News

Doctors Double Dipping

Clinic doctors got $500,000 in public funds, but walk-ins must pay for basic visits.

By Andrew MacLeod, 10 Dec 2007, TheTyee.ca

Don Copeman

CEO Don Copeman.

Doctors working at the private Copeman Healthcare Centre in downtown Vancouver received nearly $500,000 in fees charged to the public last year, though the clinic is also charging its 1,500 patients to use its services.

The top grosser in public funds was Tasha Bienert, a family physician at the clinic, who got $158,727 from the Medical Services Plan. Psychiatrist Kevin Kjernisted was paid $120,568. Another psychiatrist, Diane McIntosh, received $118,079. Corporate medical director Peter House made $43,110 while family physician Beth Donaldson got $39,466.

The payments are recorded in the Medical Services Commission's annual financial report for the year ended March 31, 2007. Two other Copeman clinic doctors, Michael Koehle and Mark Gelfer, do not appear in the records. Nor for that matter does clinic founder and CEO Don Copeman, a businessman who once took pre-medicine courses.

It is unclear from the report how much of the fees paid to the various Copeman doctors was for work performed at the clinic, and how much was for work they may have done elsewhere. But medical director House says, "Nobody at Copeman works outside the clinic. We used to."

Besides whatever public money flows to Copeman clinic staff, the centre also charges patients a fee before they can see a doctor. To be seen costs $3,900 for the first year, plus $2,900 for each year after that. That's up, by the way, from $3,500 for the first year and $2,300 annually when The Tyee reported on the clinic in May 2006.

Under the Medicare Protection Act, doctors who have "opted-in" and receive payments under the public Medical Services Plan may not charge a patient for any service normally paid for through public insurance. How then, are Copeman doctors charging twice?

Decision in secret

In late November the government's Medical Services Commission, which oversees payments under the MSP program, ruled after an 18-month investigation that the private clinic on Vancouver's Hornby Street is operating legally, but it remains unclear how that decision was made.

"They refused to provide any reasoning for the decision," says Adrian Dix, the NDP health care critic. "They are denying people their right to know anything about it."

A health ministry spokesperson says it is "frustrating," but section 49 of the Medicare Protection Act says the government can't talk about the commission's ruling. She says Health Minister George Abbott has said the section needs to be reviewed, but meanwhile any answers about the ruling would have to come from the Copeman clinic.

Copeman's medical director House says all he's seen is a two-page letter from the commission that says everything is okay with how the clinic does business. "I don't have the report, no. It wasn't sent to me. I don't know if it was sent to Mr. Copeman."

Copeman did not return calls. Nor did general manager Susan Rafter respond to an e-mail requesting details of the ruling.

However, in an interview with The Tyee at the outset of the Medical Service Commission's review of the clinic, Copeman made clear what his arguments (crafted with the help of lawyers who'd written related legislation elsewhere) would be: the fees are for extra services the clinic provides, not for seeing a doctor.

The fees give members access to services like annual health screening, personal coaching, counselling, diet advice and fitness consultation that aren't covered under the public MSP program. As the clinic's website put it, "The fees for these enhanced medical services are bundled by the centre and made available to each client for a simple, annual fee."

Pay for access

The NDP's Dix isn't buying the argument Copeman is selling. "People aren't paying for those services, and everyone knows it," he says. "You're paying for the right to see a family doctor."

What the clinic is charging for is at the crux of the question. Under British Columbia law it is illegal to charge for access to a doctor for anything that would be covered by MSP. As the Health ministry's website explains: "The Medicare Protection Act protects patients from being charged an extra amount for physicians' services that are benefits of MSP." They can charge for all kinds of medically unnecessary things, but if the doctors are going to work in the public system, they have to provide any service covered by MSP to anyone who asks. If someone refuses to pay the fees, the doctor still has to see him or her.

So if Copeman is charging for the extra services and not for access to a doctor, it should be possible to make an appointment at the clinic for something covered under MSP without paying any fee.

When I ask Copeman's House what happens if someone walks in with a fever or some other condition where a visit would be covered by MSP, he says, "We don't refuse anybody, but that's not our business. . . . We're not a walk-in clinic."

