Opinion

Public Jobs Went Private, Work Life Soured

Study taps BC workers at Accenture and Maximus.

By Penny Gurstein, 30 Oct 2007, TheTyee.ca

Woman with head in hands

Findings: stressed, devalued.

When a meter-reader comes to your home to check your monthly electricity consumption, they wear a BC Hydro uniform, but they are, in fact, no longer employees of BC Hydro. They work for Accenture, a Bermuda-based, for-profit, multinational corporation. Similarly, when you call the Medical Services Plan with an inquiry, you are actually now speaking to an employee of Maximus, a U.S.-based multinational.

But, does it really matter? Does the shifting of the employees from the broader public service to for-profit corporations really change anything, either for the workers, or for the quality of the service?

The answer, according to a new report from the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives, is yes.

'Alternative Service Delivery'

Since its election in 2001, the current British Columbia government has implemented widespread neo-liberal socio-economic restructuring. Part of this process has been the establishment of an Alternative Service Delivery (ASD) plan to "contract-out" or "outsource" some public service delivery to private, for-profit companies.

The CCPA study finds that, contrary to the government's claim that "this is alternative service delivery, not privatization," ASD is a euphemism, and does indeed represent a form of privatization.

The report investigates how outsourcing has impacted government services and affected the economic security of the workers involved by focusing on two case studies:

  1. Outsourcing of "back office" work at BC Hydro to Accenture, including customer services, IT services, human resources, financial systems, purchasing, and buildings services
  2. Outsourcing of administration of the Medical Services Plan and PharmaCare to Maximus.

These case studies reveal a large gap between the virtues attributed to ASD and the reality of what ASD looks like on the ground

ASD is being brought in with promises of innovation, technological improvements, intelligent reorganization and re-engineering -- all of which are purportedly saving the government money while still allowing the contractor to make a profit. Yet when we look at these privatization schemes in more detail, we learn that their main tools for "innovation" are cost minimization, de-skilling staff, surveillance, increased hierarchical control, and a unilateral push by the employer to make people work harder -- hardly what most would view as "innovative."

New fears of job loss

The study finds that the economic security of the workers involved has been affected, as their bargaining power has been undermined (as workers are no longer part of a large public-sector workforce, but rather constitute relatively small bargaining units negotiating with large multinationals).

In the case of the Accenture workers, there is a fear of future job loss, as workers operate under the underlying threat that their jobs could be further outsourced to offshore low-wage jurisdictions.

At Maximus, while there was not the same threat of offshoring (due to privacy issues), there was the separation of the bargaining unit from the larger public sector workforce, substantially reducing employees' ability to compete for other jobs and move within the civil service.

Stressed and devalued

While important differences between the two cases emerged, some common themes were evident. In both outsourcing initiatives, employees indicated a sense of being valued less as a result of the outsourcing.

In the name of efficiency, there is increased employee monitoring and surveillance, which adds to job stress.

In both workplaces, respondents reported that the hierarchy is more rigid and the work environment has become tense. There is a trend towards reduced training, which is completely at odds with the notion that ASD is about innovation and making improvements.

An "employee engagement" survey at Accenture covering the financial years 2005 and 2006 showed that employee morale and job satisfaction was chronically low.

Most workers at Maximus reported no longer feeling the ownership in their work they had before. This, coupled with the stress induced by their employers' changing expectations, has resulted in a very demoralized workforce. The necessary trust between employers and employees has been undermined by the corporate practices introduced by the for-profit companies.

All of the workers interviewed had concerns that the level of customer service has deteriorated. Workers at both Maximus and Accenture reported that while the response time may be fairly quick, if information beyond "the basics" is needed, customers frequently cannot get access to the people who can actually help them.

Study interviewees felt quality was suffering at the expense of quantity, with performance measures such as volume of calls handled trumping the quality and accuracy of the information provided to the public.

The workers and their union representatives regard the cultural shift with grave concern, as they witness the core values of public service undermined by outsourcing.

Declining morale

Privatization leads to an erosion of the "intrinsic satisfaction" that public employees used to get from public service delivery. The lack of long term stability that results from on-going contract renewals and the realities of corporate culture such as corporate takeovers (there are rumours that Maximus may be bought) create uncertainty in the continuity and quality of service for both workers and the public.

The report concludes that the results of outsourcing appear to be ongoing operational problems, reduced employee engagement, and a decline in worker morale. Outsourcing changes the culture of these workplaces in subtle but important ways, which has consequences both for the workers and for the quality of public customer service.

