How many examples of Campbell screwing the public, to line big buiness pockets, does the public need before it comes to its senses and kicks British Columbia's own Weapon of Mass Destruction out of office? Please for the sake of your children WAKE UP!!!!

treason is treason.

expect bctv and the canwest press to hype the project as our only salvation.

tks,
rjm

Good article - these are real concerns and I don't feel as if though we have the answer.

Though I support the privatization of most government owned entities (ICBC, Hydro, etc.) - we can't let corporations own our roads and highways.

Tolls may be necessary in some places, though they must be moderate. A $1 toll to cross the new bridges is fair and will help fund new transportation initiatives.

I don't mind debating these concerns - these details must be disclosed to the public.

However - I don't like debating the merits of this project. We need better transportation in the GVRD. If we want to reduce air pollution - lets give tax credits to manufacturers and developers of alternative fuel vehicles.

Chris H.

Can you tell me one negative impact this deal has had on British Columbia. I can discuss a number of positive implications.

Seriously - give me one negative impact. You can't compare these two at all.

Are you f'n kidding me or is your head really that far up your keister!?
How about 20 derailments including a blighted Chekamus river.
How about a couple of dead engineers in PG cuz a certain capitalist company refused to do simple preventive maintenance.
As for financial numbers I'll defer to my more learned colleages but rest assured-if dead eye gordo had his slimy hand on the deal we got screwed.

The time has come for tolls on ALL roads. Instead of paying a strictly flat rate for auto insurance, we should pay for the amount of time we actually spend operating the vehicle. The more you drive, the greater the likelihood of a claim, the more you pay. Incorporated into this would be fees for road use.

Let's put a chip on every license plate (identifying not only the vehicle but the KIND of vehicle) and start charging for insurance and road taxes by moving in the direction of a partial user-pay model.

This system could ultimately also be used to penalise those who consistently ignore speed limits and run red lights.

Undoubtedly there will be some who are opposed to the user-pay model because it discriminates against the poor. However, The poor can't afford airplanes or gulf island vacation cottages and we don't subsidise them to buy those, so why are we ALL subsidising automobiles?

This would be expensive to set up, but the savings in no-longer-needed Gateway scams, not to mention lower medical costs because the air would become cleaner and there would likely be fewer traffic accident injuries, would offset the costs beforre long.

Owning a car is not a constitutional right. If people want to move to Mission, that's their perogative, but they should not expect eveyone else to subsidise their private commuting costs.

Captalism, one negative impact of the BC Rail give away - we lost control of a very important rail corridor. We, meaning BC. We can not now implement any sort of passenger rail service to allieve congestion on the Sea to Sky. This will be very important for whistler in the coming years as oil prices climb.

We lost a tourism tool for the 'hurtlands', again with passenger rail service. Even the American railways are waking up to the fact that passenger rail can be a money maker, except for the fact that trans-contnental rail routes are at capacity, we would see competition for AMTRAK.

AND DON'T MISTAKE THE ROCKY MOUNTAINEER AS A PASSENGER SERVICE, IT IS NOT, IT IS A HOTEL TRAIN.
Remember in a P'3 the private company involved must make a profit. Watch out for RAV when the screams of indignation when propeerty taxes rise to subsidise SNC/Lavalin, when ridership fails to materialise on the metro.

It is a mistake to say Campbell & Co. are buinessmen, they are not. In reality they are carpet-bagger hucksters, giving away the show to their corporate friends and benefactors.

These guys couldn't run a peanut stand.

Sure I'd be all for road tolls, just take off the gas taxes instead.

In California some years ago a right-wing think tank came up with a study that said instead of road tolls insurance, etc., all costs would be included in the cost of gas. Thus the drivers that drove more, paid more.

Road tolls seldom work aand are basically another tax. I'm sorry I pay enough taxes already and for the guy who said:

, niether are roads and bridges.

Big media has already come out in support. Look at all the quotes from Falcon and the editorials from the reporters and talk show hosts. Also the usual we kkep Victorias feet to the fire interviews where they ask are your feet comfy yet. And that is the tough question. As it is part of the Trans Canada Toll the Bridge so high that its like us Islanders trying to get off the Island.

The question is tolls or taxes!
For a well-to-do person making one trip to the office it is a pittance.
For a single parent driving to three different part-time jobs and perhaps a daycare as well, it means several trips on roads that may be tolled, and each toll represent a much larger percentage of his/her income.
The P3 system only makes it worse as it not only has to pay for the cost, but also needs to make a handsome profit.

What's the big deal? This is just like Bush's "ownership society", where the super-rich own everybody else, due to privatization and the assumpton of governmental assets and responsibilities.

