhere for the answer to his/her frustrations. I might assume Ms. McLaren is looking for greener pastures herself and found it in Portland. That's fine. But she can't assume us, the readers, to justify Portland being the better city based on environmental and liquor issues, a thriving art scene and a make-it-happen attitude of the broke youngsters. There are far more issues in Portland, that the LOCALS have pointed out, that Ms. McLaren has yet to see. Users Immigrant and quisquose-pdx touch vitally important topics like lack of proper health care and unenployment issues. "I have college-educated, experienced friends in their 20s and 30s who have been unemployed for over 18 months"... I think these words can say a lot about Portland's younger generation enjoying the thrifty life. Maybe they have been forced into it beyond their own will and just happily accept it as a sign of the times.

As for Vancouver not being fun, I can tell you that fun happens everyday in this city. I can't speak for everyone in Vancouver, but I often make my own fun with my wife, family and friends. If I find there are no concerts or no worthwhile events I just make my own event: go bowling, have a food party at my place, rent a cheesy old film and make fun of it, go play kickball at a park on Mondays, etc. I am part of an organization called Couchsurfing, and every single day there is something going on. You'll notice a lot of times these people are making the events themselves. I find random watergun fights to be more exciting than bitching about there "being nothing to do". Vancouver is really fun, not solely in the way that you sit back and wait for it to happen, but especially in the involved DIY way where you feel a part of a larger community, one where you can feel more attached to.

A ridiculous article...

A ridiculous article...

Portland is a nice town, but it's hardly better than Vancouver and it's second-rate even compared to most major American cities.

Cities are one of the great catalysts of human civilization. Without them, humanity would be small-minded and provincial. The best cities in the world are those that facilitate culture, the exchange of ideas and international trade while allowing its citizens to pursue their ambitions. Tokyo, Paris, New York, London, Toronto and Vancouver are examples of livable, great cities.

If you look at the second-tier cities in the United States, (such as Portland, Sacramento, El Paso, Spokane, Tacoma, etc.) you'll see a lack of ambition, and a corresponding lack of job and cultural opportunities. Portland may have created a Slacker Paradise, but what good is that for working families when half their downtown is all boarded up? It's a recipe for suburban flight.

If minimum-wage affordability is your only measurement of a great city (and that's what this article is REALLY all about), you deserve what you pay for.

Enjoy your happy hour...the rest of us are enjoying happy lives here.

Agree 100%

Christine Maclaren has given some excellent reasons for her preference and to these I would add that Portlanders are unpretentious and do not go around crowing about their superiority to denizens of other locales. To spend an evening with Vancouverites is to get a direct sense of how those who feel they are the elect, god's chosen ones, think and talk. It is a fine city but sorely needs humility.

One other thing - Portland's Powell's Books could swallow most of the mediocre bookstores in Vancouver and not even burp.

Interesting tangent on Ocean Falls, CourtGQuinn. I used to live in nearby Bella Coola which could seem pretty built-up after a visit to the eerie streets of Ocean Falls. I hope that the buildings are not too far gone for with 35 years of abandonment and that massive annual rainfall, the deterioration is something to worry about. It is a gorgeous and unique place to be sure. I'd be interested in hearing more about the work you are doing on "Canada's abandoned/destroyed cities". Drop me a line about it - ndale at uniserve dot com

Sure, Portland may have

Sure, Portland may have cheaper more available beer and more poor unemployed young people (this to recommend a city!?) but you don't get thrown in privatized for profit jails in Vancouver for possessing a gram or two of marijuana. Also, if you get too drunk and fall off your bike and get injured in Vancouver you'll receive free medical care and not have to spend all your savings.
And so on, I'll take Canada any day over the U.S., thank you very much.

Trams / Streetcars

Tell a Vancouver city planner you've been inspired by a recent visit to Portland, and you'd like to see streetcars running along Kingsway or Broadway. Then watch an uncomfortable smirk spread across that planner's face ...

foodcarts, bicyles and free transit

I love Vancouver and am always amazed at how many free and cheap ways there are to entertain ourserlves here. I'm dismayed when people claim that Vancouver is boring or "no fun" - these claims frequently seem to relate to booze - how cheap it is and how late you can drink it.

