- Ms Kaye is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Mary Carlisle is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Prem Gill is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Nancy Flight is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Justin Everett is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- John Westover is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Nora Etches is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Edward Henderson is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Bharadwaj Chandramouli is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Dean Chatterson is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Marius Scurtescu is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Robert Parkes is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- James Murton is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Susan Doyle is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Vincent Strgar is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Helen Spiegelman is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Subir Guin is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Kimball Finigan is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- Joanne Manley is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
- David Leach is a Tyee Builder. You can be, too.
2010? I've Changed My Mind
Why I went from Olympics booster to boo bird.
Thrill of Biathlon? Think I'll miss it.
Okay, Chris Shaw of the University of British Columbia, outspoken critic of the Winter Olympics from the outset, was probably right about the 2010 Olympics. We should have, albeit gracefully, refused the honour.
These games run from Feb. 12 to Feb. 28, 2010, 17 days in all including opening and closing ceremonies. Chris and others opposed these games for many reasons, not least of which dealt with the Sea-to-Sky highway and real estate development.
I, on the other hand, swept up in the massive municipal masturbation, didn't listen to Chris and now see his nightmares coming true.
Being a resident of Lions Bay on the Sea-to-Sky, I should have listened to the boo birds. But, here's what the Highways Department said about the project:
"As part of Highway 99, the Sea-to-Sky Highway winds its way through the spectacular Coast Mountains, linking communities from West Vancouver to Whistler. British Columbia's Ministry of Transportation has initiated the $600 million Sea-to-Sky Highway Improvement Project to increase this road's safety, reliability and capacity. In addition to meeting the area's future traffic needs, the upgrades will also enhance economic development opportunities in communities along the highway and in the province as a whole.
"During construction, project staff is working hard to ensure the improvements are carried out safely, efficiently and with minimal disruption to the public. These efforts to keep traffic running smoothly will continue until the project is completed in 2009, in time for the 2010 Olympics."
It's difficult to believe that this amount of horse buns could be crammed into two paragraphs. There can surely be no one except the chauffer-driven minister, Kevin Falcon, who could read that crap and keep their dinners down.
Endangered by an upgrade
As one who totalled a car and damned near killed himself and his wife, I can attest that especially after dark, this highway is a death trap. In my opinion, those working on the road have not implemented enough procedures to insure safety. In Lions Bay, we hear sirens from our ambulance and police several times a day. The road markings, if they exist at all, are confusing in the extreme. At night you have to pray that both you and oncoming cars are on their proper side of the road. Signs are misleading, potholes abound, and safety supervision non-existent.
As to "minimal disruption," those words are stomach turners for those of us who play go-go-stop every day. We who live along this recipe for disaster have had enough.
The environmental impact, especially at Eagleridge where Minister Falcon, rather than building a safe, relatively cheap tunnel, chose to wipe out crucially important wilderness, was all the more important because of its closeness to human habitation.
Developers cashing in, per usual
There is a big plus for Autocrat Campbell and his toadies. All along the highway there are new developments built by Liberal supporters. As Kevin Costner's character was told in Field of Dreams, "Build it and they will come." Within a few years, the Sea-to-Sky will be as busy as or busier than ever before. The only good thing you can say about the parlous times we're in is that some of these developments will no doubt be postponed for palmier times.
Now we see that the traffic patterns in Vancouver, on the major bridges as well as Highway 99 and the Sea-to-Sky, will all but end normal use of our streets for a stretch of 17 days. Evidently those of us who live on the Sea-to-Sky will have residents' passes, while the rest of non-Olympics traffic will have to stay home. Actually, this might not be a bad idea after all. Perhaps this could be made permanent so that only people whose permanent residence is on the highway would be able to drive it, exceptions being deliverers of beer and other staple products. As for the raving lunatics who kill and maim us, as well as themselves now, as they try for new speed records to Whistler and back, surely they could be trained to join Canasta Clubs, or go lawn bowling or stay home with the kids and the pooch.
Sports few ever play
But Rafe, you surely ask, aren't you excited at the prospect of all those world class athletes coming to our village by the rain forest and plying their trade? Why, you'll be able to watch things like the biathlon, bobsleighing, curling, ice hockey, luge, skating and all manner of skiing.
OK, let's have a peek at that biathlon. We're told it's "A demanding combination of exertion and precision, the biathlon combines cross-country skiing and riflery. It was originally devised as a means for hunting." Am I, then, to don my trusted snowshoes and tramp along the trails shouting and clapping my applause?
Frankly, I just don't give a damn about the biathlon so scratch that from my list. Actually, I don't give a fiddler's fart about bobsledding and luge, either. C'mon now, how many of you can name anyone who does this?
Lot's of Canadians love skiing. In my case, along with bungee jumping, hang gliding and free falling from a glider, etc., it's on my list of ways I'm not going to die.
Curling? Right up there with watching paint dry, as a spectator sport. This leaves skating and ice hockey but somehow I don't like them so much that I'm prepared to pay the charge for admission.
I'll be on a warm beach in 2010
Let's be brutally frank here. A majority of events you can't see in person and must, surrounded by the comforts of home, watch on the telly. Only a small per cent of you will actually go to the skating or the hockey. What we have here, then, is a public spectacle of events, which will be seen by the vast majority on television. And this is worth all that money?
Ah, you cry, got you there, Rafe. This is all about "showcasing" (a dreadful word dreamt up by ad men) Vancouver and Whistler.
I say, "dream on." Vancouver in February is not all that showcase-able and Whistler is already well enough known to wealthy offshore skiers.
Wendy and I have carefully looked this situation over and have concluded that all we would ever see of the Olympics would be on the idiot box, and that we can do that just as well in Auckland, Maui or Cape Town, bathed in warm sunshine, as we can in Vancouver during the monsoon season.
So, fellow suckers, enjoy our tax dollars being pissed away on overweight gentlemen with blazers and the Olympics logo and on athletes you've never seen before and will never see again. Wendy and I are off to balmier climes and, frankly, I don't even care if our room doesn't have a TV set!
Related Tyee stories:
- Tracking the Games? Stay current with The Hook's 2010 Olympics department.
- Blame It on Olympic Fever
Suddenly the Games' big downside looks steep. My side tried to warn you, but there's still time to back out. - Will Olympics Be Magnet for Human Traffickers?
Awareness campaign slated for fall, but no convictions yet.
![[Tyee]](http://thetyee.cachefly.net/ui/img/ico_fishie.png){kind=small}
- BC snuffs out AirCare test program
- AFN national chief Shawn Atleo to launch re-election bid
- Citizens group releases video to fight undead Bill C-30
- Conservative MP says he might vote against budget, then 'clarifies' his position
- Genetically modified plants won't take root with councillors in Richmond, BC
- Hundreds at Vancouver rally to support Quebec students
- Could Fort Mac become an eco-tourist hotspot?
- Rick Hansen's Man in Motion anniversary tour concludes in Vancouver
- The Gem of Canadian Science that Harper Killed
- Who Mowed Down the Premier?
- Canada's Economy, Deconstructed (by a 12 year-old)
- Death in Remand: a Tyee Inquiry
- Now Is the Time to Talk up Big Ideas
- Sexism Tinges Criticism of Teachers' Job Action
- Bill C-38: the Environmental Destruction Act
- Death In Remand: 'A Gut Feeling'
- Bias in BC's Pesticide Decision? Follow the Bouncing Verbs
- The Ethics of Addiction Studies
- The Gem of Canadian Science that Harper Killed
- Sexism Tinges Criticism of Teachers' Job Action
- Now Is the Time to Talk up Big Ideas
- The Ethics of Addiction Studies
- Bill C-38: the Environmental Destruction Act
- Alberta Fills Pipes with Corrosive Denial
- Bias in BC's Pesticide Decision? Follow the Bouncing Verbs
- How Our Immune Systems Exaggerate Fear
- BC biotech company seeks approval for GM apple
- What's Behind BC's Doors?
- The Ethics of Addiction Studies
- What's Behind BC's Doors?
- The Gem of Canadian Science that Harper Killed
- Sexism Tinges Criticism of Teachers' Job Action
- Should You Run from that Medical Test?
