I've not watched this particular L&O spin-off but I don't know that tarting up the law will motivate me to do so. L&O was at its best when Jerry Orbach was there to deadpan some witticism right before Chris Noth roughed up a perp. Ah, the good old days...

On a side note: while I agree that Marg Helgenberger needs to occasionally wear a blouse that fits her chest, I don't think that we're seeing nearly *enough* tight-fitting and revealing clothing among CSI's men. These are the sexiest scientists on television, and not one of them knows how to select a snug pair of pants? Come on!

mariedavis,one of those sexy male scientists wearing tight pants and then hunkering/crouching down would really show how tough they were as then they would have to dislodge their testes from their adams apple.

but then you are one of those women aren't you?
i like my men "BIG AND DUMB!".

and you are right, crotch shots built up with a pair of socks just ain't seen anymore.

sounds like the talking heads on the 11 o"clock news are safe from your lascivious thoughts though.

You don't seem to be objecting to the not-quite-fitting tops worn by the women, heraldkann! And while I appreciate the men on CSI (I actually find Grissom's big brain to be the sexiest), I *like* the fact that the characters on that show are intelligent, educated, professionals.

It's nice to see intelligence on television - that's been one of the most surprising recent entertainment trends. Yes, the folks on Grey's Anatomy are good looking (Dr. McDreamy in particular), but heck - the man's a *brain surgeon*. In fact, most of the top shows (with a few lamentable exceptions) feature intelligent people doing interesting things. It's been a breath of fresh air, after years of thirty-something friends lounging at a coffee shop.

What I find most heartening is the fact that American producers are willing to show us intelligence at all. Take a look at the portrayal of most smart people in television and movies in the last 50 years. They are the poindexters and socially inept; they are the ones most likely to be blown-up or eaten by aliens; they are the ones that the hero will roll his eyes at before going in with guns blazing. In short - intelligence is demonized and belittled.

The L&O and CSI shows (and Canada's own DaVinci, who was an early forensic pioneer), on the other hand, start off with the basic assumption that cops and lawyers and scientists are doing good for society, are smart, and are helping real people solve real problems. Sure, they might show too much cleavage (it's television, it's Hollywood, it's a reality), but they aren't vacant above the shoulders.

And it's good to know that when producers try to veer away from that premise and "tart up" too much, we lose interest in them.

i guess i watch the discovery channel too much.

i don't think an actor striking a pose of thoughtfullness and pensive consideration while a soundtrack of pop schlok runs in the backgound is intelligent television.

and dianna rigg enlightening me on the upcoming mystery or perhaps the efforts of a writer like vonnegut caught on film in my DVD player are more likely to entertain me than,some vacuous actress with cleavage.

like i said,that's why they call it the BOOB TUBE...

The Discovery Channel and its ilk will always have an important role to fill. In fact, the proliferation of cable television channels, while filling the airways with entirely too many cooking and home reno shows, has given viewers looking for challenging television an unprecedented gift. A decade ago, the mere thought that we could watch marathon sessions of How It's Made or Frontiers in Engineering would have been laughable. Nobody outside of PBS was programming for people looking for challenging television.

That said, I think most of the shows on those channels qualifies as primarily educational, rather than entertaining. And though I watch and enjoy educational television, I also like to be entertained. Sometimes, that's in the form of "high art" and sometimes I'm looking for escapism. I don't, however, want to punish myself by watching the painful antics of pretty pre-pubescents on the O.C. and its brethren.

Okay, CSI and L&O are not the most intelligent programming out there, but they *are* smarter than what we're too often presented with in mainstream television. I can watch the pretty scientists and lawyers solve problems, use multi-syllabic words, and enjoy the fact that the smart guys (and girls) are the heros, instead of the sidekicks.

Then, to remind myself of how the other half (four-fifths?) lives, I tune in to Survivor and watch the pretty chimps struggle to put together a puzzle and worship at the shrine of the muscle-bound. Ah...choices. It's all good.

choices! now that's what we want.

edutainment,entercation,whatever,we learn,we communicate through sight,sound,and of course the other senses.so sitting in front of the BOOB TUBE turns us either smart or dumb,our choice.

we canadians have had better quality programming than the yanks and the brits better than us,dependant on the program itself.

da vinci wasn't the first canadian coroner show to be popular,look back in history and you will find who the american show Quincy was styled after after and he wasn't a sexy guy,just intelligent.i think the actor's name was john davis ?

and the fact that SURVIVOR has lasted more than a full season shows how many people have absolutely no purpose in life and are true nihlists...turn on and tune out...wow!

Wojack! Wojeck! With John Vernon - spelling may be weak but my memory is clear!
Have you seen survivorman, or whatever it's called? The show where the fella goes out by himself - with his own cameras, sound equipment and not much else, and actually 'survives' in the wilderness?

