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The Mystery of the Duplicating Comments
Turns out, it's your fault. Well, and Apple and us. But at least we can explain how you can keep it from happening again.
We feel your pain. We really really do.
File this one under yet another random thing that goes wrong when your newspaper depends on a press made of software.
Little more than a week ago, some comments in our commenting forum started duplicating up to nine times. The strange part was that it wasn't happening to every commenter, just a few.
After some investigation, we discovered it was only happening to people who used Macs... but not everyone using Macs, just some. And it was happening to people using the Safari browser on a Mac... but not everyone using the Safari browser on a Mac, just some. Turns out it was happening only to people using the latest version of Safari, version 4.0.4, which was just released a few weeks ago.
So for people just wanting to know the quick fix, here it is: For now at least when you comment on The Tyee, use a browser other than the new Safari.
Read on if you'd like to understand better why we need to ask this…and to satisfy your inner geek.
When it became clear the latest Safari was causing The Tyee comments system fits, the question remained: why us?
Leaving aside for now our default conclusion in such situations -- a software-styled Unabomber character who, in conjunction with a secret cabal of governments around the world that don't like good reporting, plots regular minor annoyances against us and our loyal readers -- we started to think back to any changes we may have made to the commenting forum.
Among the myriad problems that cropped up when we went live with our redesign this summer, there was a special little problem that drove many of our commenters crazy. When a commenter posted a comment, the page reloaded and moved the reader to the top of the screen, not to the bottom of the comment thread where the comment was published. In addition, if a commenter chose the All Comments tab, the system would switch to the Best Comments tab whenever he/she navigated to a new story.
Not huge problems for the average reader and/or commenter. But when you're commenting or moderating a lot, it was one of those petty regular annoyances that could make you poke your eyes out.
The solution? After the goat sacrifice failed, we decided to add some custom logic to the system that would remember, for those logged in as commenters, if you've chosen the All Comments tab or the Best Comments tab. That logic would also send you back to the place in the thread where you published your comment.
Turns out, that's the logic that Safari chokes on.
We have our technical wizards working on a solution, but we're a small shop focused more on reporting than software. So, we're still a few days away from fixing it. In the meantime, thanks for your patience. And if you are someone who uses Safari 4.0.4, consider using Mozilla Firefox for now if you want to comment. It's free, good, open-source software, and it plays nicely with our system.
A note about browsers
In fact, if you want to see our site in all its glory, Firefox and Safari seem to have the fewest problems. Unfortunately, the majority of our readers use some flavour of Microsoft's Internet Explorer. Here's the break-down:
- Internet Explorer: 45 per cent
- Mozilla Firefox: 36.6 per cent
- Apple Safari: 14.1 per cent
- Google Chrome: 2.2 per cent
- Opera: .8 per cent
With Internet Explorer, we're still having some display problems -- gaps where there should be no gaps, overprinting where there should be gaps. There's a point at which this never-ending game of whack-a-mole reaches significantly diminished returns. We're almost there. But if there's a display problem in any browser that seriously bothers you, please let us know.
No comment forum for the holidays
Given that we are a small shop and given the eventful year we've had -- a full site redesign while covering four elections, not to mention a rude and impromptu proroguing -- we're taking a bit of a break over the holidays. We're still publishing stories but the comment forum will be closed from Dec. 21 to Jan. 3. ![[Tyee]](http://thetyee.cachefly.net/ui/img/ico_fishie.png){kind=small}
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- ...while on the streets, pirates and ninjas put aside mutual animosity to join student protests
35
Login or register to post comments
SicPreFix
2 years ago
Goat Sacrifice
It is my understanding that the goat sacrifice is only effective when used in asscoiation with errant MS Word spellchecker flubs.
Of course, I could be altogether wrong.
salty dog
2 years ago
Tyee brass, show your balls
OK,my system is so old I post in morse code,ah but I digress.....
But,just because there will be no one around to edit comments from say Polakite or me....Give us a christmas treat....Free for all...a good old fashioned rip roaring debate without big brother moderator.
Signed. The Prisoner
Moat
2 years ago
Mac?
Wait? Macs with a problem? No way.
There must be some way to blame Windows Vista and cheer the stability of Apple.
Time for a "Think Different" commercial to reaffirm rattled Mac smugness - at least on the Tyee.
make_up_another...
2 years ago
One More Minor Niggle
When I read a story and want to post a comment, I log in. After my login is successfully authenticated, I am not redirected to the same article, logged in and ready to comment, I have to navigate back there myself.
It might be nice to be able to reply directly to other poster's comments too, sometimes people address what you say, but you may or may not realize it.
Jeffrey J.
2 years ago
Thanks for Explaining
I am repeatedly pleasantly surprised by the Tyee's candor and openness. This article is another great example. Many, many organizations are so reflexively secret they couldn't possibly publish such an account. But this is exactly what 'transparency' looks like, a word misused so often that we no longer know what it means. Great work Tyee, and I'll be sure not to upgrade my Safari to the new one until the problem is solved.