- 'The Dictator'
- Death in Remand: Stacked Deck
- 'Moonrise Kingdom'
- From Financial Advisor to Occupier
- Seven Goals to Build the Conservative 'Dream'
- Double lung recipient dances on Ellen show
- ISS astronauts grab DragonX space capsule by the tail with Canada Arm
- Metro Vancouver gas prices peak at record levels
- Ottawa posts $9-billion deficit in March despite pledge to avoid spending spree
- BC phases out AirCare to focus on fighting bigger vehicle emissions
- Tsunami senors to be dropped into deep sea off of Vancouver Island
- Student groups file court challenge against Quebec protest law
- ...while on the streets, pirates and ninjas put aside mutual animosity to join student protests
96
Login or register to post comments
morechatter
3 years ago
2010 a Boom or Bust?
Well after listening and talking with many around the globe and articles I have read and news stories I have heard and they are all saying they just may sit this one out as traveling and luxury events like the Olympics are the first to as can catch it on the tube during hard economic times for many around the globe. Does that mean locals may get to enjoy the prestigious events if economy around the globe does not bonce back in time leaving the Olympics a Bust. But not for the Liberals land developers and their speculative market which leaves little room for investment and causing many to lose their homes certainly has made them rich as many face foreclosures. And the spring election can come only to soon as government in place is seen as anything but desirable. You didn't really give this guy a blank cheque did you?
dorothy
3 years ago
Insult to injury? blunder on, by all means, be my guest!
"I should have listened to the boo birds. But, here's what the Highways Department said about the project..."
Yes, Rafe, you should have. For now we suffer the results of opinion gurus like you getting caught up in the hype and taking a lot of baa-baa-sheep with you, all the 60 % who obeyed the clarion call of fictitious fat wealth gushing on the priest and trickling onto the deacon.
Some of us knew better all along. Which is why you have no business firing off smug garbage like
"So, fellow suckers, enjoy our tax dollars being pissed away on overweight gentlemen with blazers and the Olympics logo, etc., etc. ..."
Thanks a heap, but some of us are not suckers enough to think it mnakes a damn difference where on Earth we eat our gruel, and therefore see no reason to suck even more and make a travel agent and a hotel owner on the other side of the globe richer than they are now.
Next time a hype is in the offing, could you just shut up until you have done your homework?
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Rafe...
Sounds like that's another way of sayin' that ya also rolled snake eyes when ya placed your order for tickets. :)
Damn, so did I and everyone else I know... with one lucky single exception... my better half scored big time with the opening ceremonies! :)
1.6 million tickets for sale...
And 5 hours after the release of the last batch on Friday... SOLD OUT!
That sucks big time.
Sheesh, if only Carole James would have demanded a public boycott of the Olympics by New Democrats, life would have been a heck of a lot easier for everyone else.
Oh well, if the 2010 games are a BUST, we can always blame Glen Clark and the NDP... they started the ball rollin' for the 2010 Olympic Games in the first place. :D
alive
3 years ago
Windbag
rafe, you have been doing s lot of conversion lately, like promising to vote NDP in May, and now going against the stream on the olympics.
It is really too bad you entered political office before you gained your senses.
What really pisses me off it that you now sit on your fat behind and make money bragging about realizing your mistakes!
Those of us who were on the right track from day one never got the chance to spout off as you have.
It is a weird world where windbags can be so succesfull.
zalm
3 years ago
Noxious emissions
Bang on, Dorothy, Alive.
Rafe, if your regret is sincere, what can we expect you to do about it? Call Chris Shaw and ask you you can help, perhaps? Inform yourself a little better as to exactly how damaging this event will be to the polarities in our formerly wonderful city?
It's too much to ask you to go on a rant like you do with the fish, but....
Me, I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop on Senator Campbell. He pulled a Glencoe on the city when he was elected mayor, and now that he's made good his escape, I'm expecting a touch of honesty to show up any day now.
But I'm not holding my breath.
mcdull
3 years ago
The Highways
How much will they cost to bring the rest of BC's highways up to a level of safety that is acceptable when this orgy of spending on the olympics is over. Billions for the lower mainland peanuts for the rest of BC. Where will the money come from. TOLLS. Because we won't be able to afford the road repairs. We get seal coating on highways that should have been repaved. Kevin Falcon HA HA. the rest of us just don't count. Drive the Hope Princeton, the Fraser Canyon and Highway 16 all need repairs. Snow wait till 6 am before you start plowing , Don't salt. Why is the highway by from Victoria to Porters Farm cleared so much better than the Highway from Porters Farm to Nanaimo. Cheap highway maintainance? We can afford so many accidents on Icy roads that are not sanded.
quarry bay
3 years ago
A couple of items you missed Rafe
The sea to sky highway is a wee bit more than that amount, the initial construction is closer to 880 million and the total amount of payment to the private builder is a staggering ...3.6 billion dollars!
3.6 billion..880 million for construction and 100 million dollars a year for maintenance(or 300.000.00 a day) for 25 years, can you say GULP.
Just how many highway workers can you pay for with 300.000.00 per day? hundreds,hmmm
That is only one of the shocking things that we tax payers are paying for, perhaps you missed this very indepth piece done by the georgia straight.
This story tells some very interesting facts how Gordon Campbell`s cronies have been milking the tax payer.
Here`s the story
http://www.straight.com/article-03176/developers-are-the-games-real-winners
When the NDP open up the books on may 13 2009 we will all be shocked by the extent of the public pusre giveaways to Campbells string pullers.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Sorry about the link
Here is this well written factual story about how the public gets shafted.
http://www.straight.com/article-03176/developers-are-the-games-real-winners
quarry bay
3 years ago
sorry again about the link
I will try again
http://www.straight.com/article-93176/developers-are-the-games-real-winners
quarry bay
3 years ago
Luke
Somehow I am not surprised that you got tickets for some good events, hmmmm
Luke,have you been real busy over at the Liberals "open Platform" web site, I understand your the one who has written all the spin.
Seems to me that anyone who got tickets for one of the 6 popular sporting events are all selling their tickets on craigs list and news papers around north america,money money money, I guess the tens of thousands of unemployed BC forest workers,now construction workers couldn`t afford tickets anyways!
You are correct luke,only Gordon Campbell could have looted the province on that grand of scale all in the name of 17 days of sport.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Luke
I missed one point.....
I see you and Campbell`s cronies are already trying to put a spin on the finacial bust of the 2010 games, blame the NDP of the nineties or blame the world.
I wouldn`t worry your head off over it Luke,Campbell won`t be running the province and the NDP will be left holding an empty bag and about 70 billion in added provincial debt!
jrb
3 years ago
let's not have any sour grapes here
no matter whether you were in favor of it or not in the beginning, it's a done deal.
so deal with it.
i wasn't here when it was all being debated and decided, but i can now see that it's an unnecessary monstrosity.
however, i like making delicious lemonade from sour lemons so i will be avoiding the 'showcase' that is a vancouver february with insane crowding, traffic congestion and paranoid taseristas by leaving my low-paying, service-sector job behind while i sublet my modest studio for enough to buy me 17 days on maui - from where i will watch canada win both hockey golds from my seat at the swim-up bar.
maybe i'll even be sitting in gordon campbell's old seat there.
go, canada, go.
blow, vancouver, blow.
nightbloom
3 years ago
Ditto Dorothy, Alive & Zalm.
Ditto Dorothy, Alive & Zalm. I take little satisfaction in saying that I am soooooo relieved that I'll be no where near the Lower Mainland in February 2010. I was against the Olympics from the start, and nothing I've seen since has convinced me to change my mind that this is going to be revealed as another made-in-BC boondoggle.
Kam Lee
3 years ago
gordo's & wee kev's follies
Facts:
We are beeen fooled by Canada's only convicted drug abuser(yes booze is a drug). We are been lied to by him and wee kev about the olympics, the costs for the road to the disaster, as well as the Virk, Basi, Virk case. End the madness! Remember all this come May 2009. Get the p-tank and his developer cronies out. Yes, I was one of the 40 percent that did not want the olympics here. We were told to shut up, cause it will do good for us BULLCRAP! Excessive costs, coverups, and sinking ice ovals. What more, stay tuned. Thank you Rafe, for coming to your senses. If you need some relief come Feb 2010, take a ferry to Vancouver Island. Oops, sorry ferries down still, shook themselves to death? The madness continues. How many of gordo's gang have been charged, awaiting charges, or have stepped down? Rememer all the lies told by gordo, as well as the MSM, can one say cover-ups?
dorothy
3 years ago
There is no help there
"Rememer all the lies told by gordo"
Oh, Kam, people do, and in the eyes of many, it makes him a preferred leader, one who knows how to swing it, how to get around, knowing the score, etc., etc.
