And that's only half of the story Rafe!<>
You should know that there is no natural gas shortage - it's just the EnCana Corporation hedging it's bets by turning down the taps.(now that they and their associates own most of the gas wells and have bought up all of the choice oil and gas leases in "historic" budget giveaways.)<>

You might ask Ostergaard what the heck is going on. He's the former NDP deputy minister who became chair of the Utilities Commission and is now a deputy to Energy Minister Neufeld. (obviously he never missed a beat with the change in government).<>

He's also the person responsible for rubberstamping the sale of Westcoast Energy to the Americans. - Watch now for government to rubberstamp an electric rate hike in the coming months to make up the difference in cheaper electrical energy.<>

Well written...too bad Rafe is preaching to the choir on the Tyee.

I'm sure cosmo wrote a meaningful comment but I stopped reading after the 2nd word. A spelling error that profound completely discounts what is being said.

Oh obvious,

I know how to spell but things move fast these days, and I do not review my posts.

On that note, your own jargon is quite ironic. For instance, your very first sentence is an absolute grammatical disgrace to one who apparently takes it seriously.

I will not go so far as to say that these oversights are so profound that your ideas are not worth considering. I believe everybody is worth listening to, written expression (or social class) being what it may.

Eloquently said no doubt. - However obvious as you may be, I have no idea what you meant. (I don't sing in Rafe's choir.)

As Cosmo hinted at it, these crimes against BC and against humanity, going on all over the world, are the result of the garbage being taught in our and in the world's universities as "neoclassical market economics".

The biggest crime wave in human history, destroying democracy, establishing worldwide corporate dictatorship, destituting billions and ruining the ecology for future generations.
It is a "science" at the intellectual level of Hitler's racial theories based on the Rosenberg religion, yet permitted and encouraged by governments to be taught in tax funded institutions.

Unions, environmentalists and the awakening public are wasting their time protesting in the streets and against politicians, when the real crimes are committed in our so called "learning institutions". I'm not against, but for academic freedoms and, as far I'm concerned, the growing corporate stranglehold on our educational system is killing them. Ed Deak, Big Lake.

Obviously you support a "Nuke em' all" solution? - How about our new Falconbridge Chinese corporate citizens' - Nuke them too?

Who knows what goes on under the tables?
Another example of those we elect pursuing venal interests over those of the electorate.

Kinder Morgan talks of broadening the U.S. footprint into Canada. A fine distinction perhaps, but "on" Canada would more correct.

How easy it is for who control the flow to contrive shortages, and thus manipulate prices.
One need only look at some of the contrived situations around the early-70s oil "crisis".

Is Gordon Campbell a 'foriegn agent' sent by the US, to destroy BC? Quite seriously, Gordo is selling off everything that makes BC, BC. The BC Rail give-away, Teresen gas sell off, free run of the fishfarms and almost no policing of enviromental law, is slowly choking BC.

Globalization is nothing more than a catchword for turning BC into nothing more than hewers of wood (before the pine beetle eats it all) and drawers of water (before CN pollutes it all).

More and more Gordo has put the knife in the back of BC and I won't be satisfied uhtil he is charges with treason!

This would have made a good election issue, wouldn`t it? But on the other hand, we had the BC Rail issue, Accenture in charge of BC Hydro billing, and that didn`t stop the electorate. Slowly but surely, it`s all going to the US, and we are hardly making any noise at all.I suspect that the awareness of our population will have to be raised a notch or two.

For your own satisfaction try looking under Peter Brown's big table at 666 Burrard Street for obvious answers in how to win a marathon.

"Is Gordon Campbell a 'foriegn agent' sent by the US, to destroy BC?" - Hardly, according to Tyee readers he's a Nazi.

obvious,

Come off it! "seams" instead of "seems" changes nothing at all - certainly a damned poor excuse to not read what the poster had to say.

Since you like to feel superior, you should have stuck with it. You would have come upon "elequant". Could have climaxed right there.

Spelling mistakes and all, the cosmo post had much to say and was, to me, very interesting.
Having criticized it, your post on the other hand............

Note to somebody hiding behind the name of "gasworks"

My friend, you have serious problems, but at least you picked the correct nom de plume.
Ed Deak, Big Lake.

El Gordo's not a Nazi, just a plain old fashioned fascist, but ulimately the problem isn't him, it is the market based economy that rewards shills and thugs like him which we must abolish. Further, in place of this monstrosity we must create a participatory economy.

parecon.org

Hiding? - Hardly Fiatlux my friend, you wrote:

It is a "science" at the intellectual level of Hitler's racial theories based on the Rosenberg religion, yet permitted and encouraged by governments to be taught in tax funded institutions.

Obviously, (contrary to some Tyee reader opinion's) he's not a Nazi.

There are many faces of fascism. Gordo and his gang of used car salesmen busily pandering to their corporate overlords are hastening the advent of a neo-fascist regime. The fucks. Not that we in BC have not been a branch plant since day one, but what I think we need here is the Argentinian solution. General strike, and uprising to wrest the riches out of the grasp of the Yanquis. There is no other way at this point. It may mean short-term pain, but will result in long-term gain.

Give them Argentinean Tommyguns? - that's no solution. What we need are straight facts so we can properly participate. Our government still works behind closed doors while giving away our natural resources.

I can tell you this, Terasen Gas owes British Columbian's plenty. This "international company" has been over-charging it's customers in gas cost recovery charges for years and the Utilities Commission (as well as the Premier) prefer to turn a blind eye.

I would suggest rather than footprint, a better term would be bridgehead, as at some point, if we have any energy reserves that are not committed to the Americans, the will come and take it.

I also agree with Ed when it comes to education, but if you have read any Ivan Illich you would realize that education is alll about creating consumer's not citizens.

This is scary and sad, because it's too late to go back and the day will come, perhaps sooner than later, when we sorely regret this -- shivering in the cold as our gas is piped abroad, or watching the city burn after poorly maintained pipes rupture during a quake.

Rafe, I disagree that there was nothing wrong with the first step, when Vander Zalm privatized it, allowing private investors to make a pile of money. Those profits rightly belonged to the citizens of BC (...or Canadians, or First Nations, take your pick), so that was just the first rip-off.

But this is the spirit upon which modern B.C. was founded and this has been happening since Westerners first set their sights on this land. As long as we give greedy, shortsighted politicians of any stripe the right to sell off precious natural assets at their whim, this pillage will continue until there is nothing left. And as we grow and consume more & more and competition for resources becomes increasingly ferocious, we can just expect this sort of thing to become more blatant, more scary.

And all the while the rich get richer!

Then again, they will likely haqve to spend their money employing labourers to puch around their SUVs because not even the rich will be able to afford gasoline!

"The history of social change is the history of millions of actions, small and large, coming together at points in history and creating a power that governments cannot suppress."