Frank
2 years ago
Geoff
You're really sure that its not the secret cabal of governments thingy? Cuz that would be my first guess.
SeaG
2 years ago
I'm shocked, but then again...
I'm a PC
SeaG
2 years ago
I'm shocked, but then again...
I'm a PC
dorothy
2 years ago
Regarding
One More Minor Niggle
Yes, this is something they screwed up too! It used to be that you could use 'back', which would first take you to a page you 'weren't authorized to view', and then once more 'back' would take you to the posting field, logged in and all. Now it just takes you back to where you still aren't logged in, and you have to go the long way back to the main Tyee page, find your article, and so on. It sucks, but if you're motivated....they should ask for qualified help from the readership. Maybe they'll get it.
And, to you, Dave, you botched that sacrifice big time. It should have been a ram. The God of communication is Heimdal, and he will not be fobbed off with any part of a goat. Look it up.
David Beers
2 years ago
salty dog
I understand your point of view, however The Tyee has to be concerned about libel laws and other risks we run when we allow threads of anonymous commenters to go unmoderated.
Have a good holiday!
shepsil
2 years ago
Keeping us out of the dark!
Again, well done in keeping us out of the dark. Your update re-news my faith in The Tyee.
Happy New Year and the best of the season to everyone out there in Tyee cyberland.
Nic
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
Blue Camas
2 years ago
Smugness
I'm so glad that Internet Explorer (only available on Windows now) is having display problems.
My smugness is intact.
Unfortunately I'm sending this via Safari 4.0.4 (5531.21.10) because my beloved Firefox can't seem to retain character encodings lately.
I also wanted to send a Safari 4.0.4 test comment (sorry!) because I am sure that I have previously sent you comments that did not duplicate.
mjscox
2 years ago
Agree with "make up
Agree with "make up another.." who said she/he is not redirected back to the original page/article/comments section when asked to login/register, but instead to the page which confirms login/register, and then one has to go to the front page, and find the article/comment again. It is a minor annoyance. Well, not really minor, but I have better things to do than to complain, or I guess I don't, since here I am complaining.
leahmac
2 years ago
not to be picky but...
...if only 45% of readers are using some version of MS Internet Explorer, then a majority of your readers are NOT using IE...and that's a good thing becuase according to your stats 51% of readers are using the browsers that work best for this site...
VivianLea Doubt
2 years ago
I am pretty sure
that goat sacrifice has to be part of the problem.There is a correlation between those who use Mozilla Firefox and vegetarianism and the Queen of ******* everything does not approve of animal sacrifice. Please! Get with the new religion!
Thanks,Tyee.
PS...beets make a lovely show of bloodiness, and carrots have been known to squeal when roasted...
OilbertaRedTory
2 years ago
Thanks Tyee
Your communication workers are angels; maybe Gabriel - patron of telecom:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEf_FGyRDV8
And for some Mac smugitude:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFt1aRBhN4s&feature=related
make_up_another...
2 years ago
Reader Communication
I must say, I am impressed that The Tyee will regularly engage directly with readers. Good Work.
I especially love it when the authors of articles duke it out with readers in the comments section, something you never see on the CBC or Globe & Mail. It's more honest, and wildly entertaining.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
MichaelT
2 years ago
well firefox is slower than safari
just a ploy to discriminate against Apple users?
Blame the person who cannot fix it really. Seriously, it's called doing your job or finding another or a contractor to teach the staff to deal with it.
It's all Tyee. Stop hating.
Geoff
2 years ago
What a great thread/discussion.
OK... where to start:
Dorothy thinks we should sacrifice a ram; VivianLea suggests beets and carrots. I'll wait for consensus before pursuing this. However, it sounds like the makings of a delicious stew.
As for the stability/quality of Safari. Despite the cheeky sub-head on this article, we weren't trying to say Safari is in some way broken or faulty. There may be a very good reason it doesn't like the logic we created. What I take from the experience is yet another lesson in how no software really exists in isolation or stasis. As the software that our software relies on evolves, so must we. It's an ongoing investment in time and money.
mjscox/make_up_another...
Yes, we've had this feedback before. Let me ask everybody reading this: how often do you find yourselves logging in on average in a week? Do you log out when you're done or do you leave yourselves logged in? This information will help us prioritize the issue along with the other issues/problems/changes on our list.
Blue Camas: thanks for the test. :-)
Leahmac: You're right. The majority of our readers don't use IE. What I was trying to say was more people use some flavour of IE (Internet Explorer) than any other single browser. Thanks for catching my imprecise language.
Interestingly, the number of IE users that visit our site has slowly declined in the last year or two. And only around 10 per cent are still using IE6, which caused us a few significant headaches in the past.
In fact, if anyone reading this is still using IE6, please consider upgrading to IE7 or 8 or moving to a different browser altogether (again, Safari [when we have this problem fixed] and Firefox are great options). I suspect you'll enjoy reading our (and other) websites much more that way.
(To figure out what version of IE you're using: go to Help menu in the menu bar at the top of the browser window. Click the About option. Sometimes there's even a Check for Upgrade option there.)