You see, in our fair province it ain't about things going well for us all, because there is no 'us all'. It is about him and me, and him not getting away with getting anything for free that could have been mine. I don't care if I have it crummy, just as long as he has it every bit as crummy as I do.
Tha's how they have us by the arse again and again. Our own pervasive pettiness and gate-keeping tendencies.
Long live the potlatch!
MichaelT
3 years ago
as a former montrealer I
as a former montrealer I always thought you guys were totsl fools to ignore our history with the games - hubris thy name is English Canada
Fiat lux
3 years ago
When will people realize
When will people realize that the biggest shows are always put up by dictatorships to propagandize their greatness and achievements?
Starting with Hitler in 1936, the Beijing Olympics have been the latest example.
Now we have a corporate dictatorship governing us with the resulting hysteria to divert attention from the fact that real democracies can not afford these irresponsible actions and idiocies.
Business is not sport and sport can not be business. Yet, interestingly, it was the Soviets and satellites that forced the acceptance of professionals in these profit rackets, still called "games".
Ed Deak.
Jeffrey J.
3 years ago
Congrats Rafe & Chris Shaw
Read Chris Shaw's excellent new book on the 2010 Olympics ("5 Ring Circus").
http://2010watch.com/
It says it all. Full stop.
Great coverage Tyee!
Skywalker
3 years ago
New BC 2010 slogan
BC, for 17days the best place on earth not to be.
Rafe is right. I'd go one step furhter. It is an event that has outlived its usefulness.
Alive, ease up will you. Better late than never. Also better one that came after thinking about it than a blind loyalist. He could be like Luke.
Skywalker
3 years ago
New BC 2010 slogan
BC, for 17days the best place on earth not to be.
Rafe is right. I'd go one step furhter. It is an event that has outlived its usefulness.
Alive, ease up will you. Better late than never. Also better one that came after thinking about it than a blind loyalist. He could be like Luke.
Feverish
3 years ago
Sorry Dude
Rafe - I admire the work that you do in most of your pieces as I usually agree w/ most of what you are saying, but you lost me on this one. In this case you seem to have given your neighbours a facewash with the yellow snow as you were booking your tickets to wherever it is you're going next winter.
A little more empathy for those that don't have the luxury of jetting off to warmer climates would have made this confession more digestible. This one is coming back up, I'm afraid.
Yammer
3 years ago
McDull is right
...although since I live in the Lower Mainland, I was and am in favour of the Olympics.
I see it as one of the only opportunities BC in general and this city in particular has to receive federal tax monies for infrastructure projects.
We can (and should) argue about whether the money was better spent in other ways, but at the end of the day this city will be better for having a north-south Skytrain, new recreation facilities, more housing, and a slightly less twisty Sea-To-Sky.
I also believe that there are benefits to having an Olympics in Canada period, in that it increases funding for athletic programs that will serve Canadian youth for years to come.
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Expo 86/ Calgary '88 Olympics...
Expo 86... I recall some of the similar negative "group think" posted here that pervaded the pre-May, 1986 opening... "The Bread ... Not Circuses" group think.
That attitude all but evaporated after opening day on May 2, 1986 and I've never heard a similar negative peep since.
The positive energy... the proverbial electricity in the air was phenomenal at the time and certainly boosted BC's spirit thereafter economically and otherwise after the mini-depression of the early 1980's. One of the most memorable and best summers of my life.
Same with Calgary in 1988... the Olympics were held during an economic downturn in Alberta... the Chinook winds also causing Olympic event cancellations and re-scheduling...
Still a 98% approval rating in Calgary after the games were over and similar approval ratings for Expo '86 right here in BC.
Having a positive and optimistic attitude in life is a heck of a lot better than always being negative and pessimistic about everything. ;)
Wilfred Laurier
3 years ago
Rafe....
Are you for anything these days, Rafe?
I don't agree with the above poster very often but when it comes to people walking around in a funk, this province is the worst place I have ever been.
sunshine coast girl
3 years ago
You forgot to mention
how long we're going to be paying for this boondoggle, Rafe.
Should have listened to us. We were right all along.
Is it my imagination, or are you starting to see things more clearly as you age?
spinboydotcom
3 years ago
Bait & Switch, BC Style
Rafe Mair finally goes two steps down a path only to discover that it isn't what was advertised. *clap - clap* Bravo.
Even an accidental lobotomy victim could've smelled this stinker coming. Winter Olympics are a sweet, sweet con and the boys who sold you this dog have been laughing, toasting and boasting all the way to the taxpayer's bank.
All anyone can do now is enjoy the ride, blurp out a few critiques and make damn sure 'we don't get fooled again'.
alda
3 years ago
Bread and circuses
Olympics = bread and circuses for the masses.
... a fantastic ponzi scheme for developers and global promotors where ordinary taxpayers end up holding the bag. Our society's obsession with competitive sports and competitive patriotism is frankly childish.
Thanks to the 88 Olympics, Calgary built monolithic sports facilities (now aging) now used by the leisure classes. And what do we have in housing for the 4,000 homeless? That's right. Zip-all.
nogames2010
3 years ago
not getting scammed again
Rafe:
Don't feel too bad about it: The Olympic hype machine is so pervasive, the cheering from all levels of government and the mainstream press so deafening, that it's easy to lose one's sense of skepticism and jump on board. You are not alone in having done so. What can we do about the Games now? There are several things. First, continue to demand official accountability (in rather short supply, as usual with the Olympics, as Auditor General John Doyle just found out): if government won't do it, citizens have to. How about joining a class action lawsuit against those members of VANOC and their pet politicians who outright lied to the public? In other words, let's sue them for their own money (rather than ours) as a symbolic act of resistance and accountability. Next, don't let V2010 ISU brand those engaged in protests as a "threat to 2010 security". Protests will be embarrassing for sure, but a threat to the public? Hardly. Civil liberties are likely to take a hit in 2010 if citizens don't demand restraint from the authorities. Finally, help those in other cities now engaged in bidding on the Games understand what happened here. The citizens of Chicago are now beginning to rethink their city's bid for the 2016 Summer Games and could use the insight you have gained. Cheers, Chris Shaw.
Fiat lux
3 years ago
Expo 86 was a disaster for
Expo 86 was a disaster for the Interior of BC. It cost me $5,000 in lost income, although I haven't been near the damn thing, and all businesses I've contacted, even the supermarkets, have lost money and many, especially in the tourist trade went bellyup, because everybody flocked to Expo and nobody came.
I've also heard from many small Vancouver businesses who suffered.
A lot of the "friends of the government" are yakking now on how much this Olympic racket will bring to the Interior, conveniently forgetting that Expo went on for 6 months in the summer and nobody came, so, how will a couple of weeks in the winter bring anybody?
Meanwhile our roads are falling apart, with millions of cracks and deep ruts in the pavement, the roadsides haven't been cut for years and the small seedlings and trees that have been cut 5-6 years ago, are still there, waiting for a fire.
Ed Deak, Big Lake.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Yammer
Could you point out where all that housing is? Do you mean the the SROs the province bought from Robert Wilson?
Could you imagine if we had the olympics in Kamloops,we would have a skytrain in the interior, I wonder how much sports funding,housing you could do with a billion dollars/ which is how much the security bill is for the 17 days.
It sure is a good thing that all our BC highways aren`t P3s,could you imagine if we had to pay 300.000.00 a day to every road builder that built highways in BC,could you imagine the entire BC budget going to road builders for maintenance!
Yammer, how many old age BCers or single mothers or disabled workers are going to get a million dollar townhouse/condo at the olympic village?
Skywalker
3 years ago
I remember Expo 86.
Communities got a hill of gravel with an Expo 86 logo on it. That had to be removed by most at a cost and is still visible in some communties having been converted into a cheesy welcome sign. I also recall that Expo 86 at least did not saddle the province with a ton of debt. With all the infrastructure costs associated with the olympics hidden form the accounts and itemized in other places , who knows how this mess will play out.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Vanoc just can`t ......