However, I'm planning a trip to Portland and have have noticed a few stark contrasts to Vancouver which have shed a new (dark) light on my beloved city. Portland has a vast array of street "foodcarts", selling everything from lime/japalpeno popsicles to thai food, burritos, soup and vietnamese food. In other words, more than hot dogs! Also - the cycling infrastructure there is amazing. They have painted "bike boxes" - bright green safety areas located ahead of car stop lines at traffic lights. Every August, they have a one-day bridge pedal, when the city closes nine of its bridges to car traffic (not just one lane of one bridge!). AND the downtown core has free transit.

Portland for Reflection

Intriguing article. After years of spending all vacations in Canada, I spent some time going across the United States. Vancouver beats most North American cities in terms of “culture” and activities. It isn’t New York, but at least you can find a restaurant open at 10:00PM. You can travel around Greater Vancouver and always find something good to do - well, maybe not at 4:00AM.

The writer is correct in alluding to the idea that Downtown Vancouver is full of bars that cater to the 20somethings who want to drink, dance, and holler. The Granville Street closures is evidence to the victory of alcohol culture. However, Vancouver is also home to baby-boomer condo owners who move downtown and then complain about the noise of the fireworks crowd or the Molson Indy, and the idea of a restaurant on Commercial Drive choosing its own hours. Vancouver is still a “No Fun City”…remember the millennium celebrations? No real pub culture in Vancouver – Starbucks and Bread Garden does not cut it. Why can’t a café serve as both a pub and a coffee house? Do all pubs have to be TV filled or have the music blaring? As for events, The Lantern Festival at Trout Lake has to struggle for funding every year while money seems to be found for other mega events.

Portland also integrates nature better into the cityscape. Trees are everywhere in the downtown core. In the suburban industrial parks, large Douglas Fir are left standing. You won’t see that in Maple Ridge or Richmond. Trees are not viewed with suspicion as they are in Vancouver where they might hide homeless people or block a view.

However, to agree with snert, the City of Portland has freeways dividing it. And these freeways clog in every direction. Yeah, we can talk about the light rail system that they have, but Portland city relies on its freeways going all directions. Grumpy ain’t going to like this, but our Skytrain and bus system provides better service than the MAX.

If consumerism is celebrated, Portland has a kick butt bookstore in Powell’s books. And why is shopping at Canadian owned stores in Portland such as Rack Attack and Lululemon so much cheaper, even when the exchange and some tax is taken into account?

I did read the Frommer's: "Don't Go There: Top 10 Overrated Travel Experiences” article and got a kick out of the Vancouver residents in the comments section jumping to the defense of their city, Vancouver. Another commenter had to point out: “remember: in order to be seen as overrated, one must be highly rated in the first place.”

Portland also seems to have done a better job at preserving its heritage, but at the same time, it seems as if it is a smaller city because it does not have the density that Vancouver does. Portland sprawls with no mountains or ocean to contain it.

The grass may be a greener down south in Portland, but we have a better backyard in Vancouver. This series is a great opportunity to reflect.

Yeah, but...

For years I've heard about Portland as a kind of Shangri-la where sensible development practices have resulted in a fabulous urban oasis where everything works. So last month my wife and I drove to Portland for a week and just hung out. Perhaps because I'm over 60 and hardly ever ride my bike naked, I was a little less entranced than Christine McLaren. Sure, there is free public transit in the downtown core, but that area is so small you can easily walk or bike those distances. Lots of bikes? Yes, but hardly the preferred mode of transport. I think I saw almost as many Hummers downtown as bicycles. There are only a couple of small green parks in the central city, and the much ballyhooed 400-acre Washington Park is miles from the downtown core and not that easily accessed by public transit. Portland's location is not particularly pretty. Miles from the sea, it is located on an industrial tributary to the Columbia. While the downtown maintains many of its heritage buildings, many are empty and their businesses struggling. And we were absolutely gob-stopped by the lack of cultural diversity. If 5% of the people we saw were visible minorities I'd be very surprised. Sure they were young, and sure they were pretty hip (if tattoos make one hip). But they were also really white. Some of the famous "pubs" (such as Henry's) had the atmosphere of a giant frat house. Most of the non-white population we saw (joined by a throng of white folks) were among the army of homeless, mentally ill and addicted that filled the night streets. And then we drove into Vancouver. Coming in from Oak, it really DID look like the Emerald City. Rising against the Coast Mountains and framed by the harbour, I still maintain it is one of the most beautifully situated cities in the world. Nothing to do? Jeez, the VAG is the only city in North America to show the fabulous Rijksmuseum collection. A gay pride event was warming up as 1000 Critical Mass bikers assembled in front of the gallery. The fabulous (some 50 ks now?) seawalk was full of bikers, strollers and runners. The refurbished harbour front glittered green in the sun. Hours of wandering the cool trails of Stanley Park. Popping into shops and expresso bars along Commercial. Checking out the produce at Granville Island while being entertained by some of the best buskers in the world. I dunno. There's not really much point trying to compare the two cities. They are both great communities. Sure, as a friend said "there are only two kinds of people who can afford to live in Vancouver, the rich and the homeless." But still the population density of downtown Vancouver makes Portland look downright unpopulated. We have a lot to learn from Portland and its commitment to smart growth principles. But Vancouver too is a leader in good urban development. Why not work together to find ways to create cities -- and a world -- that is environmentally, socially and economically strong, equitable and sustainable?