I'll bet Bechtel and Halliburton are already planning to go up there and "improve" your country and economy, just like they did ours in the States.

bontano, http://www.deceivebc.ca/ is this the government that the people of B.C. should be trusting?
Remember the Cocahalla Hwy when he tried to privatize that, and after how many years it still has a toll.
We the people British Columbia supposedly voted for a government that was "for the people by the people" but instead we get a dictatorship of drunken leadership who are owned and operated by organized crime Basi, Verk etc.
With all the corruption going on in the British Columbia Legislature buildings in Victoria how can Gordon Campbell still have power to do all this bull?
He is nothing more than a bought man who should be thrown out of office along with all of his garbage.
What about the Eagle Ridge Bluffs by dictator
Kevin Falcon, I wonder how many view lots he's bought on Eagle Ridge Bluffs as rumor has it that 1800 lots above the highway will soon be for sale?

No road should have tolls. That vile Coquihalla toll has been there for twenty years, and more than payed for the cost of the road. Yet it's still there, a tax on virtually every resident of the Interior (I despise the name "Heartland"), and one which people had to fight tooth and nail to prevent Gordo selling off!

The roads should be part of the commons, free for the use of all, and for the benefit of all.

I am not too familiar with the 2nd issue - but the first has nothing to do with privatization. Derailments over the continent are through the roof, and why - because freight loads have increased due to demand. There are more trains running than ever before. Incidents as a % of train-loads has decreased.

We lost control, but believe me - if the demand was there - CN would be running routes through the heartland, etc. CN is a profiteering company with low overhead costs (compared to the gov't). Why should we have these unprofitable routes for the sake of having them?

As a crown corp, BC Rail couldn't even make a penny. This despite the rest of the rail community doing extremely well. Granted, in this era they would probably be making some money - but not nearly the same as the tax revenues generated.

Grumpy:

Good for you! Damn rights we do - 40 cents on the litre is taxed?

Oh-oh, . . the tax-whiners have shown up. Since Reagan and his greedy group of tax-dodgers, the US is $9,000,000,000,000.00 in debt - the biggest in the world. This from the group of extremist tax-whiners who were going to "save" us from the National Debt. Instead, they turned it into a series of windfalls for the super-rich, and a monstrous burden for working people.

Good luck fighting those who think they shouldn't have to pay for civilization.

gk

Hey gkam - you complain when the government spends tax money badly and then you complain about "tax-whiners" who would rather pay fewer taxes. Feeling hypocritical today?

Capitalism,,, the main reason why CN Rail has had so many derailments is because they can't handle the extra business that B.C. rail has given them so they're trying to pull more than 100 cars, duh
When B.C. rail was a Crown Corp. it was always a moneymaker for the British Columbia taxpayers!
There are approximately 3 million plus people in British Columbia and I'd say 78 percent of the population are totally disgusted with what's happening to democracy in this province or the lack of it!
Kevin Falcons heavy-handed way of handling of the ER Bluffs, the Gateway Program the twinning of the Port Mann Bridge and Highway 1 expansion, the RAV, and the list goes on.
July first is Canada Day and as such we should stand up and let this government know that we have the power 2 take them down!
From a very disgruntled taxpayer who wants to get this government to listen to the people and do their bidding not just for the rich.
This 2010 Winter Olympics would be great if not for the Corporations who are getting richer on all of these venues now the RAV has brought in South American labors who supposedly are being paid $6 to 9 an hour we are becoming a province/country of slave laborers something to be really proud of.

BC Dude:

I agree with everything you say there!!!! Except for the fact that the BC Rail transaction was a good one!

Although, I thank Kevin Falcon's heavy-handed way of handling things - look how much he has got accomplished. Imagine if the NDP were in power, we'd still be talking about what to do - not doing it. They would have probably tried some experimental project to support some union group.

RAV, Gateway, Whistler highway, Kelowna bridge, PR port expansion, Caribou highway plans - now that is a lot of productivity - what did the NDP manage????

A useless highway on the island, fast cats - and poorly used millenium line (though I anticipate higher ridership in years to come)...

We need labourers - what is wrong with a little immigration? We have a worker shortage!!

As for your final comment - whats the problem with making money??? When did making money become a bad thing???

I find it curious that you think highways must be publically owned, but not our source for energy. Actually, I find it kind of stupid.

Speaking of shady real estate deals check out out r koleman and j mcyntyre's nice little "new era" investments.
What a disgrace.
Why work when you can steal.
Socialize the risk and cost, privatise the benefits! gordo and his corrupt band of merry thieves have learned their lessons well.

For 17 wonderful years, I lived on one of the Gulf Islands.

We paid to get on a ferry, then rolled off at "the other side" and travelled for free along the roads.

All pathwaysand roadways should be The Commons. Does everything have to be weighed, measured, and sold off by the unit?

Stump - source for energy is publicly owned, or was.

Firstly - corporations pay royalties - which amount to billions per year. Secondly, the corporations in many instance have bought the land - private land, much like a house.

We pay taxes for roads, which is essentially a public service. We do not pay taxes for energy.

You are such a commie Stump.

Capitalism,
I would be curious as to your reasoning for supporting the privatization of BC Hydro. "Deregulation" of Alberta's electricity industry has been a disaster, with consumers paying much higher rates than under a regulated environment, and businesses unable to predict power prices for budgeting purposes. While I support a light touch as much as possible in regulatory affairs, there are certian industries that deliver better results when held as public trusts.