Help themselves,it is in their nature to bite the hand that feeds them,these corporate theives care not about BC,they have played and won their three card monty game, move on,nothing to see here,we have a new game afoot in London.
Here is how Vanoc treats Whistler
http://www.canada.com/theprovince/story.html?id=18de8c83-de34-4822-a1d3-fb344868da3e
quarry bay
3 years ago
Three card monty game is........
alive and well in London,the original budget of 2.4 billion has risen to 10 billion and they are still 4 years away from their 2 week sponge.
http://news.bbc.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6453575.stm
I agree with Skywalker,the olympic fraud must end,we could fund sports and arts for millions of people for 1/10 of the cost,the IOC is nothing but a roving gang of flim flam gyspsies!
quarry bay
3 years ago
the link to the bbc story
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6453575.stm
budget goes from 2.4 billion to 10 billion
sunshine coast girl
3 years ago
And what's ours gone from
and to?
deeby
3 years ago
Schadenfreude doesn't become you Rafe
You've been cut a lot of slack around here, since you were drummed out of your 'bully pulpit', and since you embraced causes dear to the hearts of many BCers.
Putting out a tongue-in-cheek missive along the lines of 'Oh well I goofed, see you on the beach' is a pretty hollow and backhanded way of admitting a mistake, especially given the influence your show used to wield....
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
Luke skywalker's view
Luke talks about the rosey days of Expo 86.
What he fails to mention are the $500,000,000 in cost over-runs on the Coquihalla that was built to showcase the event. Contractors lined their pockets while using snow as fill for some parts so the road could be completed on time. Those who have traveled the hoop-de-doo sink holes area south of Merritt on the Coquihalla now know why.
Further, it is my understanding that the land for building some of the highway was purchased by Russel Bennett (Bill's brother) just prior to the announcement that highway was to be built. It is my understanding he made a handsome profit from that purchase and quick resale to the province. Hardly a line was written in the press. No charges were ever laid. I guess millions in profits to family members on quite possible insider information just doesn't compare with a neighbour building a deck for a neighbour.
Then there was tha Doman scandal that got hardly even a mention in the MSM.
http://tinyurl.com/6tkyrd
We can't forget that Bennett had a 12% budget over run the very year after he got elected on an austerity platform.
But, Bennett and his chornies were the Socreds you say. And, well, yes, the Socreds disappeared as fast as the brown paper bags full of cash that the next Socred Premier, VanderZalm, got caught pocketing. But did the Socreds really disappear?
When the Socreds tanked, the majority of them abandoned their namesake and they became the gurus of the BC Liberal Party. Like a leopard being unable to change its spots, however, the blue and red of the Socreds are the same colours of the BC Liberal party.
The BC Liberal Party is still the same old Socred clunker; it has had its original paint refreshed (but no change of colours) and the engine was washed to look rebuilt. Underneath the exterior we find the same old worn Socred gears and dirty internal systems robbing the horsepower (and dollars) from the resources being stolen from future generations.
We are fools, yet again, for having purchased, yet again, the bondo-special Liberal-Socredmobile to drive us to the abyss. When will we ever smarten up for good and quit hiring these smarmy, lying, manipulating, cheating, drunken premiers and their parties? When will we quit listening to the MSM version without saying, "Hmmm, what's the rest of that story and will we get to the bottom of it?"
Yammer
3 years ago
Hi Quarry Bay
"Could you point out where all that housing is?"
No. I assume that the athlete's housing will have some post-Oly function. It is certainly shaking up the very tight rental scene in Whistler.
"Do you mean the the SROs the province bought from Robert Wilson?"
No, but as with Expo, the facelift of the DTES will accelerate the gentrification of the area around Tinseltown.
"Could you imagine if we had the olympics in Kamloops"
No. Kelowna, possibly.
"we would have a skytrain in the interior"
I think you would need a bus first.
"I wonder how much sports funding,housing you could do with a billion dollars/ which is how much the security bill is for the 17 days."
Of course. The benefits I spoke of are byproducts. The purpose of the Olympics is the Olympics.
"Yammer, how many old age BCers or single mothers or disabled workers are going to get a million dollar townhouse/condo at the olympic village?"
None. Sorry, was that the point you thought I was making? I'm not at all.
I think that the Olympic spending orgy will undoubtably improve regional infrastructure, particularly for youth and others (like myself) who regularly use the community rinks and sporting facilities.
I didn't say it was the best use of the funds, but it is a way of getting federal money that usually gets spent back east.
Bobb999
3 years ago
Vancouverites had their say in a referendum
A few years back Vancouver residents were offered an opportunity the rest of the province apparently was not: a referendum vote to say yay or nay to the Olympics. I voted nay, but was outnumbered by the 60% who said yay.
But there seemed to be a lot of rational, prudent reasons to think BC would be much better off without this expensive 2 week event.
-Olympics always cost far more than official estimates claim. It's funny how estimates always err on the low side somehow. Over-estimates are unheard of! It's as if the books are cooked from day 1 to make the games more palatable to
unwitting taxpayers. It's the same con every Olympics, and it always seems to work
to sell an "inexpensive" fantasy Olympics to the public.
By the time the organizers start to come clean on the real costs, and the public gets wise, it's always far too late! By then, it's virtually a done deal.
-What ever the games do cost, I can't help but think BC and Canada could find far more
important spending priorities to better benefit Canadians.
Olympics are an excuse to indulge national vanity, while wasting many $Billions on an event that lasts a mere 2 weeks, and amounts to very expensive entertainment.
The entertainment of watching to see which doped up cheating athletes are cleverest in masking their abuse of banned performance enhancers sufficient to win those glittering faux precious metal medals!
These are games expensive for taxpayer and ticket holder alike. And expensive for our neediest citizens who will likely be denied necessary social programs, because governments can no longer afford them after going deeply in debt to hold an unnecessary Olympics circus! $1,000+ for opening ceremonies? $500+ for a hockey game?
For instance, child protection in BC remains woefully inadequate, as the gov't's own independent watchdogs attest.
Justice Ted Hughes' report that recommended
improvements in child care to better protect at-risk BC kids, to fix a broken system, remain unimplemented. Little money is being put toward this important end, yet BC is willingly to go into massive debt for a 2-week's of Olympics circus entertainment. This doesn't seem defensible.
The fact BC will be even deeper into a long recession by 2010, makes the Olympics doubly inappropriate now.
The Brits snagged the 2012 Summer Olympics.
Miraculously, truer budget #s are emerging early this time, giving many Brits reason to have 2nd thoughts - though too late again! The original official estimate for the UK 2012 games was $5Bill. It has already quadrupled to an estimated $20Bill.! And who believes cost estimates won't balloon even further over the next 3+ years?
Same old con. Still seems to work every time! But next time, just say NO!
Albert Camusoff
3 years ago
To normalize the unconscionable
is one of the roles of the press, and it has done a swell job of making Gorgon Campbell and Scam Sullivan's complicity in the murder by exposure of Vancouver's homeless population seem unavoidable or somehow a natural disaster, and for several years now it has been cranking up the BS machine for this Olympic-sized bad joke. The 24Hrs paper (better printed on a roll if you ask me) last week reported that 77% of readers (or page turners) think solving the homelessness crisis is a pipe dream. The mainstream press pushes the illusion of necessary inaction down the throats of the very sheep it wishes to shepherd, like Rafe did back when he parrotted the toxic lies of the bid-backers, and before that when he worked for Vander Zalm and the socreds. Lying makes control of the masses simpler. Over the last several years the lapdog media have succeeded in doing the same with this obscene sports orgy. Unfortunately for the rest of us, the Rafes and the Wilfreds and the Luke Skywalkers were convinced when it counted that the mass media, owned by the very people who will profit from us foot-the-bill muk-muks (isn't that the name of one of those Olympic pukemon doll/macots?), were correct when they sold us this scam. Now, people with short memories, or those recently arrived from paradises where nobody complains about anything as much as we do, think that we should look at the legacy of Expo 86. Well, if you look into that, you will find that Expo and the Olumpits are two very different models. Even so, look at the legacy of Expo for the vast majority of British Columbians. It ain't good. (By the way, I find it easy and reasonable to complain about making poor people sleep on cold streets.) The Olympics, as research into the cities which have held one will show, is an invitation to long-term debt and the hasty retreat of the liars who will leave us with the mess. What does it take to shake the lies out of our ears? I would have thought good old historical evidence would be enough to shut up even that drunk Campbell. I was wrong on that. The post-er from Montreal is rightly shocked that even our own bid-backers, supposedly so well-versed in big business (the art of ripping people off), did not look at Montreal's legacy of debt, once the developers had made their killing (no pun intended), folded their numbered companies and left town. Oh well, it is only recently that federal gov'ts around the globe have been less secretive about their perpetual bailing out the greedy with the money of those who work for it, so it will be no surprise when our schools get older, our hospitals more crowded and dangerous, and our food banks even more full of customers, that some neo-con will remind us that the poor once again will have to come to the rescue of those whose welfare depends on the rest of us applying for it.