what's the point?

the article sould have been called "what vncouver could do to be more appealing to people like me".
the tone of the article seems to be suggesting that certain vancouverites would be happier in portland. but how possible is it to move there? for most, not too possible at all. there's the rather important matter of it being in a whole other country and you would need a green card to move there permanently and work. chances are slim for that to happen to many east van hipster "creative" folk.

Portland and Vancouver

The amusing thing about this is that urban planning in Portland has very much modeled itself after Vancouver. The Pearl District in Portland definitely emulates Downtown highrise residential development in Vancouver. Portland's also been following Vancouver's example in trying to build a city based on transit. There are freeways in Portland, but they stopped one which would have destroyed what are now some of the city's hippest neighborhoods. They also took out an expressway along the riverfront.

Portland doesn't have the spectacular mountains that Vancouver does but it's hardly completely flat either, especially west of the Williamette. They recently opened an aerial tramway to reach a medical center on a big hill--it's a very cool sightseeing ride.

Portland has more good beer than any city I've ever seen. And the restaurants there are getting better, but there's no equivalent to the Chinese food or Indian food of Vancouver.

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and love both Portland and Vancouver (heck, I even like Seattle, I'm easy). But to me Vancouver has much more of a big city feel and sensibility than Portland, for better and for worse.

So since I'm one of those boring over 50 people I think ahead a few years about retiring. Portland seems like it would work great--would Vancouver let an American retiree in ...

Moving is not the solution

When I first moved to Vancouver, I was frustrated with the no-fun city atmosphere. And then I decided to actually spend a little energy looking for fun, and it took me about a week to dig up a thriving culture of dance parties, anarchist knitting collectives, open jam sessions with friendly strangers, bike polo games, inspiring music shows, and generally just people who want nothing to do with condo culture, and frankly, are having a pretty great time of it. If all of these people had moved instead of actually putting energy into creating viable cutlure rather than expecting fun to knock on their door, Vancouver would be the scary place that the writer describes. Under the veneer of people bitching and whining about not having any fun, there are a lot of people ignoring them and creating something wonderful. In fact, I got so sick of this argument that I made a radio show about it here:
http://lifeafterradio.ca/2009/04/episode-4-fun-city/

Hola Immigrant

Your comment makes no sense so what's with the attitude?:

"A writer above talks about all the "Spanish" people he saw (Really? I guess the Anglos were all British, since they spoke English...). Unlike California, Oregon still doesn't really acknowledge the existence of Latino communities".

Where in my comment was I comparing Oregon to California? More importantly, people who speak SPanish on a regular basis USUALLY DO come from an an ethnic Spanish background, whereas people who speak English on a regular basis cannot be assumed to be of only a British background. Have you heard the news? English as an international language and all that??

Spanish

Fii,

Gee.... let's see. Just because you speak English, you're (quite correctly) not that likely to be of British ancestry. But if you speak Spanish, you're usually "from an ethnic Spanish background"?

Have you heard of Latin America? Do a little homework. The vast, vast majority of Spanish-speaking people in the world, and I'd say about 99% of those in N. America, have about as much Spanish ancestry as Ghengis Kahn. Just like the Brits long, long ago settled in N. America and gave it its dominant language (with a few notable exceptions!), so did Spain colonize almost everything from what is now the southwest US and points further south. Leaving the language, and very little Spanish ancestry. Most Latinos have far more indigenous ancestry, followed by a true melting pot of most nationalities of Europe and Asia.