I'm not a commie actually. I certainly support those who can achieve success without relying on the public teat. Too bad more corporations can't or won't.

Dear Noleftnutter,

Sorry to hear about your monogonadism.

I think you have confused me with Capitalism, or someone else who hates government.

While it is true that I feel the present US "guvmunt" (as Reagan used to say) has badly mismanaged our assets, I have not used this forum as you state.

Please pay attention.

greenalbertan:

I said privatization, not 100% de-regulation - much like Terasen or Telus here in BC. Both are publicly traded and are regulated.

Both have priced their products responsibly.

gkam - not to worry, my other one's safe until the next NDP government.....I took your omment below -

to indicate that you felt the government wasn't spending your tax dollars properly, sorry if I mistranslated.....

I love right wingers calling others commies, Alberta Gas and oil has been given 40 billion in public subsidies in the last 6 yrs, we pay for the cost for the clean up, health care related cost, provide skilled workers via
a public subsidized school system, provide free roads etc etc etc, and they pay us 1% royalty if that, we pay all the cost and big oil and other major corporations in Canada take advantage of our yard sale prices and
benefits, these right wing think tanks and other right wingers are always on the public tit.

Check out how Norway is benefiting from oil industry.

Yes you read it right, 160 billion or 3850 dollar US per citizen, not a bad return , Kind of makes king Ralf look like the drunk he is. I just want Canadians to pay less tax and have more disposable income while making
the corporations pay a bit more fair share. Now why are some of you freaks so scared, the sky will not fall, Chevron and Shell will not pull out of Alberta. stop being Chicken little's.

The 2 golden rules about Tolls, If anyone can point to an example for me please prove me wrong, search the globe is you like

1) Tolls are forever and are a cash cow , aka Coquihalla, YVR
2) Tolls only increase over time.

2.50 per crossing is 1200 per year per car, the only joy I get is seeing all the BC Liberal core supporters getting
their just rewards and paying up. Yep, pay your tolls and when the capacity gets filled in say 2-3 yrs you will be paying tolls for the congestion and idling in traffic.

They should build a Bronze statue of Kevin Falcon sitting on top of the new bridge shooting all the commuters the finger.

Stuart - you could have easily made that type of money on your own by investing in Suncor, Encana, Petro Canada, etc.

You don't need the government to make your money for you, then hold onto it.

Stuart - further I would prefer see higher personal taxes than corporate taxes. Corporations use their profits to re-invest of pay dividends which increase personal wealth.

Greater profits for re-investment, more job creation and innovation.

I guess you like high taxes, corporations have manages to shift the Burdon onto the backs of Canadian by lobbying gov for the last 3 decades, so have your self has record profits for corporations improved the lives of Canadians, do we have better health care, environment, health care, social housing,

Show me one indicator to show how life is better and how corporations have had one other purpose then to enrich themselves, Calgary has a homeless rate and child poverty index higher then Vancouver while sitting on a gold mine. How much human suffering is shareholder value worth to you. Trying to pass of Chevron and
others as good corporation citizens is laughable. Norway on the UN index has one of the highest standards of living in the world and companies play by the rules( Norway's guidelines as to what they want to benefit as
a country for allowing the oil exploration) unlike Canada , cheap and ready , come invest here.

I wonder what Canadians would support, 1) remove income taxes and GST , lower small business tax (employs over 70% of Canadians) and raise corporate tax, our economy would be awash with entrepreneurs and extra disposable income circulation in the economy or for investments etc. Imagine having that extra income tax every pay cheque and having Esso, Chevron, Wal mart and others pick up the tab, I am not for status quo, your system will see overburdened Canadians being taxed to hell for poor welfare bums like Cheveron.

Sorry for the typos, in a rush

Having spent a week in Sydney this February, I would be absolutely horrified if Vancouver attempted to switch over to anything resembling their system. It costs AU$40 to get from Kingsfordsmith Airport to the northern suburbs. Now I'm all for charging a lot of money to force commuters off roads, but if there are no adequate transit options to relieve the pressure (as is the case in Sydney), then you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't. I have been to several major cities in the world, and Sydney had by far the worst rush hour traffic of any city I've been to, and as far as I could tell, tolling had, as the article points out, exacerbated an already difficult situation.

Proposals like this are a dangerous game for Vancouver, to be sure.

I should point out that half of that cost ($AU40) is in parking at the airport, but nonetheless, it is still an exorbitant amount.

Oh, of course they do. Like Enron, right? Corporations benefit from all kinds of government handouts and taxpayer supported programs, and contrary to popular belief, those handouts don't always trickle back down for the better good of society. In the case of larger or international corporations, they're often funneled out of the country.

I'm all for people paying their fair share and dragging themselves up by the bootstraps, yadda yadda. What I have problems with is the double standard that people like you seem to have, where companies should get all the government handouts they can grab, while the individual taxpayer should get nothing back for the taxes they pay out.

I think I am going to give up posting and reading the posts.

Seems to be always the same (yes even my posts!) and 'we' do not seem to be getting anywhere.

I have had it!

But I will be one of the (probably) many who will say in the future: "I told you so"!!!!