Maryrose
3 years ago
2010? I've changed my mind
Rafe....EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULTS -- TYEE MODERATOR
farmboy
3 years ago
Remember Expo 86?
I remember Expo and I still think of it every time I pass the last minute "welcome to expo" dirt heap near my community. Thankfully it is now just a hump overburden with a couple of 4 wheel drive trucks on it and not one of those cheesy welcome signs better oriented for incoming UFO's than highway traffic. Some folks hold out the hope that 2010 will be the same sort of province wide economic boost that expo was. Let's think about that: 2 weeks in Feb. vs 6 mos over the summer. Maybe some of those 2010 sports fans will feel like doing the circle tour around the province once all of the gender and steroid tests are over but I wouldn't bet the farm on it. As for attending? Maybe if I actually sold the farm I could afford to go. I'd really like to be front and centre to see some of those chicken s**t loser countries who can't afford big sports bucks get their asses kicked by all the really good countries. Will I watch on the tube ? You bet I'm hoping my personal most memorable winter Olympian, Eddy the Eagle will make a comeback.
reallife
3 years ago
Just a bit self serving?
So the Olympic preparations have slightly inconvenienced Rafe and he is now against the games. Many of us who have always thought the taxpayers could not afford the Olympics now support the games because we are trying to make the best out of bad situation.
And really, only Rafe could call Eagleridge Bluff wilderness! The push for a tunnel came from the wealthy residents of the area who did not want their vistas spoiled and certainly not from the average taxpayer.
BTW, Rafe may want to park the car when it gets dark. At his age, he should not be driving on the highway at night.
dorothy
3 years ago
Each to his own - but pay for your own buzz!
"The positive energy... the proverbial electricity in the air was phenomenal at the time and certainly boosted BC's spirit thereafter economically and otherwise..."
There is no such thing as 'economical spirit'. Contradiction in terms, you see. So, you must truly be referring to the 'otherwise', which I would love to see you elaborate on. It's good you had a rave summer, but such stuff wrote the rest of us a pretty tall bill (pun intended).
Circus can be done in such a way that it doesn't cost arms or legs or any other limbs, and it can even be done to boost spirits in a more enduring way. If '86 had such a pervasive and uplifting effect on the whole culture, why are we now in the dumps again and back for more? real lifting of the spirit takes you further. It means you got more in your kit bag forever after, and you do not come back for another shot of the same. ERGO, it was a flash in the pan then, just as this time, only serving to fatten some people and leave the rest to pay for the feast.
I know there are self-serving, lame people in high places with morepower than they ever should have had, but as long as they keep well away from my beaten path, I can pretend they are some notches better than they actually are. When they act up and summon their minions and employ them with cramming their lies down everyone's throat including mine, I get riled.
For another kind of spirit-lifting experience, try your local farmer's market. You will get nothing for free, but you will get REAL FOOD. Do you know how rare that commodity is?? If not, try to read labels...
Lexmark
3 years ago
Sea to Sky Highway
I have driven this highway off and on since the 1960s and it is more dangerous now than it has ever been. Anybody that does not drive this highway on a daily basis should not even attempt it -especially at night. During the day it is bad enough in even ideal conditions. To drive this piece of road during the dark, you have to have to be stupid. To drive it at night and in poor weather, you have to be suicidal and stupid.
monty
3 years ago
Investigator needed
Just which developers have made money by building things such as the out-of-control Convention (heavy on the con) Centre, buying land on the Sea to Sky then reselling it, buying land along the South Fraser Perimeter Road about 5 years ago then selling it to Falcon, building over priced condos and stiffing the buyers? Has everyone left town and moved to Dubai? Who are those developers who have left skeletons for buildings? Where is all the money going? Bermuda? Caymans?
Turks & Caicos? You can bet these dudes aren't paying taxes on their ill-gotten gains. Intrepid investigator needed. Be
quick. Records can disappear in a flash.
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
dorothy...
Ahhhhh.... BCTV began to broadcast the beginning of the building boom starting at the same time in Whistler during 1986... and extending everywhere else.
Ya see... 1982 - 1985 were quite rough times here in B.C.
You never did attend Expo 86... did you? :( Unfortunate... It was magic goin' through those gates. Really.
BTW, never seen such a throng of tourists in Metro Vancouver, Van Isle, and in the Okanagan Valley. Likely nobody here will ever experience that time again.
G West
3 years ago
That's good
Likely nobody here will ever experience that time again.
One cheesy rip-off second class B exhibition was enough.
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Sharing Is Good - A Little Actual History...
Hmmmmmm.... the Coquihalla Hwy was first announced in 1978... way before Expo '86 (Transpo '86 in its first incarnation) was ever envisaged.
A four-lane, freeway standard, 85 mph design speed (~135 km/hr). VERY expensive through difficult mountain terrain. Compare that to the 100 km/hr design speed for Hwy 1 through the Kicking Horse Canyon or the 80 km/hr design speed for the STS Hwy. For every incremental 10 km/hr increase in design speed, costs escalate exponentially.
The Coq started construction in 1980 and was halted in early 1982 due to the mini-depression. Construction restarted in ~late 1983. Keynesian economics anyone?
The real problem was accelerating construction based only upon "preliminary" cost estimates and not "final" costs estimates. However, it was gonna get built in any event and was constructed during a "cheap" construction climate.
Not exactly correct. Due to the accelerated construction time frame, many
proper pre-loading time periods were overlooked resulting in heaving... esp. along the hill heading out of Merritt westbound. Still remember the dips and roadside warning signage very well during the summer of '86.
BTW, then MoTH's lead project manager was Gregg Singer, who was also the VIHP's project manager under the NDP. Nice guy, very competent, and quite smart.
Cute. Now how about good ol' Bob Williams, NDP godfather, who purchased property along the Nanaimo Parkway months prior to its announcement. That dude made a hefty profit!!! Gotta love them New Democrats!
Yeah... but you call that tanking??? :)
Remember 2001, with the NDP receiving 2 out of 77 seats??? That's the mother of all tankings in B.C.! :)
You also forgot to add .... a premier's aide conconcting false memos to provide to the media. But to answer your query... We did. Glen Clark and the NDP brought us the Olympics and the voters made their decision at the ballot box in 2001. ;)
quarry bay
3 years ago
Monty
Here are a few of the names
http://www.straight.com/article-93176/developers-are-the-games-real-winners
P.S hey Luke,slow night at the open platform!
quarry bay
3 years ago
Denis
Sorry about being flippant and sassy, this ferry story is only one in a series about the problems of these tubs.They are sitting not because of noise,they are falling apart.
Again,no hard feelings, no one gets a free ride around here,I have been silenced many times and the night is still young.
Perhaps you would feel more comfortable over at Gordon Campbell`s "open platform" BCs first and only Open platform web site,Campbell "wants your input to help your BC Liberal team keep BC strong, well into the future"
It must be a good web site, we tax payers are spending millions advertising to the BC public telling them to go there.
here is the link,check it out.
http://www.bcliberals.com/EN/stop_the_smears/
While you are there Say hi to Luke Skywalker for me.
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
sink holes south of Merritt - Luke
I know the a truck driver who was ordered to dump snow so it could be used as fill, Luke. He was there when the big bucket loader pushed it in.