While we're on the subject of ancestry, one factor that possibly gives Portland (and to a greater extent the rest of Oregon) its lily-white complexion is the fact that Oregon formally -- that is "legally" -- excluded blacks until 1927! No, I'm not making this up -- please do some research. And rural Oregon became the stronghold of the Klan in the Northwest up until the mid 20th century.

Portland view...

I've lived in Portland since 1977, an escapee from San Diego. I got involved in the transportation and urban planning scene in 1993 after reading "Earth in the Balance."

I knew Portland had something special going on by then having spent the 1980's working at energy conservation in housing, an industry that evolved out of necessity and good policy. Portland (and Oregon) was poised by then to take advantage of land-use regulations that restricted how and where new development could occur, a statewide effort to protect farmland and sensitive wetland and forest.

Portland is an example of how 'slow growth' can result in urban settings that feel like a 'conscious' environment. Let me clarify that statement. It sounds silly.

Portland leads the US in the practice of urban planning principles known as New Urbanism. NU principles can be described as "mixed-use" economic elements coming together to create a 'balanced' mix of uses. This includes a 'mix' of travel options.

To me, Portland's most outstanding characteristic is its pedestrian environment. Sidewalks are graciously accommodating, nicely landscaped, sufficiently wide and at corners curb extensions protrude into the street. These pedestrian amenites are functional necessities, not just for walking and crossing streets. The sidewalk dimensions subconsciously signal motorists to slow down. This makes walkingg and bicycling safer, and transit more convenient. The easier it is to walk Portland's blocks, the more motorists realize they can park any sufficiently close distance from their destination and no longer resort to circling for a closest spot. Portland's percentage of cars parked is much higher than the number being driven/moving/whatever.

In other words, it's easier to consciously place oneself within a multi-block area and estimate walking times within such areas. This characteristic has an exponential multiplier affect in the number of people Portland can accommodate and feel completely relaxed. Portlanders are nonchalant jay-walkers.

The small business environment this ease of travel enables creates an activity level that is a part of why Portland is considered phenomenal.

I figure what's phenomenal about Portland can be measured and replicated at innumerable, similar- and smaller-scale districts within metropolitan areas. That's another thing about Portland -- it's taken NU to its next logical step, Regionalism, coming to a town near you. Buy your ticket today.

Portland vs Vancouver

We live in paradise or, if you will, we could live in paradise.
Basically, Vancouver is a very nice location, the envy of very many people. However the nearsightedness and corruption of those in power grows(?) by the hour. I have visited Portland and felt very welcome, even though I just visited! Imagine, travelling there by bus and being put up in a hotel not inside the "fun loving area" of downtown Portland. To my absolute delight, I discovered an electric tramway, which anyone may board at any time free of charge to take one to this fabulous area called "downtown". When one gets there, one cannot help but feel the welcoming of this city. There are no pre-requisits for being!
Meanwhile we have Transit! Instead of providing and improving what they are supposed to do: Transit, they are attempting to steal us even more blind!!! Who the HELL do they think they are? -
I have identified the cancer, that is killing us!
It is called: THE BOTTOM LINE!
Nobody is talking about quality of life anymore ever since the economists and the environmentalists have started to walk in lockstep.
The provincial government is trying to scalp us with this unholy alliance called GST + PST = HST by trying to tell us that they are trying to save money - who has ever seen any money being saved by combining a tax with another? At least sometimes we had to pay only ONE tax, but now we would pay both taxes, no matter what item or service we are purchasing! Also, another incredible lie: a, get this, REVENUE NEUTRAL carbon tax!! How can it possibly be revenue neutral, when a whole new provincial department had to be created and paid for? Certainly not from their pockets!!!
Enter Transit, 15 cents per liter + milage???
You bums!!! where do you take this nerve from?!
Give us a decent transportation system THROUGHOUT the lower mainland first, like you are supposed to do. Then ask the governments, who are already ripping us off, to chip in to make it happen!
I have advocated doubletracking the railway lines on both sides of the Fraser river and electrifying them for a start of a first rate transportation SYSTEM! You don't have to develop a system from scratch. Take a look to Europe and copy any of their systems for free!!! Or, Visit Portland!!!