Parting jab: especially to those who speak of "commies"; hard to have any faith in a future for Canada and this province (BC) with selfish bottom wipes like Capitalist, IAMClueless and so on.

Go and take a jab, I will not be here to see it!

Stuart:

Your post was possibly the best I have ever read in the short time I have been reading the Tyee. Your accurate understanding of the enslavement of the citizens of the world for the purpose of turning corproate profits is flawless. Thank god we have people in our society who actually do understand what is going on and how we are being fleeced. What a breath of fresh air. The contrast of your intelligence and honest further serves the highlight the sharp contrast between those who post to enrichen lives and those who post to protect their precious dollars.
As for thr typos I see none but then again i am dyslexic!!!!

P.S. Please make the cheque payable to Realist...

First of all freebear, don't go , change happens with Ideas, once you envision something different it starts to happen, some people change and some will never change, its hard to break threw the hard shell that divides us, right wingers see the world in a different way and all major media supports or reinforces their point of view, can you blame them. But the fact that their here is good news, maybe something will click one day and they become valuable assets, I am a white collar worker and was indoctrinated most of my working life and then one day I started to talk to those who think outside the status quo, and did the research and changed my point of views somewhat.

For example , if the US is the good boyscott of the world and cares about democracy then why do you support occupation and dictators around the globe. You just need to point folks in the right direction , the truth is powerful and our ally, don't go away for gods sake, we have enough fat complacent Canadians who have just quit on life

Bring some ideas to the table and ignore those who bother you.

And realist2 , thanks for the comment.

Lets bring ideas, and remember "Evan a dead fish can go with the flow"

Just watched bragging, bloated american army types masturbating over the footage of Zarqawi being blown up.
Sneak up and drop a couple of 500 pound bombs.
Thats where all that money went, not to provide health care, not to build levies that hold, not to refit industry to save our planet (maybe) but to build sneaky bombs and sneaky planes and sneaky landmines and to invade other countries to steal their resources.
Fcuk you bush. You are responsible for him in the first place.

Stuart great write!
Capitaliz? what ever,the corporations I've never heard any good done by any of them just how they kill people in other countries for the land oil forests etc so don't tell me how good these parasites are for the people.
Why do the Feds give the corporations tax cuts?
Jack Layton got Paul Martin to give the taxpayers back $1.9 billion that's BILLION to keep his minority gov in power.
Where is this right in a country like Canada that these Corporations take our forests, farm land, fish, soon water,electricity, damn I'm mad
Who has to pay to clean up Kitamat's mining enviroment catastrophy, I'll guaranty it won't be a mining Company

Yes, you mistranslated, or inferred what you wanted to attack.

The privatization of government assets isn't the same issue as squandering tax dollars. Privatization gives control of our assets and services to those who would use them against us for profit.

But now that you've brought it up, the Bush program is purely a raid on the public treasury by the very-rich, . . essentially class warfare.

But they're both egregious sins. We are wasting our resources (and our future) on wars of conquest, star wars missile defense wet dreams, and gross incompetence in the administration of duties.

The US spends more on its war machine than all other countries in the world combined! Is that enough for you? Do you think that's a good use of our tax dollars? And do you think the Bush use of private armies is a good idea?

Capitalism, the reason would nor run a passenger service is that the people running CN and most other major North american Railways are bean counters and accountants who know very little about railways. That's why North American railways, especially Canadian railways are about 50 years behind the times.

At leasr when BC Rail was publically owned, there was a chance for modern passenger rail to operate. NOT NOW! CNR will milk the former BC Rail for all it's worth and to hell with the BC public. Good god, the former passenger service was only subsidised by $6 million annually (by comparison SkyTrain is subsidised by over $200 million annually, and brought in international tourist by the score! In fact it was listed as one of the top ten rail trips.

But to Campbell, the arrogant/ignornat man he is, only $300 a night hotels in Maui or Whistler are only worthy to be called tourist attractions.

Back to toll. All tolls do is increase costs for drivers and diverting tax money that could be used for roads, etc. into private pockets, mostly South of the border.

And for Bill Good and the CORUS crowd, they are nothing but a Liberal sponsored infomercial! There is no truth or fact on CORUS, which mirrors the Liberals pure carpetbaggers and liars.

Damn I wish there was a spell check on this blog!

Toll
Reason for tolling is to discourage the usage. Then why the bridge has to be built anyway.
More traffic to Vancouver will cause grid lock.
We are at the limit. Commercial traffic should use the railway as much as possible and load centres should be established outside the conjested area to serve the rest of the province and country. Don't build more bridges and roads to Vancouver please!

Very interesting about 3P's, old but still a very big Wake-Up call.
http://www.workingtv.com/ccpa3psforum.html#top
July 1st is Canada Day!

Some of the lefty (il)logic here is laughable.
Stuart - most small businesses are corporations, what is your idea - only big companies should be taxed? Why?

Rhea - what percentage of companies in Canada get "government handouts"?

When corporations pay higher taxes there are only 3 ways for them to pay for it -

- reduce returns to shareholders like union and government pension funds, mutual funds or other investors.