As for the rest of what you have to say, I have to read it tomorrow. It is bed time now.
jwlaurie
3 years ago
2010? I've changed my mind
Add my name to those who have been against this self advertising, for politicians only affair since day one!
Now I have even more reason to have a Mad-on against it. As Rafe says, the highway is a nightmare of absoutely confusing signage or in my case, no signage at all which led to a head on collision between my SUV a pick up truck three weeks ago just south of Bertrand Creek. Friday night, pouring rain bouncing 2 inches off the road surface, on-coming headlights blinding and a brand new piece of pavement, just paved that day without any marking whatsoever and a last second decision/guess on which way the road went sends me head on into an oncoming vehicle!
Fortunately both of us swerved enough that it was a corner to corner hit but bad enough to write off the other vehicle and do $15,000 worth of damage to mine . . . .
My son who l;lives in Squamish and travels the road frequently says he hears of these type of accidents all the time. He went through there the next day and found all kinds of new road markers up and debris from another crash not related to ours. The next week he spoke with an RCMP acquaintance who said she saw even more damage and signage knocked over on the Monday morning following. ICBC concurs that I'm certainly not alone in this problem but if we want to fight it so our insurance isn't affected we have to sue the contractor,Peter Kewit Construction for the damages. Just how likely are we individuals supposed to win against that kind of an opponent with all the money, lawyers on retainer and the politicians in their vote buying pockets that they have? Bah!
dave49
3 years ago
Amateur sports??
While the idea of the Olympic games is good, it's been corrupted by many other things. The propaganda value of good results was pointed out by Ed Deak.
The orgy of spending on facilities by the host city is a proven fact. As a former Montrealer, there were hard lessons to be learned beyond stories about corruption.
What is most galling to me is how in the last dozen years we have let professional athletes from sport after sport compete in 'amateur games'. Has it not dawned on the IOC they are killing the Games by allowing and furthering this?
DNA
3 years ago
Well, they're coming...
I voted against them but now they're here let's stop grumbling and make the best of them. Let's party!
Albert Camusoff
3 years ago
Campbell to Luke: "You are my son."
Gee whiz it's good to know that our money spent on convincing non-residents to ignore our world-class homelessness crisis, AND our gov't's contempt for the people, has not been wasted. EDITED FOR PERSONAL INSULTS -- TYEE MODERATOR
speedo
3 years ago
winter vs summer- no contest
Has anyone noticed that Nepal has mountains, yet produces no ski teams? Ditto, say, Colombia? The winter olympics are a means for the richest couple of dozen nations in the world to get even richer having a party for themselves. The number of winter olympic medals won by non-First World countries is pretty darn low. Half the fun (for me) is getting excited for the Kenyans and Ethiopians who get to kick the crap out of athletes from far wealthier nations.
If I can pay my mortgage for the year renting my house out to wealthy Austrians for a month, I might be able to muster some enthusiasm for a winter olympics. But I doubt it.
monty
3 years ago
jwlaurie
Contact Cameron Ward (604-688-6881)
or Joe Arvay (604-689-4421) to see about a class action suit. Then get thetyee to hire Donald Gutstein do a story about the
lawsuit. Send all your info to Charlie Smith at the Georgia Straight and between the two responsible papers you can raise hell.
Remember time heals all wounds
and wounds all heels.
refedmel
3 years ago
BooBirds
Right on Rafe....."showcasing" what? A large city, financially broke, a hinterland ignored
but wow, Whistler looks good....great if you have a $million to enjoy. With a recession/depression looming, what will be left in the kitty for the soup kitchens when all the high rollers leave for the next scam called The Olympics. Oh yeah, the hype will extoll the virtues, but anybody for a guess on 2011 stats when the bill comes in.
Albert Camusoff
3 years ago
re edited for personal insults
Sorry. I pressed POST when I meant to press PREVIEW. My error. I did intend to correct the overt expressions of frustration in the form of insults. That was just a draft.
Albert Camusoff
3 years ago
Watch the propoganda
As I was saying, it is nice to know the taxpayer funded propoganda is not a complete waste. It is nice to know that some people really believe that stuff, because I and everyone I talk to believes it laughable. I get really concerned when I see poor people or people removed from necessary care beds sleeping on the street. I have seen none of them in the commercials which display only the pristine wilderness from a bird's-eye view. I hope our visitors are not too offended when they see that "the best place on Earth" is a bad place to sleep outside during the winter. I hope that my children will be able to enjoy those same wilderness areas before Gordon Campbell sells them to his friends. This is just one reason why the statistical defence, whether real or fabricated, is so offensive. Thanks Monty for the contact numbers. I will add my name to the class action lawsuit. All other efforts to discuss this reasonably are falling on deaf ears.
vigilantz
3 years ago
Being Bought With Our Own Money!
So Yammer "see(s) it as one of the only opportunities BC in general and this city in particular has to receive federal tax monies for infrastructure projects."
The whole 'era of infrastructure grants' is designed to separate us from our tax dollars and leave us feeling beholden to our politicians/government(s). It is a system whereby taxes are collected from the people, squirreled away in government accounts, grant applications are processed by a bunch of bureaucrats and a portion of it (less 'administrative' costs, of course) is then returned to some of the taxpayers in a blatant effort to influence voters. We are being 'bought with our own money'!
It would be much more efficient (and far less 'political') if the money were raised locally for broadly-supported projects solving real problems. Otherwise, it becomes a game of 'get yours or somebody else will' and even the 'winners' have no certainty that they have received back anywhere near what they paid in (we are also federal taxpayers).
The photo 'ops' and the news releases are always quick to follow the awarding of any monies. The smiling politicians obviously don't write the 'cookie-cutter' press release and typically don't have a clue of the real cost/benefits of the project being funded.
Rafe would have done well to remember his own 'Axiom of Subsidiarity', perfectly tailored for this situation: lesser politicians should always, without fail, beware of gifts coming from higher levels of governments.
biscotti
3 years ago
Low tech sports infrastructure
Up here in the Cariboo we'll get a lot more mileage for a lot longer with our $3 crazy carpets and old truck inner tubes. Old refrigerator boxes are pretty good, too ;-)
sunshine coast girl
3 years ago
Gibsons hasn't gotten anything
because of the Olympics. Oh, Sechelt got a "Spirit Square" Woo-hoo! We're not even getting extra tourists because no one wants to pay for the ferry.
How long is it going to take us to pay for this mess again?
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
Luke continued
Russell Bennett was the Premier Bill Bennett's brother! The Coquihalla land scam was as bad as they come for anyone, even a Socred/Liberal. And, you never commented upon the Doman shares insider trading scandal, that cost the Bennett brothers a million dollars, 10 years of no trading, and 2 million in lawyer's fees. Even after the Bennetts were total cheats and certainly (in my books) not less crooked than Martha Stewart, our Premier Campbell praised him last summer and named the WR Bennett Bridge after him. What a crock! That bridge by the way is at the end of the Coquihalla Highway Phase 3.
Russell Bennett also got a number of West Bank acres (72 I believe) of prime category 2 and 3 agricultural land removed from the ALR back in 1987 - and it happened without a fuss, while other people had huge problems trying to get land that was not nearly so suited for agriculture removed. This land bordered the new Coquihalla phase 3, if memory serves me right.
Luke goes on about:
"Bob Williams, NDP godfather, who purchased property along the Nanaimo Parkway"
I never heard anything about it Luke. I even googled about it. I have never even heard of Bob Williams until you mentioned him here. But if he did something wrong and the NDP is aware of it, I'd be more than a little surprised if they ever named a bridge after him.
dorothy
3 years ago
"Ya see... 1982 - 1985 were
"Ya see... 1982 - 1985 were quite rough times here in B.C.
You never did attend Expo 86... did you? :( Unfortunate... It was magic goin' through those gates. Really. "
ad1) Yes, I know. I was here. If you think I wasn't born yet (hee, hee), or am an immigrant of newer date, think again.
ad2), No I never did attend. I was one of those being slapped with all the restraints needed to finance the hype. And this is my point: Magic can be had without hurting anyone, and that is the only kind that qualifies in my book. The best things in life are not exactly free, but you can't pay for them with coin. Think about it. The future of the human race depends on that insight guiding what we choose to do.