Making Sense of Place/Portland

"Making Sense of Place/Portland" is a TV show that I just watched about Portland. It looks at the struggles it had to develop into the type of city it is. How the city worked to make it the type of city it is with limited growth and farmland around it. Many struggles took place but the show and the city are quite interesting.

I completely agree

We just spent 3 days in Portland, our first visit there in 30 years, -and we loved it, What a beautiful city.-What a contrast to Vancouver. CLEAN! friendly, better roads, better transportationm better everything as far as we could see. Imagine the rose gardens here,-wouldn't happen, they would be vandalized, or we would be charging people to go in. After spending over an hour driving from the suburbs to downtown Vancouver today, through the ripped up 2nd avenue road construction, (and if its not one road its another being continually ripped apart), the filthy sidewalks and byways, the potholed streets, the traffic congestion, it only reaffirmed my feelings. Vancouver is highly overrated, dirty, congested, unimpressive, and not particularly safe- and I say this as a life long BC'er ( lower mainlander) of 50+ years experience with Vancouver. Sadly, Vancouver lost its charm at least 15 years ago, and is nothing like those postcard snapshots, they bear no resemblance to the reality. I note that on some of the travel sites, even tourists are starting to complain about the dirt, being accosted by panhandlers, traffic congestion, and other unpleasant aspects of Vancouver.

Portland: the Cruel Truth

immigrant is so right in calling Portland out on its provincial, gun-loving self-centered lily-whiteness. Young people who visit or move here are bound to discover the true nature of Portland under all the hype, so they should really just stay home and avoid a traumatic letdown. Like watermelon seeds, young people pass through Portland unchanged, and if they're lucky they will land on fertile soil somewhere else.

Ewwww- more attitude?!! (Immigrant)

For crying out loud, this is about semantics??! I looked back at my post and noticed I had written "I noticed a huge Spanish population".... I meant "Spanish speaking"- of course by looking at people I would have no idea if they came from SPAIN itself or not. Notice my next comment about the LANGUAGE on the tram loudspeaker??

No sorry, never heard of Latin America. Should I have??

As for your little rant about Oregon being "lily-white" because of its racist ways, while I do some research on your points here's one for you:
The BC gov't (more recently than your 1927 expulsion of Blacks) sent Canadian born Japanese packing in WW2, off to the boonies (that means the countryside in Canadian English).... so what was your point? That just because all faces aren't white in a place it means there is no history of racism and exclusion of an ethnicity??

As for this: "Most Latinos have far more indigenous ancestry, followed by a true melting pot of most nationalities of Europe and Asia", I would disagree. Italian, Portuguese of course in Brazil, German and Spanish- what other European countries? As for Asians, which Latin countries other than Brazil have a huge Asian (Japanese) population?

Glad to have given you a chance to do your little history blurb, though.

some thoughts

First of all, I think this is an excellent series. Way to go Christine.

I am a little discouraged by the number of posters here who jumped on Christine's mention of pubs and reasonably-priced beer as some weakness or horror or something.

I lived in Vancouver for several years and I agree completely that their draconian liquor licensing stifles sociality and makes neighbourhoods boring.

As a twenty-something I DO like to go to a pub and have a couple drinks and chat with friends - or even -gasp- meet new people.

In vancouver there are few places you can do that.

Most liquor serving establishments are - as the fellow in the article describes - trying to make back their investment by pumping 22 year old idiots full to bursting with liquor.

That is not the same as a neighbourhood pub - a place where you can go, late on a night off, and sit and read a book and maybe strike up a conversation with someone.

People mentioned other activities - and those are great - but get off the puritan trip. Lots of us like to have a few beer now and again. It should be something that we can do comfortably, reasonably affordably, and in a public venue.

As for the landscape - it is pretty lame to harp on about the scenery in Vancouver - it isn't like we have any real control over that - and what control we do have - well look at the ugly development eating away the northshore mountains - it looks like some weird cancer - the subdivisions growing.

Vancouver is pretty okay. And vibrant - but it is really stupid in other ways. The lack of affordability is ridiculous. I lived in a cellar and it cost me $450 a month - no heat, no windows.

That is unconscionable.

It is a soul destroying place for artists and students - there is just no way to live there in a reasonable way.