These case studies demonstrate that ASD is not a panacea to address accountability and fiscal responsibility in governments. Rather, it is an ideologically-driven approach intended to restructure government services to serve the imperatives of ill-conceived notions of efficiency and productivity. A broader public dialogue is needed about the purported merits of outsourcing. And we need to examine whether there are other, more cooperative alternatives to enhancing government services and performance.

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55  Comments:

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  • ov

    4 years ago

    Maximus

    Maximus is involved with a lot of security and anti-terrorist programs, and they are a big player in face recognition software.

    "http://www.maximus.com/corporate/pages/homelandsecurity.asp" describes how they are an information sharer with homeland security. Having my personal medical records accessible by this company makes me more than a little uneasy.

  • alive

    4 years ago

    Revolution is the answer

    Divide and conquer!
    The multinationals get bigger and bigger, and at the same time they succesfully manage to divide the workers into smaller and smaller units.

    We all recognize the strategy but seem unable to mount an offense against this.

    As with other issues discussed here on Tyee we get back to the conclusion that our lives are being manipulated and that by now the only way to stop it, is to simply refuse to co-operate!

    A revolt is the ultimate answer, but with "services" like these, insist on talking to a manager no matter how they try to re-route you.

    Refuse to use dial one or five or whatever number, simply insist on speaking to a human being; then insist on getting proper answers.

    Failing that approach your local MLA or MP.
    They are getting paid to represent you.

    Personally I refuse to supply any answers on my personal phone, reasoning that I pay for the phone, for my benefit.

    If any government services want my attention they can mail me a letter or appear in person at my doorstep.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    You're fired

    When the NDP get back in power, telling these companies they're fired for being incompetent should be a top priority.

  • Fiat lux

    4 years ago

    Costs can not be cut, only

    Costs can not be cut, only transferred on other sectors, the environment and the future.

    Wealth can not be created, only taken from other sectors, the environment and the future.

    I'm hoping that one day the economists of CCPA, the NDP and the BCFL may just stumble on these obvious facts, we all learn in highschool as the laws of thermodynamics, and then the "great awakening" may just begin.

    The whole, and only, purpose of these privatizations is the wish by the governments to shed their responsibilities to the public, wipe out accountability and satisfy the profit demands of the multinational, big business owners of the BCLib and Conservative Parties.

    Ed Deak.

  • cboo44

    4 years ago

    Privatization of Public Responsibility

    This is only "the tip of the iceberg" in B.C. A most worrisome aspect of privatization is the ever-increasing number of municipalities who are contracting out their bylaw enforcement services. This puts a private entity into the quasi-judicial process and is therefore TOTALLY unacceptable. LAW ENFORCEMENT is the sole responsibility of the ELECTED representatives, who are, in the end, answerable to their citizens, NOT some private, non-answerable entity.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    No Problemo

    Quote:
    The workers and their union representatives regard the cultural shift with grave concern, as they witness the core values of public service undermined by outsourcing.

    Declining morale

    Privatization leads to an erosion of the "intrinsic satisfaction" that public employees used to get from public service delivery.

    Both “core values” and “intrinsic satisfaction” are CPA–speak for cushy union jobs. The unions skewered themselves on this one with their blatant support of the NDP and I, like the majority of British Columbians, have no problem with the expansion of contracting out for non-core government services…….

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Whats good for the gander

    So NLN, I take it that since payback is a good thing, when the NDP forms a government again the business community should be made to pay for its support of the Socreds and Liberals and be "publicized", meaning every company be nationalized in the public interest with no compensation.

    The ex-owners can of course continue to work at those newly public companies but with only a fraction of their previous pay.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    Some evidence, please?

    "...I, like the majority of British Columbians, have no problem with the expansion of contracting out for non-core government services……....

    I think you only speak for yourself my friend!

    This is NOT my understanding of the views in the street - I guess the majority you mean is less than 30% of the total populace of registered voters who actually cast ballots for these Socreds (sorry, Campbell liberals) in the last election.

    Can you work the maths out yourself?

    I think a majority of the population, when they get a chance to think about what's been happening here since Campbell started selling the province down the river to his friends, are very apprehensive about the direction he is taking public services and resources. Not to mention how concerned the Supreme Court is about the methods he's used.

  • Fiat lux

    4 years ago

    The rot started with Zalm,

    The rot started with Zalm, when he privatized the road services, etc..