Copeman doctors would treat the person, he says, and there would be no charge. "No, we don't charge a fee for that," he says. "We in our clinic do not charge our patients for any medically insurable service that's available in the province. . . . Doctors don't charge patients at Copeman Healthcare Centre for anything except non-insured services."

Members only

But if House is correct, Copeman officials have failed to explain the policy to the people who actually book appointments. When this reporter called the clinic's main phone line last week to ask about making an appointment, the reception person said, "You do have to be a member." It is possible for non-members to get in to see a doctor, she says, but there's a fee of $175. Even if you don't want any extras.

Told about the response, House says, "No, it's not quite so easy, because that's not what we're about."

Whatever the clinic is doing appears to be fine with the government, and House says the commission's approval shows people should stop worrying about the clinic. "We have a business that complies with the Medicare Protection Act of British Columbia, and that's been proven," he says. "We've gone through a two-year process. There's no smoking gun here."

Fan of American system

At a time when the public health care system suffers from several threats, there are bigger issues than the clinic, House says. "It's ridiculous. You can quote me on that. It's a ridiculous topic for debate," he says. "The story's dead, except in people who don't want to believe it. They believe in conspiracies, and the media fans that."

The best source of health information, adds the clinic's top doctor, is the Fraser Institute, which House says is "unfairly labeled as a right-wing think tank."

The bigger problems with the public healthcare system include chronic under funding and a shortage of physicians, he says, adding that there isn't enough emphasis on illness prevention to help people take care of themselves before they get sick.

For such shortcomings, the doctor offers a cure. "The American health care system is where you're going to get excellence," House says. "We're the only developed country that doesn't have a private and public system running in parallel. . . . Everything else we do besides healthcare is a free market."

He says, "We're not a threat to the health care system and we're not a solution to the health care system. We're an option."

Copeman eyes expansion

Dix says the Copeman clinic does pose a real threat to public health care. If it is allowed to get away with charging patients for access to a doctor, the practice will expand in a hurry. Doctors will be available to those who can afford to pay, and others will have to make do in a deteriorating public system, he says.

"It will be harder to find a family doctor and there will be more extra billing," Dix predicts.

The NDP will fight the decision, he says, starting with figuring out how it was made. "I'm reviewing all options legal and otherwise, freedom of information options, so we can see what was done here."

With Abbott and the federal government refusing to take action against the Copeman clinic, they are practically inviting expansion, he says.

Copeman himself has said in the past he plans to have 40 clinics across Canada within five years. If so, many more Canadians could be asked to open their wallets before their doctors will open the door.

Related Tyee stories:

 [Tyee]

21  Comments:

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  • dorothy

    4 years ago

    Not so hairy

    I think it's really very simple; it's an exercise in psychological gamesmanship. People who are really sick are not usually ones to push a political issue. There will be those who are well-heeled and enjoy that they can buy their extra perks, and then there will be those for whom the fees would be prohibitive, and who, even if they are sick, will avoid the humiliation and aggravation of discussing the terms. Thus the thing will never be brought to a head, because a situation corresponding to self-censure will be prevail. Shame, that. Someone ought to mobilize an army of minimum-wage people with runny noses and suchlike to invade the rarefied premises in need of help and unable to pay, and then see what would happen.

    By the way, does anyone here know if it is true, that part of our health care budget in this province every year goes into payment of fines for trangressions against the Canada Health Act? I heard that somewhere and could not believe it. But I would certainly like to have it either confirmed or debunked, if anyone has the knowledge.

  • ME2

    4 years ago

    query

    The root of the problem is a shortage of doctors. Is anything realistic being done to solve it?

  • G West

    4 years ago

  • Booker

    4 years ago

    Thieves

    So the scams begin right off the bat as soon as for-profit health care is implemented. That didn't take long.

    Quote:
    The American health care system is where you're going to get excellence

    I suppose that's why creating a Canadian-style health care system is near the top of the agenda with U.S. voters?

    Quote:
    The best source of health information, adds the clinic's top doctor, is the Fraser Institute, which House says is "unfairly labeled as a right-wing think tank.

    He's right -- it is unfairly labeled a "think tank". It's a right-wing belief tank.

  • avandoc

    4 years ago

    Aetna next?