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
Expo 86 - Dorothy
I couldn't afford to attend either, Dorothy. I was generally working 6 and 7 days a week, 12 hours a day, just to keep my business afloat in those days. I also had a garden to maintain and firewood to gather to feed my family and keep it warm in the winter. Taking time off work usually meant I was cutting firewood for the winter, catching fish for the freezer and/or out collecting healthy wild food from the forest to feed my family. The Expo didn't help my business one bit. It took money out of the pockets of my potential customers who went to Vancouver to attend that circus rather than stay home and spend it in the community.
Stump
3 years ago
memo to Luke
Just so you know, your ability to pull statistics out of thin air and 24/7 posting habits are so transparent that I doubt even your small coterie of acolytes is deceived by your protestations of impartiality. You're clearly a paid shill for the Lieberals and if I had to work so hard to defend that gang of morons I'd have to have the bathroom mirror taken out of the house, because I sure couldn't look myself in the face. Further, I resent my tax dollars paying for you to continue your lips together, teeth apart hagiographies of probable thieves and short-sighted power addicts.
Also, your constant reference to alleged past misdeeds or failings of the NDP as a way to rationalize the current government's decisions is boring and stupid. If your gang is the better bunch, why are you constantly using the actions of people you don't agree with to justify your own actions? Real leaders don't act like six year olds and use the actions of others to justify their own. They get the job done and demonstrate a higher standard of behaviour. The provincial Liberals have failed at both tasks and it's only their constant spending of tax dollars on thinly veiled propaganda that's keeping them in power. As they say, repeat a lie often enough....
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Sharing Is Good - A Little Actual History... #2
SIG, that's like saying that you've never heard of Dave Barrett. A simple google search reveals the following:
http://www.llbccat.leg.bc.ca/ipac20/ipac.jsp?index=BIB&term=235987#focus
And on other Bob Williams matters:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/2000/05/03/bc_williiamsnchs000503.html
And here's Rafe Mair's take:
http://www.rafeonline.com/archive/word/20000507.shtml
Stump:
Ouch! From what rock did you crawl out from underneath this morning? :)
Nope, not a member of any political party and never have been. BTW, please tell Carole to stop sending me all of those silly donation letter requests to the NDP. ;)
Stump
3 years ago
uh-huh
sure thing Luke.
I've got it wrong. You must be a historian then. You sure are keen to walk up and down the same hallways of posterity over and over again. Justifying current misdeeds by pointing to other's questionable activity is still pretty odious no matter what line of work you're in.
btw, never said you were a member of the Party. I think you're paid to do this work -- which doesn't require party membership.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Quiet day at the open platform?
Luke, only a paid shill would defend the actions of Campbell, you are obviously intelligent,no ethics but intelligent,many of us are getting tired of you bringing up the past to justify a cold,calculated,deceitful,cruel,lying,cheating,money mis managing goverment ( sorry I am not as elequant as stump)
People might even believe you Luke if you said Campbell screwed up with seniors care but he plans to do better in the future or if you said St Mary`s hospital in New Westminster should never have been closed before a new hospital was built to replace it,even once if you said Campbell had the advantage of record high commodity prices, but no,you blame others,compare,twist,spin,deny,defend even with over whelming evidence to the contrary!
Pleasent dreams Luke
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
well, Rafe
How do honest do you find today's BC Liberals?
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Guys ... Chill Out...
Sounds like a scene out of the movie Dumb and Dumber. :)
But really, a paid political shill? :) NADA. My interests lie in business and economics and I'm just a political junkie.
If one does not learn from history, one never will learn... and that's in the context of business, economics, politics, etc.
Face it guys, BC is a centre/centre-right province, always has been, and it continues to incrementally move further in that direction. Whether you like that reality or not is another matter. ;)
Stump
3 years ago
Wrong again
BC cannot be categorized as adhering to any one political direction. Like all large groups of people it has much diversity of opinion. Regarding public policy however, it's quite clear that we are moving 'left'-wards in our policies. If it were otherwise, why isn't the present gov't privatizing car insurance. Why are they buying up hotels for social housing. What compels them to engage in ostensible job creation measures such as the 2010 Games? These are hallmarks of left-leaning political parties. I know it pains them (Gord and gang) no end, but clearly we are moving towards a position usually referred to as a social democracy (centre, centre left). They are at best slowly the incoming tide.
Stump
3 years ago
'slowing' the incoming tide.
'slowing' the incoming tide. Oh, and I missed some question marks.
quarry bay
3 years ago
Center left,right middle,whats the diff
Luke you talk garbage, Campbell has reigned over massive cyclical surpluses and mis-managed the funds,Campbell has added billions to our BC debt,Campbell has delibrately hurt the most vulnerable in the province.
No one gave Campbell a mandate to sell BC rail,or sell our power generation to private equity funds.
Even is you don`t give a __ck about salmon and other fish being chopped up by turbines and you don`t care about a spiders web of transmission lines criss crossing the province, it is a stupid finacial move to give away the revenue source,in the midst of a global depression we give away massive earnings generators to private firms with zero benefit to BCers.
Children,disabled,seniors no not of left right politics,they know a criminal led goverment when they see it, Campbell is 9 points down in the polls and falling, people hate his guts,even Liberals hate his guts,his own cabinet ministers hate Campbell, Campbell will lose the election and it has nothing to do with left or right,it has to do with the fact that Campbell is a F__-ing asshole.
As for you Luke,you have bullied, threatened, wagered and reneged, you post partisan dribble,you run to Manitoba every time you want an out,IMO you are a loutish cad,the likes that I have put in their place all my life.
I have put down the NDP,I admit their mistakes,Campbell errors out number NDP mistakes a hundred fold.Without a complicit media Campbell would be reduced to 2 seats, I will settle for a 13 seat majority,as for you luke, Karma will take care of you!
ME2
3 years ago
A definable political direction??
Anybody who thinks he / she can pigeon-hole the average British Columbian into a Left-Center-Right category is either attempting a propaganda ploy or is obviously politically naieve.
All in the same breath the average BC'er will tell you that Socialism is Communism and then demand that Gov't hospital services be improved. Who should pay for this? Why "they" should, of course. No, not me, and no not business, since it is already providing us with the good life. Clearly, it is the politicians who should pay, since they are getting all our taxes......
For decades, the public has been lied to by the neocons who have told them that all the good things they have are the gifts of Free Enterprise Capitalists, while being just as badly lied to by Lefties who have told them just the opposite, that everything they have has been wrested from Capitalists, and so Capitalism must be done away with.
Well, at least Lefties can blame the MSM for all this, eh?
G West
3 years ago
corruption
And the only government to ever have a cabinet minister convicted and sent to jail was?
A history buff like you should know this stuff luke.
So far at least.
I'd suggest that things which have gone on in the premier's office since 2001 - if they come to light - may well change that record.
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Stump...
Let's use a simple BC political test:
Recent BC Federal Election Results:
Con - 45% (right-wing)
Lib - 19% (centre)
NDP - 26% (left-wing)
Now, based upon the above results, a simpleton should be able to assuage that BC is centre/centre-right politically.
As for my previous statement that BC continues to incrementally move centre/centre-right, let's look at the BC federal NDP numbers over the past ~45 years:
1962 - 31%
1963 - 30%
1965 - 33%
1968 - 33%
1974 - 35%
1979 - 32%
1980 - 35%
1984 - 35%
1988 - 37%
Now even a simpleton should be able to figure out that the trend, thereafter, has been away from the federal NDP here in BC.
FWIW, now let's look at the demographic trends... Albertan and Ontarian retirees continue to head to BC (Okanagan Valley, Vancouver Island, and Metro Vancouver 'burbs) in droves.
They are, for the most part, small "c" conservative. For example, Albertans even accounted for ~25% of real estate sales in the Comox Valley in 2007.
Now, if you are still not convinced, I've been following BC politics for ~ 30 years, since I was a kid (yeah, I'm a political nerd) :)
I've never seen an incumbent BC government continually ahead in public opinion polls during the duration of its term as what has transpired since the 2005 election.
Heck, under a year prior to the 2005 BC election, the NDP managed, at one point, to lead by an astonishing 12% (Mustel).