· Howard Zinn, professor emeritus of political science at Boston University, author of A People's History of the United States

Ah yes, the Argentinean solution, are you suggesting BC invades Baranof Island?

Making a minor spelling error on a Monday morning is not a crime. It is a shame that we can not edit our posts, as you often realize the error as you hit the send button.

What I find interesting about the sell off of BC assets is that everyone forgets who bought them in the first place. WAC Benentt was no raving socialist, but he did understand that the success of the province lay in it’s ability to control the infrastructure. Our prosperity over the last 40 years are mainly based on his decisions.

WAC Bennett was the first to sell off the Columbia-Kootenay Basin in a series of backroom deals with the Americans.

Obviously his level of understanding was superficial.

Name you are right on target.This is all part of the same history that began with exploiting animal pelts for fashionable hats. Our national, short sighted, addiction of giving away resources to those with the least bit of organization (boats in the pelt days) has now taken an unusual step beyond stupidity. We supply the boats (pipelines) now as part of the deal.

At some point we drew the line (the 20% line) now we forgot why, in the glow of pretending we are players in a game much bigger than we can imagine or compete in.

I think Campbell actually doesn’t get it. It is more like giddy wallowing in the big game and thinking that he is a player. It is our fault actually, for electing folks who aren’t too bright and use politics as an ego boost without understanding the least bit about what is going on. Surely there is no real debate about the common sense issue we can all see so plainly.

I don't see a fox guarding our henhouse. I see a lap dog.

"The small man understands profit. The great man understands equity." -Confucius

This principle is something the Americans have always known, they and the Canadian upper-class economic elites that love to walk the same halls.

One commenter offered the observation that a billionaire from Mexico and a billionaire from China and a billionaire from New York all have much more in common than any random three Canadians have with each other. The nationality of money is the one to which Campbell and his cohorts prefer to belong. Any song and dance about BC or Canada and their political or social virtues vis-a-vis the rest of the world is simply dressing on the fact that he lives here and has made a life study of how to use the rest of us, his biogeographic constituency, to enhance his own personal and financial ego.

One of BC's great strengths relative to Canada has long been a far greater economic independence of the US.
Especially at a time when even Gordie Campbell himself seems to have been taught to spout the right words, as at his recent meetings with the premiers of Canada.
"The United States is not the only jurisdiction that wants our energy resources."
"We have enormous opportunities across the Asia-Pacific in China, India."
http://www.brandonsun.com/story.php?story_id=898
At the same time as he's on his hind legs blathering all this, he seems to be doing everything he can to put BC into Uncle Sam' *** pocket.
Its just a damn shame that, as so frequently seems the case, Gordie either a) has learned the words, but failed to grasp the implications. or b) is full of it again.

It is always the same people who come out on top under every ideological system. The billionaires from all the countries would be the nazi Gauleiters and communist commissars under different regimes, just as the former soviet party cadres are now the capitalist billionaires.

I said this once to a stock dealer customer of mine about 40 years ago in Vancouver, that the same people would be living in Shaughnessy and the British Properties under every known ideology and he never spoke to me again. Which was OK by me.
Ed Deak, Big Lake.

Yes, Virginia, there is a conspiracy. Solocanoe, I think you meant "lap dancer", rather than "lap dog", didn't you? Cosmo's observation is correct. Deep Friedmaniac wreckonomic theory is still being served up in seminars and Universities all over the planet, even though Milton Friedman has recanted all that he said about profit being the only thing. Of course, Tom Friedman still expounds the wreckonomic theory daily in the New York Crimes and is quoted generously in other corporate-sucking dailies around the world.
And Colin, you are way back in the time of the Falkan war. Blair is the new idiot on the British blockhead, but better than Thatcher. (My cat's litter is better than Thatcher.) The Argentine solution was the workers' took over their own factories that the owners had shut. The workers ran them profitably--despite a total USA embargo. (The USA hates any worker-owned initiative, anything that gives workers rights beyond that of serf.) While that takeover was a bright move (see "The Take, by Naomi Klein and Avi Lewis), the Argentine voters showed themselves to be no brighter than BC people"; they, too, voted in a rightwing thing that wants to give the factories back to the original owners--so they can close them on whim all over again! The Devine Right of the Globalized Rich is well-organized. We, the average, decent folk will be in shackles soon, starving and thirsty--and most will wonder what happened. Not too many are paying attention. They have no idea whom to vote for! How can anyone not know who to vote for? I guess too many still read and watch the corporate media. They never read thetyee.ca or any other alternate press--except those among them who want to sabotage free speech (you know who on thetyee.ca, eh?). The majority of people don't want to read anything that makes them think. That would hurt their wittle bwain. So stubborn ignorance abounds and Wal-Mart profits keep going up. It is to puke.

Ed
You are quite astute on that point, no political theory survives contact with humans.

I will be poking around your neck of the woods next week, you knows we might bump into each other.

To think that Gordon Campbell and his associates are to stupid to know what they are doing is naive, at best. Gordo and company know exactly what they are doing and thousands like him throughout the world are systematically stripping the working class of their basic rights and privleges.
Unfortunately, most of us are too damn lazy or stupid to look beyond the corporate news that is broadcast into our living rooms every evening. By the time we wake up, it'll be too damn late.
Surprised those dorks JIm, Jean and thier other dorky friends haven't logged on yet to tell us what a great job their leader is doing.

You're right, Birch. Mr. Campbell, Mr. Kinder and their soulmates around the world have far more in common with each other than their critics do. Just look at the petty sniping among posters on this site, even though most essentially agree on the key problems and would have to find ways to collaborate if they are to do anything about it.

Solocanoe, I'm not sure I'd agree that it's a simple case of them not being too bright either. I suspect it's more about how differently and how narrowly they define success -- i.e. returns maximized over the next fiscal quarter, if one is reporting to shareholders, or next electoral period, in Campbell's case, or whenever it is that their personal performace is up for review.

The welfare of nations, people, provinces, the future of our children, etc., none of this has any bearings on the decisions they make, unless the broad, long-term implications are so starkly evident up front that it would be impossible for them to escape the negative fallout within their own reporting periods. Even then, one can always hire high-priced PR people to handle such unpleasantries, for the most part.

Two things are clear.

First, BC needs a credible news medium which, unlike our corporate media (which are essentially advertising supplements of the BC Business Council &/or the Vancouver Board of Trade) is able to properly investigate and report on a non-partisan basis, and, just as importantly, maintains a strict separation between its reporting and editorial departments. This province's 'polarisisation' is, in much part, an artefact of its corporate-bespoken media, in which cheer-leading, distortion, bias, and manipulation supplant actual journalism. And it might be a little more difficult for those who just want to use the province as their company moneybox to hand the other 99% of us who love this province such faits accompli as the reeking sell-off of BC Rail, Terasen, medical records etc. etc.