    Since then the condition of the interior roads has been going downhill and in the past few years, since another "low bidder", took over in this area, became dangerous and atrocious.

    Zalm's Highways minister Alex Fraser, no socialist, or NDP supporter by a long shot, was up in arms and warned what will happen, so Zalm fired him and appointed the usual, useless, yes-man.

    By the way, what's wrong with "cushy union jobs", if and when the money is spent and stays here to "create wealth", instead of going to some foreign tax haven to "create wealth" for some corporate mafiosi.

    Ed Deak.

  • Lefty

    4 years ago

    mor frm Gordoccio & Co.

    Compliments of Gordoccio and the BC Fiberals.

    How about that raid on the legislature eh?

    Reminds one of the final analysis of Grant Devine's Cons in Sask recently "it wasn't what they had done illegally that was the most destructive to that province"

  • realisticman

    4 years ago

    Drip, Drip

    Fiat Lux

    Quote:
    what's wrong with "cushy union jobs", if and when the money is spent and stays here to "create wealth"

    Good to see Ed promoting the trickle-down supply-side effect.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Realisticman

    "Trickle-down" works horizontally? Guess we don't need tax cuts for the wealthy any more then?

  • G West

    4 years ago

    Don't you understand what it means

    Don't you understand what it means when a writer puts inverted commas around words?

    Unable to actually sustain a single argument successfully, you're reduced to facile sound bites now?

    You know exactly what Ed meant and we certainly don't need any more tax cuts for the wealthy - we never did. What we need if fair and equitable tax for everyone.

  • Fiat lux

    4 years ago

    Trickle down, if it ever

    Trickle down, if it ever existed, died with globalization, where "wealth creating foreign investment", a screenful of computer figures representing nothing, can colonize and take over the economies of whole countries with the imaginary power of imaginary money created by some bank from the air, on the other side of the world.

    The biggest crime wave and fraud in human history.

    Ed Deak.

  • ME2

    4 years ago

    Trickle not quite drip, drip, drip - yet.

    Yes, Ed, and it is happening so fast - literally out of control - that most people don't want to even think about it.

    By the time the middle classes and the poor realise what has happened, it will be too late to do anything about it.

    Those who hold out hope for a revolution of some kind can forget that idea, since the power elites will always dangle a just-big-enough carrot to keep us fighting among ourselves to get a piece of it.

  • ME2

    4 years ago

    Add-on

    And it just occurred to me that I should have added to last sentence: and our argument here re the minimum wage is such a perfect example of that.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    Libs rule, NDP drools

    GW – stop living in the past, look at the current polls, the Liberals have a lock on the next election.

    Frank – of course, the NDP would return to paying off their Union buddies, just like they did in the past…..that’s why they’ll never increase their threshold of popular votes. No one other than union members support them….

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    Frank – of course, the NDP would return to paying off their Union buddies, just like they did in the past…..that’s why they’ll never increase their threshold of popular votes. No one other than union members support them….

    He dodges and weaves...

    The Liberal-Socreds pay off their business buddies constantly, the only other thing they think of is attacking unions which you are cheering.

    I for one hope the NDP do to business what you cheer the Libs doing to labour. Seems only fair. Nationalize them all, no compensation.

    Then let's see how much cheering there will be from the Right after that when their paid-for governments start waving the privatization wand. Not much I bet.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    No! left-nutter

    You still haven't provided any evidence - just ad hominem junk – no surprise there. The fact is that Campbell has backed himself into a nice corner - huge raises for him and no increase in the minimum wage - over 200,000 BC citizens are in that 'boat' - they have friends and family and people ARE starting to talk. Couple more bumps in the cost of the convention centre- which is already way-y-yyyyyy worse than the fast ferries ever were and you never know what'll happen come 2009.

    I know a lot of people who voted Gordo in 2005 will never do it again; something about the idea of 18 Million condos sort of concentrates the mind about where we’re heading.

    Actually you’d be better off to just surrender the government now and let the NDP take the blame for the next economic downturn - just like the Liberal liars did last time. Cause if Campbell is still in power come the end of the Olympics he’s definitely going to be toast.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    GW-Frank

    GW – you denounce my claims as anecdotal and provide the same type of info to support your claims, sheesh.

