I guess they could torch the

I guess they could torch the oil, that would spread it atmosphericaly worldwide, spreading the toxins over a wider area and reducing the eco-damage to Amerika.

Exxon-BP

I knew that Exxon had fought tooth and nail against the Valdez judgements for 20 years. What I didn't know was the final outcome, 3 percent of the original judgement.

I do not expect any better of BP. The stakes are just as high, and the profit margins are in just as much trouble,

Maybe, just maybe the

Maybe, just maybe the Americans will wake up and see what the oil industry does to the rest of the world. Hardly a peep about the oil spills along the Trans-Alaskan pipe line which is also operated by BP. Huge areas in Ecuador and Nigeria are drenched in oil spills and it seems nobody gives a shit except the locals who have to live there. Maybe its about time the Americans got what they deserve; it's payback time.

North Americans Are Oil Pigs

What's not being mentioned in this debate revolves around self-examination.
Until Americans and Canadians, myself included, stop relying on, and wasting, cheap oil, companies like BP, Shell, Exxon, will continue to meet consumer demand.
Think of our waste --- every parent on the hockey team drives to away games (carpooling, HA) , we deserve a winter holiday in a hot clime, buying more cheap plastic crap (which uses oil), commuting to work rather than using transit, living in a monster home.
Don't forget Alberta's oilsands where almost 2,000 birds died after getting trapped in filthy tailings ponds. Syncrude's lawyer is claiming the oilsands will suffer if the company is convicted of violating environmental laws because the precedent will be used by environmental groups to prosecute other oil companies.
Laws don't stop grand-scale catastrophes like this. An angry public that unites to demand change to our energy system might do something but that would be too uncomfortable for many.
Or else fine companies like BP to the hilt, in effect bankrupting them.

Every time you start your car or truck, think about this

Two news items this morning:
1. Estimates say that over the past two weeks this well has spewed as much oil as the Exxon Valdez dumped
2. BP prez says that it may take up to 90 days before they can stop the flow of oil

The obvious conclusion is that over the next 3 months we should expect an additional 6 Exxon Valdez's worth of oil in the Gulf.

Seeing as how lightly Exxon got off for their dastardly deed, and that BP's f-kup has killed 12 and will obliterate and entire ecosystem, should we not start considering that such reckless exploitation of the environment is criminal? This is not genocide but maybe we should call it ecocide? BP might just as well have lit off a nuclear weapon in the Gulf.

Exxon judgement

The plaintiffs who sued Exxon were first awarded $5 billion, not $2.5 and after an appeal that award was reduced to $4B and then increased to $4.5B. The fact that they only paid $507 Million is a disgrace. Most of that was recovered from insurance companies.I'm sure the same will happen with BP with the oil company recovering most of their losses through insurance claims.I hope the fishermen in the gulf sue them and win a huge settlement.

Who pays?

BP's CEO whining - "What the hell did we do to deserve this?" over dropping share prices is amazing. What about the fishermen from Louisiana? What about the residents who are inhaling hydro-carbons at likely cancerous rates for the next few weeks? What about the marine ecosystems in the Gulf of Mexico? What the hell did they do to deserve BP's spill? I can't imagine asking the same thing on BC's coast. We need to stop the Enbridge pipeline and related tanker traffic now to end any potential devastating risks.

And in the case of Enbridge, any spill would rely on an "international fund" to pay for clean-up as they're just the pipeline company after all. Or, put another way, the residents of British Columbia would not only be paying in both ecological and economic devastation, but also the costs of clean-up.

I think any plans for a pipeline through BC to the coast

and coastal tanker traffic would be abandoned by any government hoping for even the slightest chance of a reelection. Since the socreds raping BC already know they will never get back in again, expect them to go full steam ahead on said plans. It will be open war.

Disheartening

This has been a terrible week. For me there is nothing worse to watch than this, when our hunger for resources and profits threatens to completely destroy a thriving ecosystem.

All we can hope for now is that the winds turn. As far as evading these sorts of disasters, I think it is simple minded to try to put a moratorium on oil tankers or offshore drilling as some seem to suggest. There is no source of energy that is without side effects or environmental damage. Say for example the U.S. starts importing more oil from Canada so that there are less tankers out there. Will there be less spills? Certainly, but there will also be much more carbon dioxide released into the atmosphere. I think the U.S. government is just as much to blame as BP. While BP may have ensured everyone that extensive environmental devastation would be evaded in the event of a spill, are we really going to accept that the U.S. government simply took them at their word? They should have made BP prove to them that proper contingency plans were in place. If this giant dome everyone keeps talking about could have been prebuilt and ready, this wouldn't even be a news story right now. Very sad...