Second, we must realise that Campbell is no fascist, nothing so dramatic, just an morally ignoble, ethically squalid center-right hack whose political prime directive is perform a reasonably effective job as cat's-paw for corporate interests in getting profitable control of BC's public infrastructure: fragmenting what used to belong to the people of BC and selling off the pieces to those interests. Freebear's characterisation as 'bridgehead' was dead on. In that respect, Gordon Campbell's job is more that of a corporate Quisling, which in actuality is little than equivalent to being a doorman at a hotel. In selling off our province, he reduces the dignity and cachet of his high political office as Premier to the level of a shiny uniform worn by a flunky whose sole job is to open the door to the rich, tip the hat to his betters, and to make sure to keep the riffraff--the people of BC---stay well away. It's a hard time for any BC patriot.

Yes, Marysue, it is to puke. I agree with loblollyboy, Campbell is no Hitler, nor even a Quisling, just a good little boy doing the bidding of corporate masters. They even let him on the yacht, once in a while, to make him feel as if he really belongs.

Anyone with half a brain can see this selloff of our natural heritage for what it is, unfortunately, even people with half a brain are in the extreme minority in BC. What to do? We tiny few know what's going on, what can be done about it? If anything?

golly gee whizzzz ! all you wannabee highly educated folks and you're big words just make me feel funny all over... why not get back to reality and act like you are speaking to your parents or, better yet, your wife. Trying to impress can sometimes make you look quite ignorant !

So can you're [sic] spelling mistakes.

Fiat Lux

One might say that the scum always rises to the top!

it's now going to be up to the bc utilities commission to flex their muscles, if they have any. lower the return on equity!

By the way that last comment does'nt mean that everyone who reaches the social-economic pinnacle is scum. Merely that people who possess the most immoral, even pyscho/socio-pathic, personalities seem to claw their way to the top. They, like gordo et al and the u.s. republicans enlarge, are formidable opponents who will stop at nothing to consolidate their own power, wealth and status. Even if it means subjecting millions to poverty and misery. Morality simply does not enter into their calculations.

Jester.......after all they're backed up by the Courts and universities. When the Courts declare that the first duty of a corporation is to increase the value of the shares, and the universities teach that ultimate greed is "efficiency", anything goes and legal. These are the people the demonstrations should be directad against, not the little pimp politicians. Ed Deak, Big Lake.

Back to Wacky B the Avro Arrow? 58-65

same Terasan, BC Rail, almost Cocahala Hwy yeah my spelling!

Actually, I HAD thought that Quisling was applicable, although in honour of Canadian bilingualism, some may prefer the French "collabo".

His politics, his campaigning, his conduct, his values, his economics; all are taken from the playbook of the American neo-con Bushites.

Campbell was democratically elected for a 2nd time.
George W., the same story."Fool me once... fool me twice..." Or-
Are these 2 cases examples of lunatics electing lunatics?
If so, how is it that both BC and the USA are so sufficiently full of lunatics as to allow
such lunacy to transpire?
Contemplating this is making me crazy!

Has Gordo given up drinking and taken up huffing?

It's too bad that all the detrimental rhetoric can't be put aside so that we may get on with the real issue, which is the transfer of our largest utility company to American Kinder Morgan.

In answer to question What.
commentator: Billy pilgrim
posted: 13 Hours Ago
it's now going to be up to the bc utilities commission to flex their muscles, if they have any. lower the return on equity!

Billy , it's not up to the Utilities Commission, the takeover bid of Terasen Gas by American interests depends entirely on the Premier and Cabinet. (the same council who declared that the sale of Westcoast Energy to Duke Energy would not adversely affect the "public interest") - You decide

(53 (1) A public utility must not consolidate, amalgamate or merge with another person (a) unless the Lieutenant Governor in Council (i) has first received from the commission a report under this section including an opinion that the consolidation, amalgamation or merger would be beneficial in the public interest, and ii) has, by order, consented to the consolidation, amalgamation or merger, and ...)

Cosmo:

Corporation as psychopath......?

Obvious:

"Seams" just about fits seamlessly into Cosmos' contribution. It alludes to "everything coming apart at the seams".......

Your wide ranging rhetorical point of view seems pointless rickW, and I wish I knew how your comments could possibly help. - I gather you believe corporations are evil.

...and the difference between Gordon and Larry would be? How about nil when it comes to human nature and personal profit. That`s why public safeguards should but don`t work. Anyone here that was offered a $100k a year pension and a seat in the senate would jump at the chance and thumb their nose at the rest of us. Perhaps even Rafe if given the opportunity.

Bobb999,

Re: Your remarks on lunatics electing lunatics.
This brought to mind to mind the mullings of a talk show moderator a couple of nights ago.

He was expressing concerns about the mental stability of G.W. who is currently assailed from all sides - including elected Republicans. I believe he was telling us that there could be a madman at the helm - not very comforting in this nuclear age, particularly following a caller's suggestion that the U.S. "nuke" Iran.

gordo might have been elected but only because the green and ndp vote was split in such a way to allow this. Had those parties somehow united as a coalition they would have handily defeated the traitorous liberals and their sell-out agenda.
Infact I think gordo would have lost even in his own riding!
Can we lobby the utilities commission to prevent this madness?

If Gasworks is correct, approval is in Premier Campbell's hands, not the Commission's. Can Cabinet still be lobbied, or is it too late?

Surely a concerted campaign and significant public outcry would give Mr. Campbell pause. With BC Hydro, BC Rail, almost-Coquihalla, wild salmon/fish farms, etc already hanging around his neck, he must understand the political risks of facing re-election as the man who sold out BC's patrimony to enrich his business buddies.

Jesterjogger. Can we first ascertain whether or not this is "madness"? I think that critical question must be answered before we can move forward.

Perhaps we should all write the Premier and ask him to include the public in the discussions this time around ...

Name, Do you think your last sentence was necessary?

Exactly what I mean "DEEBY"...you are one class act !
I don't know how anyone could follow a line like that.

Name, do you realy think that El Gordo cares about re-election? His credentials are set to pull a Mulroney and take a cushy patronage job or two in the corporate world.

...you might try by resisting the urge to call into question the intelligence of everyone posting here while saying nothing whatsoever about the subject at hand.

I read this discussion with interest and didn't jump in with an OT post until you behaved like a jerk. Can you say the same?

Hugo Chavez the leader of Venezuela has managed to hold control over his country's resources despite attempts by the Americans and their Gordy style sycophants to topple his gov't.

They actually had him in jail one time and the palace guard and the people overthrew the rebellion. The failed coup leaders fled to the States.

Chavez is now involved in an oil for doctors exchange program with Cuba and has served America notice that if they try to depose him one more time, he'll shut off their oil.