- reduce overheads, like wages or lower costs of goods which negativley affect their suppliers.

- raise prices to their customers.

Which of those three groups do you want to punish with higher corporate taxes, and why?

no nutter:
Nice try on the retoric but, if you reduce the returns to shareholders then that money could be shared with everyone and not just the wealthy who can aford to play the market. You give yourself away as not very realistic when you try to foist these rediculous thoughts on those who think. I guess you guys are trapped by your own greedy thoughts which seem to misguide you into thinking your ideas are superior.
As far as the pensions, the government could fund them directly with the tax dollars and cut out leaches like yourself. Even a linear thinker like yourself can see tha advantages of cutting out the middle men. In fact I think this concept should be taught to all business students. Look at Walmart(yech by the way!); less middlemen equal more profit.

This is laughable - it is the companies funding the system in the first place. All of their handouts - they are merely saying that they fund the system and want their dollars to be spent wisely.

Realist2:

By those sentiments, you my friend, are a communist. That is some of the most ultra-left rhetoric I have ever read. Let's strip rewards and risk incentives and share everything....

Linear thinkers can visualize the advantages of cutting out the middle man - however, not when it comes to the government. The government treats everything like general revenue and only has one sight in mind - the next election.

People are not linear thinkers and there are enough morons in this province that need to be bought-off.

The government can manage a popsicle stand - they are inefficient and not responsible. We should keep the government out of our lives.

Capitalism:

The taxpayers got $500,000 for BC Rail and all of its assets. How much was BC Rail going to make per year in the short to medium term? BC Rail's revenues were increasing every year, bringing millions into government coffers. Now, CN gets it for 990 years. The $1 billion CN borrowed from the bank was a no brainer. This is like free money for them. To top it off, municipalities like North Vancouver saw major job losses. We no longer have provincial control over safety of these rail lines as CN cut the number of runs and increased train length. I have to ask, if it was such a great deal then why did the media have to leak the details of it?. I wouldn't want the BC Liberals selling my house. They might give it away for some magic beans.

Linear thinkers tend to repeat themselves like chanting "COMMUNISM!!" whenever they are frightened. You can't graft a new idea on a absent mind...

Loss of provincial control - good!

The reason why BC Rail wasn't making any money and had amassed a huge amount of debt was because it was run for its employees and not the taxpayer - much like the old BC Ferries.

Exactly my point - this company was there, running inefficiently, not making any money (relative to industry competitors) and had a massive debt-load. This company was running without any regard for the taxpayer and don't give me that crap.

The selling your house analogy is a joke. I have lived in BC for my entire life and never personally used BC Rail - and I have travelled the province extensively.

Cap, you said:

RAV, Gateway, Whistler highway, Kelowna bridge, PR port expansion, Caribou highway plans - now that is a lot of productivity

You haven't a clue what you're talking about.

Delta "superport" was just a bulk-loading station earning a pittance until the NDP through Westshore Terminals turned it into a container port to make us "the loading dock of North America" as I heard elsewhere. Gordo has nothing to do with any expansion plans - that's a Port Authority initiative.

Gateway, except for the $400 million South Fraser road, is a money-losing idiot's venture. It doesn't move goods, it moves people who could be persuaded to move by other means if this government had the spine to do so. It merely subsidizes bad decisions, something this government swore not to do.

Same with Whistler highway. This retarded government shut down a perfectly viable train service for want of $70 million in double-tracking and $40 million in extra equipment to provide half-hourly service to Whistler for $30 a ticket in order to spend $600 million on a highway for SUVs with bigger brains than their drivers. Once again, this highway moves no goods whatsoever; it merely subsidizes bad personal decisions.

Kelowna bridge has been studied to death, but once again, that is bad decision-making on the part of the communities in the Okanagan. Unplanned growth has resulted in bad land-use decisions - water, sewer, goods movement, pollution and garbage, air quality and social services are all out of control in the region, not just the bridge. Just ask my buddy Aaron Dinwoodie, the director for Okanagan Westside - he'll tell you all the details.

What Caribou highway?

But if you want to move goods to market, what happened to the Kicking Horse Pass upgrade? Why is truck traffic to Eastern Canada still going through the states? What happened to preferential rates or service for port shippers on railways to promote business? What's happened to Prince Rupert? (again an NDP, and now a Liberal pipe dream).

And don't even talk about RAV or Millennium. Millennium still requires a $48 subsidy per ride, and when RAV is finished, if it EVER makes the ridership targets needed, its subsidy will be $76 per rider. If it doesn't, well the sky's the limit. These toy trains will be Vancouver's Cross City tunnel.

I heard Barry Penner was spouting lies about RAV in the Scum yesterday, something about removing a million cars from the roads or something. Shows just how idiotic HE is.

Usually, you have something good to say, Capo, but this time you're wayyyy out to lunch.

You're forgetting all the union and government pensions who are major players in the market. Why would you limit the potential for returns on investment, and if you did, where would the money come from for capital and business investments, the government?

zalm:

Dead on! First, Sam (unwise) Sullivan said that RAV will remove 100,000 cars a day; then last week penner said 200,000 cars a day; and now is he saying a million cars? At best RAV will carry about 10% to 15% more passengers than the current B-Line bus service. There will be limited bus service on Cambie and many will just opt to drive.