    Frank – You’re dreaming in Technicolor if you believe the NDP will win the next election. As bad as Gordo may be, Carole James is worse……

  • gkam

    4 years ago

    simpletonians

    There will always be right-wing hardliners seeking to make a buck by shorting everyone else. That kind of selfishness is the hallmark of "conservatives" who opposed every progressive idea from unemployment insurance to safety laws and environmental protection. Everything is put into the context of money in their pocket.

    You can't blame the guy with no left nut. He is driven by his rationalized selfishness and simplistic grasp of life's complexities.

    If it's cheaper, it MUST be better, right? After all, that's all that counts!

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    Frank – You’re dreaming in Technicolor if you believe the NDP will win the next election. As bad as Gordo may be, Carole James is worse……

    You're misquoting me, I said the NDP will win eventually, I didn't say when. That the NDP will form a government again in the future is pretty much guaranteed.

  • Mel from Calgary

    4 years ago

    Union Wages

    There are excellent reasons to pay good union wages to public employees.

    1. They live here.

    2. they are more likely to put the money back in the local economy.

    If you owned a store who would you rather have as a customer? A well paid unionised public servant or a privatised non-union employee making a lot less money and worried about job security?

    Privatising to foreign companies takes your tax dollars out of the local economy.

    The data base for these privatised records with American companies fall under the "Patriot Act" hence the american government can look at your records and you have no idea they did it. I know the Campbell Liberals put a privacy clause in the contract but there is no way of enforcing it.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    Nope - my stories come from real people

    You have just the voices in your mind to relate to - plus, you insist upon living in the past.

  • gkam

    4 years ago

    unions

    Unions built the Middle Class by giving working people the ability to actually buy the goods they were making. That spread the bounty to almost all, creating the markets that made the right-wingers rich.

    But now they want even more, and are willing to kill the goose to get the next egg.

    Of course, they'll have plenty to eat, and the rest of us will get "what we deserve" (nothing), by trusting them to share.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    gkam and Mel

    Quote:
    There will always be right-wing hardliners seeking to make a buck by shorting everyone else

    There will always be the looney left who sees that getting something for market value equates to “shorting” someone…….

    Quote:
    Privatising to foreign companies takes your tax dollars out of the local economy.

    That’s a myth perpetuated by the looney left to defend the indefensible.

    The jobs that have been contracted out have nothing to do with core government business. I’m happy to see the unions take their lumps on this one.

    The work doesn’t exist for the benefit of the employees, it exists so the shareholders can receive fair value for their investment.

  • gkam

    4 years ago

    lumps?

    The looney left? I used to be a hateful conservative, until I grew up.

    Right-wingers thrive in zero-sum games, where one "wins" by others losing, like societies that send their money offshore to be added to the riches of the already-wealthy.

    Shareholders, and investments? Didn't I tell you about the fixation on personal gain and the valuation of everything in the terms of money?

    Thanks proving my point.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    gkam

    Is there a point to your nattering or are you just hanging out on your ideological toadstool?

  • gkam

    4 years ago

    no nuts

    Oh, my, how cute! Toadstool - that's a very intelligent response to my assertions of the creation of the Middle Class, and the selfishness of the wealthy and greedy, who put everything in terms of money in THEIR pocket.

    Nattering, . . isn't that the term used by another of your ilk, Spiro Agnew, who was still taking extorted money in paper bags while on White House grounds?

    Thanks for the reminder, and making the association - and my day.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    The work doesn’t exist for the benefit of the employees, it exists so the shareholders can receive fair value for their investment.

    Huh? Gov't work exists to serve the citizenry, not make money for shareholders.

    Nationalize it all.

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    Privatization Works......

    .....only (and I stress "ONLY") when there is competition

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    For instance....

    ....as a consumer, I should be able to select among cable providers, just like I can among car dealerships. And I should be able to contact different hydro providers, to see who will give me the best deal, etc. etc.......but I don't. They have effective monopolies, which doesn't do the consumers any good at all....

  • realisticman

    4 years ago

    keep it coming

    Quote:
    I for one hope the NDP do to business what you cheer the Libs doing to labour. Seems only fair. Nationalize them all, no compensation.

    So it's all envy. We want your business and we want to take it for ourselves. I am amazed that this mentality still exists. Why don't you start your own and give it to the government? It's Dr. Zhivago again. How strange and what a weird mentality. There are businesses that I find repulsive but I've never felt that I would like to have them for my state to control. Utopia dreams. Futile. Not in our lifetime.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    You must be joking

    Did you not read the comment to which Frank was responding? You cannot expect anyone to deal respectfully with that kind of vile prejudice against working people and unions without responding.