He has a radio show every Sunday night called something like talk with Hugo where people call him up with their problems. No ten grand a plate dinners, no handlers.

How is it that these third worlders have more control over their resourses and better leaders than we do?

It begs the question that has not been asked:

JUST WHO IS GOING TO BAT FOR THE CONSUMER?

Answers? Anyone?

Surely, not everyone has just rolled over - or been bought off.

Mooney,

A great post!

What a contrast! A leader in touch with the people and who listens and acts. Anathema to the crass Establishment.

VIVA CHAVEZ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FCUK BUSH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm going to phone the c.i.a and ask how to donate money to Cuba and Venezuela.
Long live the Revolution!!!

gasworks:

They are not evil; they are amoral.

The only raison d'être for a corporation is to limit liability, which is an "evil" act in itself, as it leads to complete unaccountability. The limited liability aspect of corporations should not be written into law - it should be negotiated between the corporation and their client(s).

As long as governments favour corporations over the citizen who elect governments, the corporations are indeed "evil".

Gasworks, you know it's nice to think that GC would really care enough to listen to us and include the public in the discussions but when push comes to shove he has consitently proven that the public in general is not who he cares about. The man is a pathelogical liar and is a master at illusion, delusion. Or maybe it his "handlers" pulling the strings that are the masters.
If there is a way to examine or stop the sale of Teresan it won't come through him. Of course there are those out there that might believe that this is a "good" thing for B.C. like the "lease" of BCRail of 990 years for a little over a million dollars a year for an asset that routinely kicked in millions yearly. But hey, we still "own" it. Or how about the privatization of BCFerries that took a publicly funded asset/necessity out of our control and scrutiny? If this "company" goes seriously into the red do you think that the B.C. gov't is not on the hook to bail it out?Do you think that the province would/will not suffer from these short sighted greed infused decisions?
So if there is a way to decifer this or reverse it it would have to come through the Cabinet or the Lt.General and while I'm no expert on the powers of each in the provincial gov't I'm not going to hold my breath either way.

Corporations are not evil per se, rather they have no morals. All is done is to make money for the share holders - no holds barred. Look at the multi-nationals who built the ovens for the death camps during WW2, still in business.

This example may adds more to this madness: During WW 2, IT&T build German submarines were firing IT&T built torpedos at IT&T built ships, carring IT&T built ammunition to be fired or dropped by IT&T built canons or bombers on IT&T factories in Germany.

Until multi-nationals are brought to heel, the public and enviroment will suffer as they don't give a damn. Our whole ecconomy is based on some poor bastard earning 10 cents an hour in China, so the WAL Mart can sell it cheap here. It's not sustainable. In fact our present free enterprize system is not sustainable.

The results, who knows, but the high oil prices are just a hint of things to come.

Rafe is right on this one, but of course CORUS Radio and the Asper Press are beholden to the multi's, and print the news the suits their advertisers.

We will pay a price, a big price in the near future for this madness.

Mooney says How is it that these third worlders have more control over their resourses and better leaders than we do?
you answered your own question my friend, the difference being that,we are the ones who have the third world leaders.

One bellweather to watch for here will be the budget of the propaganda arm of Mr. Neufeld's ministry - the 'Oil and Gas Team'.

Clearly, it will be their job to ensure that Mr. Mair's concerns do rise to become top of mind issue's for the public at large.

sheesh.

should have been:

...do 'not' rise to become top of mind issues....

commentor: BLONDE PITBULL posted: 13 Hours Ago -
Gasworks, you know it's nice to think that GC would really care enough to listen to us and include the public in the discussions but when push comes to shove he has consistently proven that the public in general is not who he cares about. The man is a pathological liar and is a master at illusion, delusion. Or maybe it his "handlers" pulling the strings that are the masters.
So if there is a way to decipher this or reverse it it would have to come through the Cabinet or the Lt.General and while I'm no expert on the powers of each in the provincial gov't I'm not going to hold my breath either way.

Might I ask - When was the last time you had a meaningful discussion with someone who was calling you a Blonde Airhead? Obviously, until Tyee bloggers are able to push the rhetoric aside and put forth questions regarding fact, the answers won't come through them.

Nor will they come through Rafe, who admits he is just a poor lawyer, politician and environmentalist who does a bit of broadcasting and writing and knows nothing about oil and natural gas except what it costs him, but who knows about bullshit,

I think this Premier, (like many others before him), may have conjured up a distorted meaning of the word "mandate" which has gone well beyond the usual definition. - That's the reality facing British Columbian's looking for answers today...

pc, the Honorable Gordon Campbell

gasworks:

As the US regime is comprised of Nazis, there is a very good chance that, should GC in fact be a "foreign" agent, he would be a Nazi. However, this is diversion. It is David Hahn, of BCFS Inc., who is the fifth columnist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_column

Sadly, you don't get the point RickW. While I realize there are alternate realities out there, yours is not one I would choose.

Actually, Gasworks, I've been called worse than an "airhead" on this site and out in the real world a place GC rarely seems to visit. But it seldom stops me and most people, if not all quickly, re-evaluate their opinions. Funnily enough its usually men who make that mistake. On this site you can go back in the archives and look at my posts and other's to me to confirm this.
What I find interesting about your selective quoting of my previous post is that you skip the questions/comments about the his history of doing "good" for the people of this province, and tell me that I need to get past rhetoric and ask questions based on "fact". Please tell me what was unfactual about my post?

The man is a pathelogical liar and is a master at illusion, delusion. Or maybe it his "handlers" pulling the strings that are the masters.

But, Gasworks, I do agree with you that GC has a very distorted definition of a mandate and what the average person wants for the present and future of this province.
As for the "Honorable" Gordon Campbell the title "honorable" might go with the office but I haven't seen too much of it from him.
By the way when did you move here from the States?

So you never read/heard the pre 2001 election statements of his intentions and then heard and saw what he did?

And you never noticed that he was re-elected.

Oh, I noticed but again that was more through deception and manipulation than his truthfulness or caring of the average B.C.er...

That's one rhetorical theory for sure.

Gaswork

The fact that Gordon was re-elected had more to do with a split in the left, a new and untried leader of a party that is rebuilding and a upswing in the Asian economy. What is enlightening is how poorly they did with everything in their favour, including access to the government coffers for advertizing, friendly press and the outpouring of millions of dollars in new spending by the ministries.
I would venture to say that the Liberals won despite Gordon Campbell. I am sure the lesson is not being lost on the Liberal party and they are searching for a new leader as they know he is a liability in the long run.

With that I agree. I think they should have found a new leader long ago, and you are on time about the poor handling of our assets.

One thing that has gone unmentioned, at least as far as natural gas prices go, is the fact that the largest consumer of natural gas in the province, is the Province. So regardless of the enormous royalty "windfall" profits allowing for debt reduction, the end consumer which is you, me, and every B.C. taxpayer will take a double-hit in the pocketbook.