    If a Canadian business can do this, then US businesses will invoke NAFTA and demand to be allowed to set up clinics too. Once Aetna and US Healthcare arrive, the take over of the Canadian system will be inevitable. Their lobbyists will spread cash everywhere and politicians the likes of Abbot will give them whatever they want.

    Dr. House's desire for "excellence" will be achieved, but only for the minority of the population able to pay for it. In the US, "excellence" may be available, but most people get average to mediocre and many get little or none.

  • Fiat lux

    4 years ago

    The Fraser Inst. is

    The Fraser Inst. is definitiely labeled wrongly as a "right wing economic think tank", because it and others, like the CD Howe, are nothing more than bona fide advertising agencies and propaganda machines for corporate rule. Claiming to be "non profit, charitable organizations" with $25,000 yearly membership fees.

    As far this clinic's charges are concerned, remember the Lord's Day observance era, when sporting and other events were not permitted to charge for tickets, so they charged for parking ? The same thing could apply for this and other future clinics, who may charge for sitting in the waiting rooms and get away with it.

    Scum always rises to the surface.

    Ed Deak.

  • dunngy

    4 years ago

    More Spin!

    EDITED FOR LEGAL CONCERNS -- TYEE MODERATOR

    This is more subversive agenda driven decisions being hidden away in a dark corner hoping that eventually people will either forget or tire of pursuing the TRUTH.Can you imagine if a downtown street person tried to gain access!I'm sure the prim and proper with a West Side address would happily step aside for an ODing addict barging through the front doors.Maybe a constant stream of low income people should start putting to the test the Clinics policy of not turning any one away.We'll see how well that goes for them,and have some video documentation of the results.The Copeman Clinic has the power to release the report,so if it is so comfortable with it,then RELEASE IT!Of course as the good DR.says there is no smoking gun,it's an elephant in the waiting room!More spin,more AGENDA driven decisions.

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    Truer words were seldom spoken.....

    Quote:
    Whatever the clinic is doing appears to be fine with the government

    ....considering that this government is the champion of PPP...........

  • Chris H

    4 years ago

    Conflict of interest

    A public school teacher is not allowed to tutor his/her students. By accepting money for these "extra" services he/she would be putting a cloud of distrust over everything done in the classroom. What is the difference with doctors? How can they offer both the services paid for by tax dollars and these "extra" services that come out of a patient's pocket? Have these doctors been getting their professional ethics from watching House on TV? In reality, these clinics are all about making money. Anything Copeman and his cronies say should be taken with a great degree of skeptism. My heart cries for the poor, misunderstood Fraser Institute - boo hoo hoo.

  • SharingIsGood

    4 years ago

    Booker re: Fraser Inst.

    Quote:
    He's right -- it is unfairly labeled a "think tank". It's a right-wing belief tank.

    That is the quote of the decade! LOL

    Thanks, SIG

  • Lefty

    4 years ago

    Sort of like the USA doesn't torture people

    Seems like this fellow figures that his own say so is all that anyone need know. No knowledge of the rationale just the outcome, beholden to none.

    It's like watching two people argue over an apple and then after some time learning that one of them is insisting it's an orange. The simple act of willing it to be honestly so (a la Tony Blair) even though mistaken does not make it a wrong therefore it does not need to be corrected. Ergo it is an orange!

    or a dead parrot for that matter.

  • filthy1

    4 years ago

    As long as we have

    As long as we have provincial liberals in power and far, far worse a conservative government we will see more and more private clinics until there is no more public health system.

  • SharingIsGood

    4 years ago

    hipocritic oath

    This may well be what we have to look forward to under privatized health care:

    http://www.pharmalot.com/2007/12/hypocritic-oath-many-docs-ignore-bad-stuff/

  • greengreen

    4 years ago

    Fraser

    Surely this fellow has lost all credibility by denying that the Fraser Institute is a right-wing think tank! Enough said!

  • clubofrome

    4 years ago

    The New Math

    Lets just add this up....
    $3900 for the first year and then $2900 per year after that. Of course you could pay $175 per visit. Who exactly is going to their GP more than 16 times per year? Of course they also have a couple of psychiatrists on staff as per above. Perhaps you need to have your head examined 20 times per year to belong to this health spa.