    As a matter of fact, I'd say the words - from ‘No-leftnutter’ were the ones that indicate some kind of serious envy and judgment problem about the people who actually do the hard skilled work that keeps this place in one piece. It's not Frank who has the weird mentality and your essaying your own little canned prejudices and facile conclusions says more about 'you' than it does about Frank. As to utopian dreams - I think you'd do well to remember that we're rapidly sinking into a worldwide dystopia of a very few ultra-rich and a very many poor as a result of the utopian dreams of Hayek, Friedman and company and their globalization nightmares.

    Their followers won't be happy until 2% of the world's population have 99% of the wealth. and the rest of humanity is in chains.

    Sadly, we're a lot closer to that than we are to a return to a sensible industrial and economic policy with equitable benefits for all in this country...

    As Warren Buffet said, this is class war – and it is you and those attitudes that started it and are now taking it to its logical and criminal conclusion. Attitudes which are going to lead to a world where most of humanity is in chains while a tiny elite rules over them. The Morlocks are taking over the Earth – eating our young and abandoning the old to the Beacon Hill Villas of the ‘everything for profit’ world you seem so enamored with.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Envy

    Quote:
    So it's all envy.

    I agree, NoLeftNutter is envious of people making good money.

    He wants the gov't to attack labour and I assume you do too based on your defence of his post.

  • realisticman

    4 years ago

    Helping out Frank

    Closing ranks or are you all one?

    The concept of nationalizing businesses is so outdated. I've never been wealthy or even rich but I've never thought that even a great business should become state owned, let alone one I didn't like. Where does this hate and envy come from? Did you guys miss the sixties completely? Did you never read Siddhartha, The Tibetan Book of the Dead, Laing, Baghavad Ghita, I'm OK you're OK, Jerry Rubin, Alan Ginsberg, The I-Ching, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, Douglas Adams, Tom Wolfe. Where does all this sense of entitlement, lack of initiative and coveting come from?

  • G West

    4 years ago

    You still don't get it

    Roll back up the thread to no-leftnutter's comments and stop before you completely embarrass yourself.

    The people who lack initiative are the corporate slugs and their enablers in the executive suite who get usurious returns for doing nothing - often because of something their great grandfather stole. How be you read a little Orwell: The Lion and the Unicorn: Socialism and the English Genius ; H.G. Wells: New Worlds for Old; Jack London: The Iron Heel. I can provide a more lengthy list from other worthies like John Steinbeck once you’ve gotten that psychedelic stuff out of your system – including a fair bit of history.

    I think I'm beginning to see the problem - you must be someone who spent the Sixties in some kind of haze reading Santayana and listening to Santana.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    And no

    Frank doesn't need any help. He's not the one in trouble.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN and Realisticman

    Quote:
    The concept of nationalizing businesses is so outdated.

    And yet not as outdated as gov't attacking unions. That is so 19th century. I'm disappointed to see you and NLN still supporting it.

    However, I've noticed ever since I was a school kid in the 70's that there's a serious envy problem among bitter right-wingers that aren't happy with how their life turned out.

    For those of you that are baby boomers, I would suggest therapy to get over your envy and bitterness of union people.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Therapy

    Oh and I only suggest therapy instead of skills upgrading because let's face it, if you're a boomer, its too late.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    So union guys make lots of money... let it go... move on with your life.

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    G West

    Quote:
    As Warren Buffet said, this is class war – and it is you and those attitudes that started it and are now taking it to its logical and criminal conclusion.

    Just one correction here G West. RM et al are merely foot soldiers in this war; cannon fodder as it were. To ascribe to them a role less passive than that would be to ascribe them some sort of thought process beyond that of army ants.

    Were any of them to actually begin thinking, instead of performing their rote mentalities, would mean the disintegration of the world Warren Buffet inhabits (with do disrespect intended to the man).

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Realisticman

    Quote:
    Closing ranks or are you all one?

    When right-wingers circle the wagons the conspiracy theories are never far away.

    Keep the tin-foil hat on or the black helicopters will find you.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    You're right of course RickW

    I heard Buffett ( I spelled his name wrong yesterday) on the news this morning repeating the self same criticisms about the US tax system and its fundamental unfairnesses - which was ironic in light of Flaherty's ridiculous 'Economic Statement' that actually moves us further from fairness and equity...and closer to the compromised US model with its slavish worship of corporate kleptocrats…

    The passivity of so many people (or the nominal acceptance of a role as cheerleaders/or foot soldiers) for a system that makes 'victims' of the overwhelming majority of citizens (in every country) has always been a puzzle to me.