I wonder how Carole Taylor will be able to justify that as somehow being good for business, or good resource management for that matter.

I return to my earlier question: Is it too late for anyone to do anything to stop this?

...and Yes, Gasworks, my last sentence in the previous post was necessary. I was highlighting the PR problem that public perceptions on this issue would raise for Mr. Campbell -- or for the BC Liberals, if Campbell has other plans -- especially if a serious campaign were to be mounted around the pattern set by their handling of Terasen, BC Rail, BC Hydro, etc.

Would they really risk inflaming the population and being replaced by a Chavez type by encouraging the perception that they are looting the people's patrimony? They were only re-elected because enough voters felt that the dollar rewards made up for their other shortcomings. That would change very quickly if people felt they were ultimately being ripped off.)

(...and yes, I must agree with Blonde Pitbull that the label "pathological liar" is accurate, given, among other things, his bizarre refusal to admit that the sale of BC Rail was actually a sale. Shades of Bush on WMD and Clinton on Lewinski, so he's in good company, I guess.)

Funny how all you lefties rarely mention the sale of our lumber industry to US interests that happened under the NDP... Jimmy Pattison notwithstanding, most of the rest of the industry headed south under the mandate of Mike Harcourt and Glen Clark. Can you spell W-e-y-e-r-h-a-u-s-e-r? So how come Premier Campbell is so evil for simply lifting an investment restriction that no other company in BC had to work under?

Gasworks, if that's how you want to see this. You've obivously spent more time with the man than I have 'cause whether Liberal supporter or not I haven't meet too many people who don't agree about his lying. Most righties ususally just justify it "with he's a politician", so let's get beyond my labelling GC a "pathological liar" 'cause I'm not likely to change my mind and somehow I don't think you are either.
So tell me is there anything else that you can tell us about Name's question is it too late for anyone to do anything to stop this?

Martin, wouldn't the lumber industry be a prefect example of why we shouldn't sell Teresan?

Harcourt didn't sell public assets to Weyerhauser. Further, stricter forestry practices were introduced in the nineties to protect the environment, and the forestry companies--US or Canadian--were required to process their lumber locally to benefit BC communities.

Mr. Campbell on the other hand, authorized the export of raw logs and re-wrote the forestry code to allow companies to police themselves as far as the environment goes.

Sorry Martin, I don't think forestry is a good example if you're trying to make excuses for Mr. Campbell's record (notwithstanding his impressive rant against U.S. policy in the wake of the softwood ruling last week.)

Why is Gordon Campbell so evil for simply lifting an investment restriction that no other company in BC had to work under?
Maybe because an American Company just got control of another chunk of BC Resources?
Duh?

the weyerhauser deal was not done in secrecy behind closed doors and it was not done at the expense of British Columbians, unlike the deals gordo has been making behind closed doors with the blessing of corporate u.s.a., this guy is worse then the n.d.p. ever were.

Any rant gordo makes against the u.s. is pure theatrics it is my opinion the guy is a snake oil salesman and about as classy.

the business don't seem to have much concern about sovereignty only the bottom line money and greed, they worship money and care not about anything as trivial as the Americans owning us, read Mel Hurtigs Vanishing Country. You will learn how well the u.s. has been doing in their quest to own us, since free trade.

Gasworks:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000A0MFJ/103-7740519-6881452?v=glance

Oh but I do, G! "Sadly" this thing we call democracy is simply a "kinder, gentler" form of Fascism, complete with all it's foibles.

The problem with the arguments of Name and Blonde is that they both seem to have the wrong set of facts. Blonde compares similar deals in the lumber business and asks "why we shouldn't sell Terasen". Name appears to believe "public assets" are being sold. and they both ask "Is it too late for anyone to do anything to stop this?". Rafe adds to rickW's substantial political confusion by wondering if Kinder Morgan will leave us high and dry when the pickings get slim.

Terasen INC. is a international corporation trading its shares on the stock exchange which wholly owns Terasen Gas utility a private BC company, as well as other choice facilities in Alberta and BC. Kinder Morgan, the US mega corporation wishes to takeover the parent Terasen Gas INC. by purchasing all of it's publicly traded shares.

We don't own the utility, we regulate it (supposedly), and if we run out of oil and gas we won't need pipelines. What's important is that since 2001, after the formal approval of the transfer of Westcoast Energy by the Executive Council to American interests, natural gas consumers in the lower mainland have paid much more than what the exact same BC produced gas traded for at the Sumas Washington hub, 180 feet south of the border. - to the tune of about $750 million dollars that didn't end up "sticking to the pockets" of British Columbian's where it belongs. ( see Neufeld, on the benefits of oil and gas exploration.

That's a fact.

PC The Honorable Gordon Campbell

Mair makes two assumptions regarding Alberta Oil Sands...

The Alberta Oil Sands are making money and that was before the price of a barrel of oil increased from $20US to over $60US.

The other assumption that Mair makes regarding a pipeline to Vancouver to ship oil to Asia. It would be preferential, I think, to ship the oil through Prince Rupert. There is already talks to do just that.

Back in 1998, a VP of Unocal, testified to one of the many US Senate committees regarding the Afghanistan pipeline project (now resurrected after the ouster of the Taliban). In that testimony, the VP indicated that oil consumption in Europe and N.America would be in the range of 2% over the next twenty years. In Asia, that figure for the same twenty years was over 20%.

Energy is no longer being used as a tool for nation building in its country of origin. Since the destruction of the publicly owned BC Gas and recent sale to Kinder Morgan, the nations who will benefit the most from our extracted oil and gas will not be from this soil.

Bon Voyage!

I think Rafe was referring to the huge potential for ecological disaster and I wonder how shipping from Prince Rupert would help alleviate that particular problem.

BC Gas is alive and well, and the transfer to Kinder Morgan has not yet been approved. I suppose if you harbor ill feelings toward Americans out of general principle, you might not think it's a good idea.

Ocean 44
That pipeline you are talking about I think is gas and is being proposed for shipping to India, who is expecting a major increase in use over the next decade. Afghanistan is promoting it, as it will ensure a major source of revenue paid directly to the central government, something they sorely lack at the moment. It will require the agreement between a whole bunch of people that don’t particularly like each other.

If you want to see a interesting pipeline project the discussions between Bolivia, Peru and Chile are enlightening.

Okay, Gasworks, my wording was incorrect, I'll give you that, but typing is not my favorite "fun thing" to do so I always look to simplify what I type but I actually do believe it was the Campbell gov't who allowed the "transfer" of WestCoast Energy, who later removed the the restrictions of maximum 20% foreign ownership and the keeping of the head offices in B.C.. I am correct yes? I do still want you to say if you, who in your postings gives the impression you consider you of "expert" knowledge level if this could be stopped? As for your comments about the cost of gas here as compared to across the border I'd believe it. I am an average wage earner and I can feel the loss in my wallet.