He went to hollywood and ended up playing the principal, or the loser police chief or the heavy in a lot of B movies. Died about a year ago, I think - you're right about his appearance - the show was modelled on Mortie Shulman in TO - I'll bet you remember him too, Harald.

yes ,john vernon and the toronto coroner shulman as modelled on those early screens.i think they were still black and white if i remember correctly.and yes vernon turned into a good character actor in the movies taking anything that he could get.if i remember ,he was also a friend of lorne greene as well during the great influx of canadians at that time.
you could fill the page with the names that used to populate the credit rolls of canadian television.they were considered high quality because of our programming.

wayne and shuster are still my all time favorite intellectual funnymen.taking shakespeare to the ed sullivan show from their CBC specials always garned a giggle,even from the dullest in the crowd.

no wonder,they rehash the old stuff on television with prettier faces.

Survivorman doth rock. I plan to give all future survival-in-the-face-of-overwhelming-adversity credit completely to him. The folks on Survivor who lament their living conditions need to tune in to Survivorman and quit their bellyaching.

I agree with haraldkann re: the quality continuum. Canadian shows tend to encourage you to use your brain - whether overtly, by presenting content at a higher intellectual level, or covertly, by referencing political or historical events or even through sly and subtle language. I applaud the fact that we have resisted dumbing down our shows to the lowest common denominator.

That said, how do you explain Canada's Worst Driver??

marie, some things just aren't explainable, and, when you see several contenders for the title every time you pull your bike into traffic, well....I rest my case. Why encourage them, is my conclusion!
There is some good stuff from the States though, if you're lucky enough to get HBO or subscribe to digital cable - Sopranos is excellent, but not the bastardized version you get 12 months later on commercial TV. Not for the kiddies, but makes L&O and The CSI clones look pretty anaemic. Certainly pitched a tight inside curve on Sunday!
And Harald, ditto on W&S - funny though, my kids are completely unmoved!

my kids turn up their noses as well when i yank out the w&s tapes or dvd,but then again they are a lot smarter at their age than i was,sophisticated little parasites they are.

thank god for HBO and other movie channels that you can get more reality on.that survivorman i saw a couple of times and it just reminded me how lucky i was to grow up in the bush in canada.people starve with food at their feet,it amazes me,look down stupid ,see those greens they are edible.seen another animal eat it?then it's probably safe!snares,traps,those losers on tv that they use for survivor and like shows,are the most braindead, egocentric,but don't that sell.survivorman is cool but i been there done that,as a kid.it's just new fare for that vast wasteland,for those not accustomed to hardship.

i like stuff that entertains,comedy is my first love,then pure entertainment(the WOW factor)like cirque du soliel,sopranos,the earlier law &order,then anything to do with science,after i am really bored comes the politics...that really wakes me up,i love john stewart,al franken,etc.

i think ,that ,in my opinion would be ,all ,on my favourite channel,channel me,and i feel i might have to have some gratuitous t&a,so maybe connie chung doing the late news topless.course i don't know if hubby gary trudeau would go for that...

oh well!you can't have everything

Haraldkann ... thanks for bringing back Wayne & Shuster ... they are so good! Remember the baseball game announced in Shakespearean terms?

Remember Johnny Wayne going into a Roman bar and ordering a Martinus?

Bartender: don't you mean Martini?

Shuster (sneering): if I want two I'll order two!

Great guys.

I thought connie chung was married to maury povich, see what you miss when you take an afternoon nap. Daily show and Colbert repor(t) are must see's too - actually quite enjoyed the tv movie they had on CBC about the life of Tommy Douglas Sunday and Monday. There is clearly a major shakeup coming at the CBC, in my opinion. Rabinovich has been a disaster all he does is spout platitudes - time will tell, I don't think Bev Oda will do the network any favours though.

Cirque du Soleil: Started by Guy Laliberté. He now has a net worth exceeding $ 1 billion - pretty fair for a guy who started out as a street performer in Quebec.

Too bad American and Canadian network types have forgotten how to mix humor and drama in the way that those great Brit cop shows, New Tricks and Touch of Frost do. And how about that greatest of all American cops shows, Barney Miller? It all comes down to the writing.