  • Perry

    4 years ago

    The practice has already expanded

    Quote:
    If it is allowed to get away with charging patients for access to a doctor, the practice will expand in a hurry. Doctors will be available to those who can afford to pay, and others will have to make do in a deteriorating public system

    The practice has already expanded. The Mainland Medical & Laser Clinic in Yale town started a two-tier system a couple years ago. For a yearly fee you get quicker access to doctors and can make scheduled appointments. But if you do not pay the fee, even if you are a long-time patient there, you can no longer make appointments. You can only see your doctor on a walk-in basis.

    So, if you have the money you can get better service than those who do not.

  • Luceo

    4 years ago

    Let's be Proactive

    Those who say publicly that an apple is an orange are usually in legal trouble, leaving their opposition in the position of having to prove otherwise, which takes an infinite amount of time and money. Disgusting, but legal.

    (However, Lefty, I think the "dead parrot" WAS a dead parrot and that the claim that the rigid corpse was just "asleep" was the false claim.)

    As for the payment for service problem, if the government's Medical Commission has found in favour of people being charged to see their doctors, whatever the unknown pretence, then changes to the system should be considered. I think an annual health check-up should be included under MSP. This might even save money, as early diagnosis often averts the expensive treatment and care needed for serious long-term illness, not to mention the suffering that ensues for no good reason other than a false economy.

    As for the remainder of the Copeman Center's cost creating "bundle", doctors in my clinic are providing those services without charge under our MSP in conjunction with general treatment. If the government shows support for separate payment, the answer is to force changes in the government's approach and, of course, to vehemently refuse to pay any separate fees.

    If teachers started charging for unpaid extra-curricular activities, marking, dances, grad events, individual tutoring, weekends spent on reports, etc., they would be stopped so fast they'd get whiplash! Government leaders are quick enough to come up with a Bill when control of a situation suits them. They need to be pressured into cleaning this up, immediately, so that it cannot spread, as is feared in the above article. Also, ALL medical institutions must be made to comply, including the Copeman Center.

    As for the Fraser Institute being labelled "a right-wing think tank" I agree that the label is incorrect. The misnomer think should be dropped.

    It is important to be proactive and to take steps to ensure that our government is working FOR us, rather than to cower in a corner and quiver about what it is going to do TO us.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    Nice Luceo

    Quote:
    As for the Fraser Institute being labelled "a right-wing think tank" I agree that the label is incorrect. The misnomer think should be dropped.

    Very nice!

    And I agree with the rest of your post as well.

  • HawkEyes

    4 years ago

    Profession in crisis

    If this clinic has its wages paid by our government and receives 1,500 patients paying a minimum of $2,900 each, the total is $4,350,000? No wonder 40 more are desired. The money would be better spent for the common good. I've met more bad doctors than good ones, some are down right deadly. I've often wondered if this "ethic" of silence against fellow doctors serves the profession at all...
    One doctor came to Chilliwack a few years ago, complaining the $300,000 dollars he was making a little north of here wasn't enough. I once mentioned to a realtor sadness over a beautiful piece of land she had listed-you knew subdivision was next. She, the wife of a most successful GP, told me dead seriously she had to feed her family. Greed is never satisfied, I guess.
    But...an indication of how badly doctors are needed? My mother's doctor opened his own office and casually mentioned he was taking new patients. In this town of over 60,000 people, he had 17,000 calls the first week. He did not advertise.

  • ME2

    4 years ago

    The Market dictates all

    Sure, we're short on doctors, Hawkeyes, so naturally they can name their own price. In some less desirable areas, the workload doctors face is so huge, income becomes an insignificant factor and they leave.

    But if we lowered the course fees and opened more medical schools so we could train more doctors, that would be socialistic and offend the "free enterprisers", wouldn't it?

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    Luceo

    Quote:
    If teachers started charging for unpaid extra-curricular activities, marking, dances, grad events, individual tutoring, weekends spent on reports, etc., they would be stopped so fast they'd get whiplash!

    If the BCTF had leaders with "intestinal fortitude", they could push the case of Copeman double dipping, to begin charging for all of the above, and leave it up to the government to explain why one is OK while the other isn't............

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