South Delta and South Surrey bus service will collapse as taking the car will be easier. Airport traffic will never materialize as for many it will just as convenient, for a few dollars more to take a cab.

As for Gateway it's nothing more than a $3 billion give away to the Road Builder's Association (the real reason for Eagleridge as the Road builder's Association have no experience building tunnels and must sub contract and lose profitts $$$)

Tolling PPP's is just Liberal speak for giving politcal supporters even more of the taxpayer's cash.

Not sure where the name calling advances the discussion and I'm interested to know how you know what my investments or pensions are.

There is traffic congestion at the Port Mann bridge now - so they build another bridge beside the Port Mann and charge a toll. What about the toll causing just as much congestion?

I don't always agree with the Campbell Libs but after reading this blog, how did they ever win the last election?

Could it be said Tyee people are not considered mainstream?

geezer 65:
The majority of people who post here are interested in knowing the truth. Most of society is too busy trying to survive the neocon race to the bottom to know what is really being done to them. That is how the neocons have been able to get re-elected. It is a dangerous game and they are well orgainized to keep the masses too busy and uniformed. If you don't beleive this just think what happens to Canadians when there is a Hockey strike (think roman coluseum gladiators to keep the masses uninfirmed and entertained). I was at a ralley to prevent the theft of our railroad, (before it was sold), and there were young B.C. Rail employees complaining that they were directed to attend but, they would rather be at home watching the hockey game. Such stupidity!! It was only their livelyhood at stake! The masses have been lulled to sleep by a series of lying immoral politicians who don't offer real intellectual alternatives. Thus, we the thinking and aware people of B.C. see our province and Country being stolen right from under our own noses and the worst part is we know it is all about neocon greed and instant gratification verses real community advancement and sharing. we are witnesses to the theft of our own childrens futures to satisfy the greedy right now. That is why we, with the exception of the occasional neocon nut who lives in paranoya, read the tyee.

Realist2 - just because neocons are paranoid doesn't mean that someone's not out to get them.....

Vertigern:

Darn good idea! I live on Vancouver Island, and as the ferry system IS considered part of the highway system..................

Stump:

Actually, energy can be privatiely owned, but it should be rationed.....so many joules, or watts, or whatever, and so may litres, and if you use it up before the next ration.........too bad!!!

So go ahead! Buy a SUV......
Or run your air conditioning all day long, with no one home, except the cat. Who cares? But when the ration runs out, well, c'est la vie!!

realist2

Gawd, your post reminds me of the type of speeches I used to read about Lenin making.

OK, agree with you - but 99% of the blame should be on the guy who would rather have been home watching hockey - not the politicians. The politicians are of our own making - good and mostly bad.
The public, for the most part, isn't much above the Jerry Springer show - and do you think that that type of person is going to read a blog - unless it's about the Jerry Springer show or maybe some truck rodeo event?

A lot of Tyee readers doubt the impact of letters to the government/media and instead complain like hell on this site to people who generally agree with them. But, if the government (specific minister) receives a million letters/emails on a particular subject, it tends to be influenced. Or, a newspaper editor having the same influx of mail would achieve the same.

What I'm trying to say is we should still complain on this site (because it makes us feel better) - but that's not enough!

I would be surprised if more than one or two politicians surfed this site even on a regular basis.

Raising the prices has the same effect and nobody wants that. The rich would find a way around rationing too.

"The reason why BC Rail wasn't making any money...."

That is not true. BC Rail was making millions when the BC Liberals sold it. BC Rail had taken a hit in the past because of low commodity prices. Now with the industries that need the rail line booming, BC Rail was predicted to pull in $100 million a year profit for BC taxpayers. CN Rail gets it for 990 years? I'm sorry, but this wasn't a great deal for us at all. You'd think governments would have a longer term view than this. There was no "magic" with what CN Rail has done. They have not "turned" this around or any other such thing. We sold a money making venture for some short term gain. This was simply not great business.

First we gave up our railway. A profitable one by the way. Then our ferry corp and a multitude of services. Now we may have private comanies charging us to use our highways. I wonder what is next, a return to pay toilets?

The give away of BC Rail is connected to Organized crime and the BC Liberals through the x minister of Finance et'al Basi

BC Dude, Millionaire Jack also gave us Herr Harper.

Tom, BC Rail was never profitable. The direct subsidy was in the neighbourhood of a billion a year.

Jack and the NDP worked the minority system the way it is meant to work!
When you cannot get any support for your causes, then you do not support the governemnt anymore.
Do not blame NDP that the voters failed to see the options they had before them1
Maybe next time around they will realize there are at least 3 viable options?

BC Rail paid a total of $137.7 million in dividends to the public -dividends that could now be used towards health and education. All railways carry an operating debt and BC Rail had one of the lowest in all of North America. The taxpayers were also not on the hook for that debt servicing - it was paid for out of BC Rail revenues.