About the only thing that L&A is good at anymor is playing that bullfrog-bass-of-doom note just before a bummer ending.

tommy douglas ?was'nt he on friday nights ?

oh ! i'm sorry hunter was the name and yes maury povich is that sweeties hubby.i have so much info up their kicking around trying to get out so the new stuff can get aquainted with the grey matter.

as i said before the brits do have a tendency to do some things right,TOUCH OF FROST has one of my favourite actors,the series mentality that the brits have really keep you coming back as well,they have a knack for continuity.

their comedies are nothing to ignore either when you have icons galore to learn from.

every hit brit comedy has been tried one way or another over on this side of the pond.

then again the attention span and the 500 channel universe are at fault to most of us.creating a good show nowadays cost BIG BUCKS so they NEED an audience.

and from my perusing the web today,this here blogging is taking the audience as well.seems old rupert murdoch wants to buy anything the public spends time around,so he can ADVERTISE BIGTIME.

anyways gonna slip U2 into the DVD player and watch a little entertainment and get ahold of my cousin in Amsterdam...NOW THATS ENTERTAIMENT.

yes bcmary,i'd like a martinus as well

my all time fave was the romeo and juliet ,i remember watching that and like a fool i was eating popcorn...needless to say i almost choked to death laughing ...we were never allowed popcorn again during W&S

there are few shows that do that for me nowadays and it looks like i'm not alone.

The second half of a radio biography of Douglas is on CBC Radio 1 - Ideas - at 9 tonight.

The only American shows I can stomach these days are:

1. The Daily Show with Jon Stewart
2. The Colbert Report
3. The Simpsons (still funny after 18 years)
4. Family Guy
5. American Dad

I don't have cable, so I appreciate that I even get these shows. They are all funny as hell, although sometimes the hit-you-over-your-head sarcasm may offend some people.

Most other American TV dramas are so stale, bland and utterly boring with good-looking talentless actors that I can't even tell the difference between one doctor/law show and another while channel 'surfing' through all of my 5 channels.

But pleeeeeaaassseeee...someone put Air Farce out of it's misery.
And maybe replace it with a west coast comedy show. I can't think of any west coast (or western-based comedy show at all in my lifetime.)

Crass,
I think there was a show - very shortlived, very bad as I remember, called Dr Bundolo's Pandemonium Medicine Show that was done on the West Coast. It morphed out of a radio thing on the CBC; as a matter of fact I think there was another one with Linda Cullen and Bob Robertson, called "Double Exposure" that was also pretty bad. You're absolutely right about air farce although I must say some of their recent stuff 'bout Harper has almost forced a smile on my lips.

I read an interesting debate on the reality of this show at INTERNET MOVIE DATABASE, located here:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0494186/board/nest/37606370

But you have to be a member of IMDB to read it (membership is free). For those who don't want to bother signing up, here is the opening comment that was made - he makes others as various people respond to his post, and I will not repost those here...

The leading questions scene would have been good if it had been that girl's first time in a courtroom. If she had been watching trials for a year then she would have known what a leading question was and how to properly question a witness on direct. She also should have objected to the drug dealer's narrative. A judge also doesn’t call out a lawyer without an objection. If he could, it wouldn’t be an adversarial process.

The lost evidence scene was stupid. Any law student who has taken evidence knows about chain of custody, and no prosecutor would have been dumb enough to do that, especially if she had spent the past year in courtrooms. A real judge would have reported her and dismissed the case.

The black guy saying that he couldn't win the domestic case was also stupid. They have medical records and pictures from the last beating. They don't need a complaining witness, and unless she'd be willing to commit perjury, they could call her to the stand regardless if she wants to testify.

Who the hell cares what the victim’s parents think? Prosecutors don’t work for them, and don’t decide how to handle a case to appease them. They work for us, and it’s their job to put bad guys away, even if it’s only for five years. If the parents want payback, sue the guy for loss of consortium.

And if the murder is related to drug trafficking, why the hell isn’t the case in federal court? They would have the Marshals for protection and the promise of federal witness protection.

I don't buy the doe eyed new guy. He's been practicing for a year and he had criminal law and criminal procedure in law school. He would have had more confidence in his legal abilities, even if he's scared of courtrooms and clients.

I also don't buy that the red-haired girl would have been in that office for more than a year without ever arguing a case. It's obvious she's never examined a witness, so she had never argued a motion or done an evidentiary hearing either. There's no way that she would be a prosecutor for longer than a few months before appearing in court, even if its on a low level misdemeanor. Prosecutors and public defenders don't have the manpower to keep lawyers out of court for their first two years.

Anyway, I know it's TV and meant to entertain, but I was hoping for something more real. I have friends who are doctors and they’ve told me that Scrubs is very accurate to a new doctor’s life, and I wanted something similar for new lawyers. Sadly, it’s just as inaccurate to every other legal show on TV.

I noticed some of the things the IMDB user mentions. But this also leads to the age old question of REALITY vs. DRAMA, and taking into account the public's level of understanding - are they dumbing things down with this show for the sake of drama and higher ratings?

Wolf has proved he can produce something that's smart with the L&O franchise and with his previous L&O spinoff, DEADLINE (which only lasted a year or two). Ultimately it leads to the question - can't he produce a show that's both smart and sexy?

i watched that new offering and Wolf must be laughing all the way to the bank.

what a piece of SHITE!

i bet the only people watching this are eating their macdonalds happy meals and drinking plonk out of the box.