As for comparing deals between gas and lumber that acually wasn't my intention I was moreso thinking of the long and drawn out fight over tariffs and the way the resources (raw logs)are okay but anything else is "screwing" the US business over. I don't actually believe the US consumer benefits from the actions of the gov'ts tariffs 'cause they still are buying it from us. Its not a far jump, in my eyes, to see some kindof similar action happening over gas some time down the road. And please don't call me a Yankee hater 'cause I'm not I love my home country as much as my adopted country which is why I know the spelling you use of honorable is American and not Canadain.

gasworks:

I can see clearly. But I do have doubts about yerself. Big picture stuff. Not minutia. The latter is only another name for quagmire.

Sorry for my spelling mistakes and other typos....

I agree with Ocean 44's post.

Firstly, two years ago Suncor was making the brag that they could produce for $11 a bbl. They predicted that within a year they'd have it down to $9.

Second, at present rate of production, the Alberta Tar Sands could produce for a thousand years, the reserves are so vast.

Third, oil sent via pipeline to Prince Rupert for shipment to China, the intended buyer, is a day closer than Vancouver, a considerable saving.

Nor does it matter that much to the US where the oil goes, since oil contracts are swapped among buyers, and if the US controls the supply lines - in BC as in Afghanistan - they have the whiphand anyway.

Lastly, back in the late Seventies - early Eighties, the debate whether Capital owed any allegiance to its country of origin was held and the consensus (restricted to the Hats allowed to deliberate upon such things, of course) was that Capital owes nothing to its country of origin, its sole duty being to profit the investor.

Thus we see the "Rape 'n Run" resource ethics of Capital and its total disregard for either economic or environmental sustainability.

Good Morning Blonde: "Damned American" spell checker "The honourable Gordon Campbell" and RickW - I never meant to offend you, but I'll have to ignore your last post, other than comment that it's the little things that can make a difference - in my view.

Hi Alberta Mary!! - You wrote: "Hey John -you’re way over my head but I did have one observation - we also pay a delivery charge to Direct Energy as well as the consumption charge to Atco"

Actually Mare' it's the other way round, Albertans' pay a commodity consumption cost of gas charge to third party marketer Direct Energy, who bought out Atco's household gas and electricity business in mid-2004, and a completely separate delivery charge to Atco Gas who bring it to your house. (Take another close look at the graph and note the solid blue and red bars include both charges).

Currently in the lower mainland we pay more than double in residential delivery charges per gig, or $2.82, as opposed to $1.14 in Alberta South. The delivery charges are supposedly based on "equity" return but so far I have been completely unsuccessful in getting a reasonable explanation from our own utilities commission as to how it could cost more than two and a half times as much to deliver a gigajoule of natural gas to lower mainland residential customers than it costs in Calgary south, which essentially has the same demographics. - A gig of natural gas will run your average 100,000 BTU furnace for about 10 heating hours.

The cost of gas in both jurisdictions is tied directly to the "market price" and by law is supposed to be supplied at cost. However, since Direct Energy took over in Alberta, it appears that commodity charges in your neck of the woods have slowly risen from slightly below the AECO commodity exchange market price to about 5% over the exchange which has climbed about 43% overall since July of last year. Watch out for your pocket book in September, because gas prices which are set monthly in Alberta, are poised to rise sharply just in time for winter. This will happen despite the fact that there is no real shortage of available gas. (In our case, (at least since mid-2001), Terasen has consistently billed us more than 20% over and above what Americans pay for B.C. produced gas that is piped right past our own front door to the Sumas Washington trading hub 180 feet south of the border, and has already bumped up the gas cost recovery tariff's sharply as of July 1, 2005 ).

(Direct Energy has recently been approved as a third party gas marketer in BC, which leads me to believe that understanding natural gas prices is "way over the head(s)" of our Utilities Commission as well as the Alberta EUB, so you shouldn't feel bad.)

Hope this helps ...

(xxxx) JMB

Note: "Direct Energy was caught forging customer signatures on utility contracts in Ontario last year, the timing couldn't have been worse. The company was in the midst of regulatory hearings in Alberta, trying to make a good impression with the province's Energy and Utilities Board (EUB). Direct Energy needed the board to approve its purchase of ATCO Ltd.'s household natural gas and electricity business, which would pave the way for the company's Alberta expansion."

Almost forgot,

PC the honourable Gordon Campbell

Gasworks, no comments on stopping the sale? oh, well I'll take that lack of commenting as possible... Two questions for you who is "Alberta Mary"? And just what do you mean by your ending "PC the honourable Gordon Campbell" specifically "PC"?
Wish I had spell checker to blame when I was in school here I was always losing marks in school for the same mistake....

I believe that one of the reasons that we are being ripped off by artificially high natural gas prices is that there was a fear that it would become too popular as vehicle fuel.

I think it was about 20 years ago. Anyhow, the Socreds were in power in B.C. at the time.
Every quarter they did a very costly "news" mail-out to every residence. I recall one in particular because I was active in alternative vehicle propulsion and a member of VEVA Vancouver Electric Vehicle Association. This paper referred to a 400hp diesel-engined vehicle that had been converted to run on natural gas at a fuel-cst saving of 40 per cent.

I believe this was another example of largely, taxpayer-funded research and developement to primarily garner Brownie points. To have had such a switch in vehicle fuels would have trodden on the toes of some extremely powerful players - players to whom most politicians are submissive.

What more effective way to scuttle this technology than to price it out of reach?

To the point of tedium, oil, auto and government are all in it together - and why would the government not be allied, given the current windfall fuel taxes?

gasworks:
Minutia
= introspection
= tendency to anal retentiveness
= can't see the forest for the trees
= royal commissions

Otherwise I must agree that "the big picture" is made of, and is often greater than, the sum of it's parts...........

Gasworks, the first step for Terasen did involve the sale of a public asset, as Rafe pointed out. While I questioned the wisdom of that initial sale, at least the intermediate stage--i.e. the requirement that this major utility be controlled by British Columbians, who presumably have a stake in seeing it function effectively--was preferable to allowing this critical utility to be sold to Texans who don't give a hoot and are only interested in a cash cow to help them control access to Alberta's tar sands.

Forgive me for not being clear, but I was not asking if Terasen could become a state-owned utility once again, I was wondering if it was not too late to block the sale to Kinder & co, thus keeping majority control in the hands of local investors, who are more likely to be concerned about the integrity of the public utility aspect.

Do tell us more about the 2001 transfer of West Coast Energy, though. How do they fit in all this and how did the transfer to US interests affect our natural gas prices?