But the Fibs mode of operation is to take what is profitable to the public and turn it instead into profits for big corporations by creating a phony manufactured crisis, thus, presto!… making it appear unsustainable… and then selling OUR assets right into the waiting, often foreign hands of private business who are, of course, more than happy to oblige.

Stupid economics… or treason? Or both?

TY Gloomy!
When you have big corporations and big media pushing the Fed Conservatives & in BC the Libs.
These bought & paid 4 losers are trying to break Canada up as a souvern nation.
Just look who is in Toronto now the Bilderbergs now these dirt bags are real evil.

Is this the future?
This scares the s out of me.
Bilderbergs
Sutherland is expected to again call for "Supranational institutions to manage the global economy while denouncing nations that "cling tenaciously to their separate identities" while calling for "sharing sovereignty"

http://www.4rie.com/anchor1201647

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Korten/WhenCorpsRuleWorld_Korten.html

Geezer65:
Raising prices still allows people to think all they need is money and they can waste whatever they want to.

Working man, you said,

[Tom, BC Rail was never profitable. The direct subsidy was in the neighbourhood of a billion a year.]

Which is true if you include (as all balance sheets do) the deprecation, which was more than $1.2 bilion in the last accounting we have (2004). But nobody throws a railbed away after 20 years (the CCA given by RC), just as nobody throws a car 5-6 years old into the scrapyard. It still has value. But for accounting purposes, inefficient corporations are rewarded for operating without proper maintenance by our tax system, and BC Rail is no different. Why do you think CN picked it up for more than the value of its moving assets?

It's long past time that RC started to charge corporations that run inefficiently by not doing proper maintenance (which usually means large corporations, which are most often less efficient, despite what your Econ 100 textbooks may tell you) the fair price of their poor operation. Cars should last 10 years/200,000 km and be depreciated accordingly. Apartments should last 50 years, and be depreciated accordingly. Factories should last 20 years and be depreciated accordingly, not because Marketing says their product "isn't new enough to sell"

I6t's time to make the neocon "theoretical" world conform to the real world.

Ahh, the conspiracy theories. Considering that Sir Connie Black and Heather Reisman have both attended meetings of this secret cabal I wonder where the brain power comes for a -

Of course the main stream media dismisses the theorists as nut bars, further proof that there really is a conspiracy.....remember lefties, just cause you're paranoid doesn't mean that someones not out to get you....

I would say it's much more the righistas who are paranoid. Look at all what's happening "national security-wise" that treats citizens as the enemy, all courtesy of the righties..........

Well, the provincial Liberals are polling at 57%. They must be doing something right. What are the NDP doing to get elected? Not much me thinks. We have the lowest unemployment in 30 years. Can the NDP claim that?

Can the liberals claim credit for the high world prices on natural rescources?
China alone is fueling our economy, the rest is gravy

NoLeftNutter, How many times U gonna use [remember lefties, just cause you're paranoid doesn't mean that someones not out to get you....]?
As far as lowest unemployment rates in 30 years &6. mcbucks to $10. cap on most service sector jobs, while Corporate profits soar up and goverments still give them huge tax cuts & loopholes.
Banks $1.5 Billion first 1/4 profits = foreclosers on people's dreams as interest rates edge up. Greed
30yrs ago employers were paying good liveable wages with full benefits and still making a good profit.

Working Man, 57% did U get this % from Canwest, me thinks so.
As for the Bilderbergs why was there a complete media blackout of their meetings except Fri?
Why was Harpo left out?

"Well, the provincial Liberals are polling at 57%. They must be doing something right. What are the NDP doing to get elected? Not much me thinks. We have the lowest unemployment in 30 years. Can the NDP claim that?"

Who cares what they are polling at, or what the NDP spin is these days. The worries that the above article has over tolls is legitimate. Please don't tell me you'd follow Gordon Campbell off a Maui cliff just because. These deals with private corporations should be open to the public. The 2010 deals that are being released now are downright scary. UBC won't be allowed to use their new arena for concert events because Orca Bay doesn't like competition? Why we are signing off on such things seems ludicrous to me. Public officials are supposed to make deals that are in the best interest of the public, not individual business owners.

If the tolling of the new twinned bridge is going to be managed by a private company, the public should see the contract. Otherwise, I have no doubt that the public and government will assume all the risks, just like what happened on the 407 in Ontario.

These deals are designed to sign up as many F(r)iends of Gordon Campbell (especially the ones who owns big, noisy bulldozers) under PPP as possible, just in case they lose the 2009 election. That way everything is locked in, and it would cost the succeeding government humongously in penalties.

Of course, a succeeding government COULD say "Sue Me!" and cancel the contracts, re-open the bids for tender, open the books as well, and when they find proof of the collusion that went on, throw the Liberal bums in jail, like what was tried when the Cons in Saskatchewan screwed that province under Devine.