    Is it fear that prevents us from insisting that our institutions and approaches begin to serve everyone - rather than pamper the few?

    Or is it some naive dream that one day interlocutors such as these will slither their way to the top of the flagpole for a moment?

    Why nominally intelligent people go along with this when there are numerous nations that have approached these collective concerns in a more humane and equitable - and truly democratic way - is a 'real' mystery.

    That, as well as their inability to learn from the past.

  • realisticman

    4 years ago

    Frank

    Quote:
    When right-wingers circle the wagons

    Who's the pot calling here. I don't see NLN or IAMC covering for each other or for me but I do see this repeatedly at the other end of the spectrum. Don't cop the victim stance.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    Realisticman

    You came in here to help out NLN, to use your words, "don't cop the victim stance".

    Now, you may return to your conspiracy theories, Nightbloom will be along shortly.

    Note to staff : My reference to Nightbloom is not an attack on Christians, especially Catholics, living or dead, in heaven, hell, purgatory or "in-transit".

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    Frank and GW

    All your sucking and blowing can’t rationalize why British Columbians should pay a premium for non-core government services.

    Government exists to serve the citizenry that pays the taxes, not the employees that perform the work.....

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    Government exists to serve the citizenry that pays the taxes, not the employees that perform the work.....

    That should have read "Government exists to serve the citizenry that pays the taxes, including the employees that perform the work".

    Nicve to see you've dropped the idea gov't work exists to serve shareholders of private corporations. That was a bad thought process.

    What are your skills? I'll keep an eye out for the next union job I see open.

    Don't want you to go through your entire life wishing the gov't will hurt other workers.

  • G West

    4 years ago

    Wagon circling

    Sure looks like that's what's going on to me.

    Not that I'm surprised - you fellows and your antique ideas need all the help you can get.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    Frank

    Nicve to see you've dropped the idea gov't work exists to serve shareholders of private corporations. That was a bad thought process[b]

    You’ll think that I’m too wrapped up in business but shareholders and taxpayers are one and the same……to argue otherwise is just debating semantics.

  • NoLeftNutter

    4 years ago

    Frank

    Quote:
    That should have read "Government exists to serve the citizenry that pays the taxes, including the employees that perform the work".

    Possibly, but if that is the case it’s not irrational to judge the value of the work against the open market.

  • Frank

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    You’ll think that I’m too wrapped up in business but shareholders and taxpayers are one and the same……to argue otherwise is just debating semantics.

    We're all taxpayers, we're not all shareholders. Shareholders are not necessarily even Canadian. Its not just semantics.

    Quote:
    Possibly, but if that is the case it’s not irrational to judge the value of the work against the open market.

    Judge it against the open market or against other workers in other provinces doing the same job. But, when its not judged at all and ideology is simply passed off as policy then its a recipe for failure.

    In the end the quality of the workplace has deteriorated and eventually that means the quality of the workforce doing that job will deteriorate. And how much money do we save for creating a negative situation?

    Because the companies aren't working for free, they are a middleman between government and workers and they now take a cut of the money that used to go directly to the workers.

    Seems like a huge waste of money to me.

  • Mel from Calgary

    4 years ago

    Open Market Wages

    It is funny, "judge the value of work against the open market". In Alberta when market forces were pushing wages up what did they do...child labour. When Ralph was king he made it possible to higher workers 12 years old and pay them less than 16 year olds when people complained they changed it so the 12 year olds couldn't work in Bars.

    Even in a booming economy "market forces wages" are the last thing business wants.

    What business wants is a relatively high unemployment rate and a labour laws loaded against the workers.

    When was the last time someone in retail or a bank got overtime?

  • RickW

    4 years ago

    NLN

    Quote:
    Possibly, but if that is the case it’s not irrational to judge the value of the work against the open market.

    The reason that bridge collapsed in Minneapolis was because the value of the work WAS judged against the open market, and was just ignored as a consequence......

  • dorothy

    4 years ago

    Here it is...

    They're all just miffed, because the tables are turning, and it gets harder and harder to find the bodies. Those market forces are not always so easy to deal with, when they're not in your favor, and the cheap labor that should have come in from third-world countries is not materializing, as they are choking on their own dirt over there. YOU JUST CAN'T GET GOOD HELP ANYMORE.

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