Blonde, specifically the PC preceding "the honorable Gordon Campbell" means personal copy, (that must have been excruciatingly painful for you to type. Should the h have been capitalized???). - Alberta Mary is a Gasworks insider, and I have been commenting on the proposed sale all along but I still don't have enough information to make an informed decision one way or the other.

RickW - I thought "minutia" meant trifling detail. Furthermore anyone can see that here in the Province of British Columbia you can't see the forest because of the red trees ...

Name - What you should know is that Terasen Inc. is a public corporation listed on the Toronto Exchange and therefore not currently in the "hands" of local investors who are likely to be concerned.

What I do know is that if you give an energy giant a huge siphoning hose and don't bother to pay proper attention to your gas gauge you will most likely end up on the short end. Regarding the 2001 transfer of Westcoast energy to Duke Energy; what you might not know is that the original sale was instigated by the former government and subsequently rubber-stamped OK! by the present administration. Presumably former NDP appointee and Utilities Commission Chair Peter Ostergaard, (as he was then), was becoming more liberal prior to the beginning of the "New Era", he's presently a deputy to Energy Minister Neufeld.

What I also know is that ever since the New Era began, Terasen customers have been overcharged nearly 3 quarters of a billion dollars more in natural gas cost recovery charges than the Americans paid for the exact same B.C. produced gas at Sumas Washington. I would therefore naturally insist that the excess charges be returned to our pocketbooks by Kinder Morgan prior to any final takeover approval (about 100 million or so more in the 2002 Calendar year alone), and that's a fact. Go figure!

PS, I think we may have a huge problem with the Premier who now appears to be running in silent mode ...

Regards,

PC, The Honorable Gordon Campbell.

Gassy, got a sense of humour today, do ya? I had my fingers and toes crossed...You must have had a good weekend...must be nice to only have time for visiting this site when you are at work...Why include a post commenting to her here does she have to go online here to read your opinions?

seems like a lot of the right wing ranters on here post during working hours.

Sorry Blonde, but don't take it so seriously - some people work weekends. What I have been saying is that Terasen Gas has been overcharging it's customers for years and nobody noticed because like Rafe Mair, most people haven't a clue about oil and natural gas except what it costs them. (contrary to your previous assumptions, I'm not American).

Gassy, I know all about working weekends, my place of employment is a 24hrs 365days a year operation. Graveyards is my favorite shift, no chiefs, very few indians...
Yes, I understand what you are trying to say about overcharging which is why I'm not comforted when some gov't mouthpiece says not to worry about this sale there's the Utilities Commission to watch over the publics welfare. And that was before chatting with you. Some thing about a politician saying not to worry that makes my blood run cold. And don't be too offended I mean ALL politicians not just your honourless buddy and friends.

Gasworks, thank you for the corrections but are you challenging my imprecisions or are you challenging the gist of Rafe's column, which is what I was attempting to discuss?

Rafe said:

Are you disputing that this is a valid concern in relation to the sale to Kinder Morgan?

This article almost brought tears to my eyes. Along with the anger that I felt. Every year we see BC being ripped to shreds and it seems that nothing we do is being heard or done.

I see a lot of people have made comments on this article along with others. Have any or all of you wrote a letter to your government to help the cause. They say that 1 letter to the government is worth a 1000 opions.

I think it should be mandatory if you write a comment you also need to write a letter to your government.

I know that this seems like a childlike idea, but instead of sitting around and complaining about getting the short end of the stick( which we are getting)we need to unite and consume the government with paperwork.

Some people do not know all that they can do and a lot of people do not understand the political jargon that goes along with this. It should be everyone's job to educate as many people as we can to help in the fight to keep BC ours.

Shylo226, I don't think in this case we need to bother as Gassy, seems to be sending personal copies to the head man himself. Not that I think it will help to change this sale. Which leads back to my orginal comment that it would be nice think that GC would care about our opinions but...

If the sale of most of BC's assests have not been a cry to the people to unite with a strong voice to the government stating that we will not tolerate or accept these sort of actions.

It should also be said that not just one person or a particular group should be writing to the government, everyone should be.

Not to just the head man himself. To all levels of government and every government official.

It seems that several options get announced when their is public pressure, wether it is through letter writing, public appeals, general strikes, ect.....

I do not think that it is enough for us to just sit back and take our lot in life.

where the hell is our opposition party on this? they should be making a big fuss about this.

Name: I'm simply challenging public misconception that ends up in the usual quagmire RickW speaks of which can easily be found in the gist of Rafe's column. For example; ..."BCUC has no power to force Kinder Morgan to make more pipeline capacity available". That is true, they do not, but it's because the pipelines in question transport oil and refined products and cross provincial and Canadian boundaries and therefore fall under the regulatory jurisdiction of the National Energy Board (NEB). All of the natural gas we consume here in the lower mainland is transported via the pipeline currently owned by American Duke Energy. (formerly Westcoast Transmission).

"When Terasen stood alone, with a mandated Canadian majority ownership, its main business was supplying the BC natural gas market." In this case it is rather obvious that because they are wholly owned by Terasen Inc., which publicly trades on the TSE, Terasen Gas Utility has not stood alone for a long time.

"Are you disputing that this is a valid concern in relation to the sale to Kinder Morgan?"

No name, I am not disputing the fact that there are valid concerns. "Can we stop the sale". If government continues to withhold crucial information, probably not. But if we can somehow draw the Premier's attention to the real facts of the "deal" perhaps it won't be necessary. (However addressing a letter to dear "A-hole" probably won't get us too far.)

My main concern is that somehow, our natural gas supplier Terasen Gas Utility, has been charging us about 20% more for the natural gas we consume here in B.C. than the Americans pay 180 feet south of the border. (In 2002 it was almost double). That affects the pocketbook of every British Columbian and our utilities commission watchdogs don't seem to have noticed, and for whatever reason, our current politicians in charge seem unwilling to understand how detrimental that discrepancy is to our overall economy.

It may all just end up being a case of incompetence on the part of a former Mayor elevated to a high position. (contrary to whatever conspiracy theory Blonde may wish to conjure up, I am not on anyone's payroll).

Regards

PC, The Honourable Gordon Campbell.

The Terasen Inc. family:
Terasen Gas
Delivers natural gas to customers in British Columbia.

Terasen Pipelines
Transports crude oil and refined petroleum products, as well as aviation turbine fuel.

Terasen Utility Services
Designs, builds and operates water, wastewater and energy systems

Terasen International
The international arm of Terasen: manages engineering projects, provides consulting services and more.

Terasen Waterworks
Distributes water, wastewater and irrigation products.

Other Interests
Other businesses and partnerships.