Geezer 65:
one of the main differences between how I think and how Lenin thought (I believe, as I have just begun to learn about how governments work thanks to B.C.'s W.O.M.D. Gordon Campbell and his coming for the disabled like hitler came for the jews. Never again indeed!!) is that I am a devout capitalist. Civilization requires a carrot dangled in front of the masses to make them productive. However,it is my belief that our government should act as the corporate conscience and tax them appropriately. Most capitalists don't want any external control over their profits and will scream that they are responsible and ethical enough to dole out their profits to the masses through shares in the company. The reality is that most corporations act like David Emerson and have the ethics of a sewer rat. They quite rightly believe that they are responsible for accumulating profit for themselves and shareholders but, little else. Honest government (What a dream this would be) should return to the days of corporate taxation (remember the fifties when most had jobs, only one person in the family had to work, children were raised by their parents instead of a minimum wage kid at a daycare and governments were awash in cash due to corporate taxation?), thus, there would be more money available for social services and infrastructure and a reduction in personal income tax as corporations would be forced to act responsibly to the society it is supposed to serve. The neocons go wrong when they fail to realize that the economy is here to better serve society not society is here to better the economy.

Is "civilization" about being ants?

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
- Robert Heinlein

realist2:

Some unusual views for a devout capitalist!
Are you sure that you are not a socialist, who happens to have money?
All kidding aside, it is refreshing to hear you promoting a social conscience and taxation of corporations!
Yes indeed there was a day when one person could support a family, oh happy days!

realist2 I agree 99% of what U said on your last blog!
When so called elite Pol(ut)ititons (BC Fibs & Fed Cons) have an agenda to dismantle the Social network/safeguards put in place by real Politicians who knew that history showed all previous civilizations collapsed because they only took & never helped or gave lower society a second look!
Me, I'm a person with a disability & I'm worried.
I had my accident on July 1 Canada Day & I get a Fed disability pension of (Now Wait, hold on)
was $860. now $880. month WOW
Not whining just stating a grim fact.

I'm all for passing the real costs of automobiles onto automobile users - especially those single occupancy users.

The current situation where some huge fraction of our landscape is devoted to supporting cars - to say nothing of the overall organization of the city, or of the overwhelming bias of our public spaces in favour of cars, or, at a stretch, wars in the Middle East - provides an unreconcilable subsidy for cars.

There's no case to be made that car users have paid for this subsidy.

And the case that cars are an unmutable nescessity to our civilization is certainly debatable. Certainly no one could tally up our needs (getting to work, emergency services, etc.) and say that our commitment to cars is in reasonable proportion.

Our commitment has grown way out of hand, and to a zeroth order approximation, grows exponentially. Car use promotes more car infrastructure, more infrastructure promotes more cars. Among other things, speedbumps and toll bridges and public concern limit the growth, but as Eagle Ridge shows, the pressure is strong and endless.

As for PPP projects - this is a hot item for global investment banks - they see them as low risk, guaranteed investments. And it's painfully obvious why this is true. It would be fascinating to see a list of PPPs, with an analysis of how well the public interest was served, and how those that did serve the public interest where created.

This is why we can't trust anything that has to do with big oil because this happens every time, check it out.

http://dontcrush.com/

I should have said "Threatens" big oil

BC Dude - perhpas you slept through my previous post...my paranoia reference there was for the neocons.

Realist2 - the biggest change in government economic policy in the last 40 years hasn't been the shift from corporate to personal taxes but the incredible increases in government activity and weatlth redistribution that poduces such little benefit.

PET developed the "bribe them with their tax dollars" strategy and the Liberals have perfected the process. Federal program spending has increased almost 70% ($70 billion) per year in the past 7 years and yet most Canadians are no better off then they were, and those that are have done so in spite of the government not because of it.

Ironically, the height of Liberal popularity over the past 20 years was when Martin was at his most Draconian.....go figure.

So far Gordon Campbel and his team have given away over three billion dollars in corporate tax welfare. Don't tell me that this is not the biggest change in government policy, and this is just what the liberals have done in their terms. It has been going on much longer than just Gordo but, he has accelerated the degradation to new levels of destruction. Individuals are taxed to death to make up for the give away of corporate welfare.

Realist2 - Don't know how or where your information comes from but it smells like heifer dust to me.....any one can post silly numbers without any support or proof. Doesn't make it true.

Most neocons only see what they want anyways try to look and you will find the answers

NoLeftNutter, yeah me bad zzzz
I still can't believe how, Legally Gordo can still be in power?
June 15 06 I hope that the ship hits the fan and eventually finds the BC Fiberals guilty of being @ the helm when the RCMP raided the BC Legislature Blg.
Today a man was killed on part of the 2010 Winter Olympics Hwy.
And how many others?

So the tunnel contract in Sydney "compensates...tunnel operators for massive damages at the publics expense if future public transport initiatives steal potential tunnel customers away"...Hmmmm. Guess that explains why no alternative means of public transportation have been considered (or at least discussed) by Falcon and crew in regards to Gateway. Yup- 'splains a few tings.

Again I ask the Tyee blogers to look at this site ( http://bctrialofbasi-virk.blogspot.com/ )and like myself and my friends Wonder how the Fiberals can still make huge costly decisions that will effect my kids, my Grandkids, and their Generation?