Notwithstanding the foregoing, BC has been led by centre/centre-right governments since 1871, with the exception of the 1972 and 1991 elections. The defeats of Wacky Bennett and Bill Vanderzalm were due to their arrogant and extremist stances.
Now we get to El Gordo... sure I don't like him, my dad hates him... but everyone also agrees that James is incompetent and a complete flake. No Harcourt waiting in the wings there.
While I agree with you, I think that you are singing from the wrong song-sheet. Most posters here believe that the 2010 Olympics are right-wing, corporate games that are just benefiting El Gordo's rich buddies. :)
Governments of all political stripes have been involved in social programs. Ya know... have a healthy economy and have the funds for social programs. Nothin' to do with "social democracy", which is a concept more politically apropos for Europe. Most people in Canada don't even understand that political concept.
PS. Scene 2: Dumb and Dumber... is now playin' ... errrr now postin'...after you... :)
Stump
3 years ago
History for Dummies
Luke:
"If one does not learn from history, one never will learn... and that's in the context of business, economics, politics, etc."
You might learn why our society is clearly headed 'left' if you set your Way-back machine to register events that are more than a few decades old. The party platforms of the gov'ts you reference would be anathema to the 'right' parties of a hundred years ago and positively horrific to the imperial dictators of centuries past.
The rest of your post isn't really addressing anything I actually said, so I leave it to stand or fall on it's own.
Better up your game or you're gonna lose that fat Liberal contract when your handlers figure out Dumb and Dumber-asses can point out the ineffectiveness of your arguments. More stats... stat! LOL
Stump
3 years ago
assuage
BTW, better check your dictionary. Assuage don't mean watcha thunk it do based upon your usage upthread
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Stump...
Well... as least you have now confirmed to me that you are on the same intelligence level as Quarry Bay! ;)
quarry bay
3 years ago
Luke
Ya better hope we never meet in person.
You never answere questions do ya Luke,without the media Campbell is done,what great management job has Campbell done,no other premier has added as much debt as the Campbell Liberals.
Liberal motto "we only cheat when we can`t win"
Luke you spew about the NDP opposing tax cuts,port mann twinning,Canada line etc etc etc---Let me clue you in Ah_ _e the job of the opposition is to appose,back in the bright,prosperous 90s the Cambell led Liberal opposition voted against every tax cut,they voted against the island highway,they voted against the millenium line,why? --Because that is the job of opposition.
I would bet you another 10.000.00 $ that Campbell will lose the 2009 election, But what`s the point,you reneged on the bet of 10.000.00 on the bi-elections,you were so confident after Campbell freeby news conference a week before the election and non stop 100 million dollar ad campaign and you still got whacked,you are nothing but a spinner,I DON~T LIKE YOU ,I at least had the class to say you were intelligent,you are a child mind in a man`s body.
Go ahead,click the offensive button, I was going to click you but, what the hell,let the fur fly, I will see you in hell Luke!
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Quarry Bay...
Man, I had no intention of insulting you. I've been seeing a barrage of tooooo many silly remarks... that don't pass any reasonableness test... IMHO.
In any event, I've known you around here for quite awhile and I apologize if I have been offensive. Really.
And I do wish you a MERRY CHRISTMAS!! :)
Stump
3 years ago
Liar
"Man, I had no intention of insulting you."
Bullshit. Total, unadulterated bullshit. You called me dumb and then said I was on the same intelligence level as Quarry Bay. You clearly meant to sneer at us both and now you're back-pedalling? Show some stones man and stand behind what you say.
Luke Skywalker
3 years ago
Stump...
Read my above post. Ya just might learn somethin'. ;)
Stump
3 years ago
The above post
The one where you say you didn't mean to be offensive when you called people dumb and then expect us to buy it?
zalm
3 years ago
Let's change the topic
...Back to the Olympics.
The usual Christmas calls are beginning now from Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Finland and Montenegro. Lots of chit-chat about the economy on both sides of the Atlantic, and what we're doing about it. It's funny - nobody seems to know about Vancouver's Olympics.
Nobody! Except for those who we've told (and have had to remind in the phone calls) nobody even knows we're having it. And when we remind them, out come some pretty telling comments - the architect uncle in Munster who notes that no Olympics has made money, and every government who expects it to has gone down to defeat from budgetary overruns. Or the Finnish cousin whose daughter was a leading figure-skater a few years ago, but was never able to participate in the Olympics due to the politics of the games - only certain coaches have access to the national Olympic committees in many countries, and others are rejected without appeal. Their pupils never get near the world stage.
OK, well one friend in Leverkusen did remember, but only so she could plan her trip away from the Olympics - she's now planning to come before Christmas in 2009.
I guess most people are content to watch figureskating and hockey on TV, when it interests them.
The Olympics seems to have run out of stock of their one marketable goodwill commodity - open competition - years ago, and have fallen back on corporate branding and thuggish behaviour. There are thousands of businesses that this stratagem hasn't worked for in the past who are now history, and I regret to say it won't be long before the Olympics is the same way, Dick Pound's efforts not withstanding.
zalm
3 years ago
No visitors
So I guess we won't be having any visitors to the Olympics in ur 3-bedroom pied-a-terre eight blocks from the athlete's village. Hold your breath, Luke, there might be some good tickets "magically" coming up for sale at the last minute. Keep your Visa card at the ready, and enjoy your games. I won't see you there.
Actually, I'll be out pushing my shopping cart full of garbage around in the scraggiest clothes I can find. Me and my neighbour Dan will have some fun going out during the day and tying up traffic, and then going out at night after a few beers and insulting anyone who looks like they might be enjoying the Olympics without our drunken, smelly, shabby presence. I predict the ranks of the "visible homeless" will swell by some thousands during the Olympics, and I will be one of them.
...carrying a cellphone with my lawyer on speed-dial, and a camera, of course...
Oh, I'm going to enjoy the Olympics!
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
Might join you, zalm
I might try to meet up with you Zalm. I'll be the appropriately scruffily dressed guy (arm in a sling) with a sign: "Will work for Food"; and I'll bring my bandana-wearing one-eyed dog. Yeah, these Olympics are starting to look fun!
Stump
3 years ago
Will Work For Food
I'd suggest more on topic 'Will Work For' signs:
Will Work for Human Growth Hormone
Will Work for Drug Free Urine
Will Work Forever (To Pay Taxes for this Circus)
alda
3 years ago
The Bum Brigade
To Zalm and Sharing is Good:
What a creative way to embarrass a society and its glib politicians who ignore those who would solve matters with logic, reason, and plain old common sense.
(Isn't your new mayor one of the good guys, though? I haven't been following that story.)
quarry bay
3 years ago
Car trouble
It would be a shame if my car ran out of gas or broke down on one of the olympic routes.
SharingIsGood
3 years ago
Not my Mayor, Alda
Robertson isn't my mayor. I don't live in Vancouver. With but one year to pull it together and the elite athletes' housing situation (as well as the needy homeless people's housing situation) being a joke, I don't think that the Vancouver electorate is going to blame the new mayor and new city council for the Olympics. It was the previous city council, Mayor Sam Sullivan, and Gordon Campbell that screwed this one up.
Of course, the MSM and the Socriberals will again blame their Olympic failures - their lack of taking care of the needs of the many and their lack of saving for a rainy day during good times on the NDP etc. Heck, Luke has already started blaming the NDP for the failures of Campbell and company during these last 8 years. He's been spinning so hard this week you'ld think he was Rapunzel rather than Gord Vader's son.
zalm
3 years ago
Rubbies' convention 2010
Thanks SIG - it'll be good to see other like-minded individuals taking this on instead of the usual complaints I'm party to around the water cooler. I look forward to petting that bandanna-wearing dog - always had a soft spot for them.
I don't think Robertson is any corporate flunky, although his party certainly is. There was no difference at all between vision and NPA, at least once Vision finally released what remnants of their platform they were able to put in a coherent speech. Vancouver got a right-wing government this time - there was no choice.
The only question is how long Gregor will be able to hold out against "them".
"Who was it, Gregor? Who turned you into a five-ring circus flag-waving screaming maniac?"
"I'm not sure, Zalm. It was so dark.... They were so big....."
zalm
3 years ago
Hah!
"Will Work Forever (To Pay Taxes for this Circus)"
Thanks Stump! I'm gonna put that on my vehicles - all of them!