Gassy, when did I say you were on GC's payroll ? The only thing close was that you say your -PC the "honourable" Gordon Campbell- is personal copy which means to me that you are sending him copies of this. How does that lead to a conspiracy theory? So if you aren't sending all this why put this on your posts?
You seem to consider your self well informed, on this whole topic so maybe you'll answer this how does the BCUC officers (what ever the correct title be) get hired for this position?
Why is it that I'm some kind of wacko for calling GC "a pathological liar" or his handlers but you can say he may be incompetent, his gov't is withholding crucial information,(they/he) are unwilling to understand(or do something about) how BCer's are getting screwed over on what we pay comparitively with our southern and eastern neighbours? You've basically have outlined a blueprint for the title I've given him, combining with the lies and twisted truths that he's already wearing you aren't helping inprove his image.

Gassy, must be nice to be independantly wealthy so as not to be on someone elses payroll or maybe you are self employed in which case get back to work!! LOL

Blonde - I didn't think Pitbull's were so sensitive. Please don't intimate that Gordon Campbell is my "buddy", because nothing could be further from the truth. Other than attending an evening dinner with him and a bunch of his drunken supporters a couple of years ago, I have had absolutely nothing to do with the "head man". "Maybe" I'm self employed, and maybe I'm independently wealthy. Then again - "maybe" not!

One thing for sure, is that I am definitely not attempting to bolster his image. “These are exciting times for British Columbia,” said Campbell. “This truly is our golden decade of opportunity. There will be many challenges along the way. As Premier, it will be my privilege to listen, learn and lead British Columbia.” - She described evenings at home with "Gord" as a dizzying tour of all his dreams, ideas and ambition for B.C. She promised the audience they are always on his mind and that he is determined to give them and their families a better future with more opportunities.

I can't prove he lied and I'm reluctant to refer to anyone as a fascist, but I can reasonably demonstrate that he may be incompetent and his government is withholding crucial information. Hopefully he's listening. (BCUC officers are appointed by order in council.)

Gassy, I don't really care if you are his buddy or not, I just didn't think that the conspiracy theory shot was called for. I called him your buddy because you seem to try to defend him at times;the most distressing defence of his gov't was when you said that they only rubberstamped the previous gov'ts deal. Do I think he's the devil incarnate? I wouldn't want to give him that kind of credit, some kind of mid level ghoul, maybe, which brings to mind a poster I've seen that goes something like ...from the bottom of the food chain to the top -enjoy your lunch!
But I digress, so these officers are appointed by who? What kind of experience is generally found in the Council? Mostly business oriented? Most likely they aren't solely employed by the Council? You give me the impression that you think these people are more sleeping at the wheel than deliberately screwing up am I wrong in that conclusion?

Well I am not his "buddy" and I merely stated the facts about the rubber-stamp. The approval of the transfer of Westcoast and it's pipeline asset was initiated by the former government, (I believe it was Dan Miller, who was in charge who is currently in the employ of Government as some sort of Oil and Gas/mining consultant).

Council means the Executive Council of the Province of British Columbia. (Cabinet) - Are these people "asleep at the wheel"? - I don't know, but it sure seems that way.

But I also digress, you should have asked me about the "drunken" dinner date.

Okay I'll bite tell me about the drunken dinner date. But first tell me was this before his christmas drunk driving charge and "tearful" promise to never drink again or after... was he drunk as well or just his supporters? I'm afraid that you'll have to explain in detail because I haven't been to a political support party. I think I'd probably fit in to a HA support party better and, no, I've never been to one of those either.

You don't think that with all the broken promises the Campbell gov't did in the first term of office that this should/could not have been one?

Sorry but your last post made me change my mind.

aww you can't do that you got us all curious now you are not going to come through with the goodies, thats ok most of us have a pretty good idea what el gordo is all about.

Just let your imagination run wild, think of the sleaziest person you know and what they would be like with a snout full of booze and an ego the size of Mount Robson and well you get the picture!

Kinda sad isn't the guy had the opportunity to do the right thing and instead chose to take care of his rich corporate campaign donaters firs and foremost at the expense of the poor and working poor, seniors and the environment. Just my opinion of the worst excuse we have ever had for a premier!

Now, who's being sensitive? My cracks at him of being a half a** ghoul don't bother you? That I think he's going to become someone's proverbial lunch? but couldn't we add this to the list of broken promises and I hurt your feelings? C'mon, 'fess up now did/do you have something to do with the deal? Is that why you don't like my position against the deal?

Chalk it up to the overwhelming redundancy of your posts...

Oh, well, Gassy, least we know how you got your name....

Well if insults are of your primary concern, then I would add it was also because of your appalling lack of knowledge regarding politics and the administration of government - Particularly in regard to the qualifications of the Executive Council ( see above).

Gassy, Gastown was named for a former politician of Vancouver who loved to talk. I'm assuming he talked about what he knew most of the time. Thats why I call you Gassy.I didn't think you'd want to speak about the "drunken party" but you told me to ask. Campbells' personal life is just that personal, he's Nancy's headache not mine THANK GOD!
Earlier I was actually asking how the officers of BCUC were hired not the Executive Council. I think that my lack of love for typing and your own thought process made this misunderstanding. I never claimed to have spent my live studying or, for that fact, dealing with the gov't but I do think that Campbell and many of his cronies had spent enough time in gov't to have had the knowledge not to have made the long list of "mistakes" which makes them lies in my eyes. The whole group of them seem to have a problem with admitting to mistakes usually trying to shove the responsibility on some one else. My opinion is grow a backbone and grow up. Sorry if that irritates you but that's what I think. If you want to argue about the adminstration of government you'll have to give me awhile to bone up on it but better yet find some one else to do it with, because really I'm mostly interested from you is info on the procedures available to the public to examine and object to the sale of the Terasen pipelines in B.C.. Really the rest of the company's holdings outside of B.C. aren't as important to me. I beleive that as long as we (BC) owned and controlled the pipelines we(BC) had some kind of recourse,control, whatever word you like if we didn't like the prices, enviornmental care or what ever worries that came up. If this goes through we are just some second class customer to an indifferent soulless entity.
I saw your link to the BCUC site and I will be using it so thanks for the info and have a good day/weekend.
Licks and rubs -hugs and kisses in the people world, I've gotta go my dogs want their walk and my cats want their belly rubs so I gotta go....Cheers

Please include Canada where ever you read B.C., Thanks....

Gassy jack was a saloonkeeper - I rest my case.

Okay, a colourful forefather of Vancouver.He had some involvement in the early politics. Whatever. I'm not understanding your switch of conversation to nitpicking and baiting me unless I hit a nerve. But again, whatever. Thanks again for the info, Gassy, do take care.

Thank you for your comments, you have an active imagination.

Thank you, Gassy, it comes in handy in life unless you're a puppet or a drone.

Terasen, Texas, Treason, organized crime Bassi boys all hushed up, BC Rail, I'm sick of all this blatant corruption. Cordo=evil & all his Bum buddies how can they sleep?
Cadman the only politician that had balls.
A General strike would stop this great travisty of justice
my vent ty