The Gulf spill

First, note that Alaska Senator Ted Stevens promoted the shipping of oil from Port Valdez in the 1970s and promised: "Not one drop of oil will be spilled in Prince William Sound." No suprise that--in an unrelated matter--he was convicted in 2008 on felony ethics charges.
Second, while BP is the immediate villain, was there no agency to inspect and ensure that all safety features were in place? Where does that leave the remaining thousands of Gulf platforms?

Pipelines for BC?

It is in the making and if Campbell has his way it will be a done deal as BC premier says he is sending BC experts on Oil Spills to help put a stop to this spill but unfortunately not the BS.

socialize the costs

BP won't have a problem finding the money it needs to pay those it needs to manage the “fix”. Consumers will be required to anti up, either through increased prices for petrol-linked commoditiies or through government aid (ie tax dollars).

If BC sends its “experts” to help cap the leak, who will pay? Does anyone seriously believe the Campbell will send a bill to Hayward?

Economics aside, no amount of money will “fix” the environmental problems created by BP’s out-of-control gusher spewing crude into the Gulf. If capping the leak … within a reasonable time frame … fails, the environmental damage that follows will exceed that caused by Chernobyl and Exxon put together.

Readers of MSM should be prepared to get drilled by a barrage of commentary that gushes forth with themes that portray BP as the financial victim in all of this, much like the Pope tried to do by blaming the media for victimizing the church.

The “teachable moment” has come and gone. Few paid attention, fewer care, and the majority prefers ignorance.

Conservatism

Enron, AIG, Goldman Sachs, Exxon, BP, Blackwater -- this is what the conservative movement has given us. A return to 19th-century capitalism. In the U.S. the conservative Supreme Court just allowed unlimited corporate contributions to political candidates. The Fix is now complete. The ghost of Henry Clay Frick is having a hearty laugh.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Clay_Frick

BC imports over 125,000 barrels a day

It is refreshing to see a Tyee article about some of the threats of dirty fossil fuels. The Enbridge pipeline would be a disaster and must be stopped.

However, like other recent BC energy articles in Tyee, this one too lacks the critical context of BC's dirty oil reality.

For example, the article rightly worries about the threats from exploring for oil in risky places. And it rightly worries about threats from shipping oil long distances in our neck of paradise.

What it leaves out is the basic context of our role in these two things already.

For example the reader isn't told that we citizens of BC currently import over 125,000 barrels of oil a day. That oil is extracted somewhere else. Not here in BC. Where? Ah, who cares?

And all our gimme-gimme oil is shipped into BC each day. How? Ummm...er...somehow I guess.

Our daily suck on the Big Oil teat isn't a possible threat in the future, like Enbridge pipeline. It is an everyday threat, the volume of which is 25 TIMES more than what is said to be spewing from the gulf right now.

IMPORTED OIL is the primary energy source in BC. We IMPORT more oil energy than BC Hydro produces in total.

We have used up almost all the easy cheap oil in the world. Ditto in BC. BC oil production peaked a decade ago at 20 million barrels a year. It has fallen to under 13 million barrels now. Vancouver even has it's own peak-oil task force now.

The oil that is left in the world is the dirty, dangerous and expensive stuff. Wars required.

Until we actually do the work to transform BC's oil-dependent boats, ships, cars, trucks, buses, ferries, planes, big machinery, and all the rest of our petro-infrastructure to something cleaner and more sustainable, we will be co-conspirators in this increasingly nasty oil endgame.

And that doesn't even take into account the emerging climate shocks caused by our dirty oil.

The author of this article says: "Perhaps this is good time to revisit what, if anything, was learned by the oil industry last time they caused such a catastrophe. "

Uh, the last time was not the Exxon Valdez, it is today and yesterday and everyday. We are dumping a billion tonnes a day of burned fossil fuel trash into our whacked out ecosystems. In the process we are cooking up Earth2.0 with acidic seas and dying forests.

This spill is definitely a chance for a "teachable moment" in BC. Too bad we so far aren't interested in learning about own role in what is happening and thus what we can do to stop the dirty oil nightmare from getting worse.

a few ramblings

A few ramblings on the situation in the Gulf.
1) The pictures of the oil rig fire were pretty awful--on the other hand, what were they going to do with the crude oil anyhow?--burn it! (Well, most of it, granted some was destined for garbage bags and polyester suits and the like.)
2) All of it was going to be pollution of one sort or another, so at least it's in a form that can eventually be degraded by bacteria. Too bad about the fishfolk, though. Hope their lawsuits are more successful than their Alaskan counterparts.
3) Our provincial government, through the British Columbia Investment Management Corporation has $13 million in Transocean and $105 million in BP. Wonder what the book value will be six months from now? Is that why Penner was so anxious to pledge BC resources for the clean-up? Those boys at the ledge sure move when it comes to offering help to their free-enterprise friends.

Way too many...

Uhhhh. We all knew this was coming... that it was just a matter of time.

We have a major "species" problem. And the fix is far, far from in yet.

It seems pointless to even talk about it more than that... yet. At least. Still way too many sheeple, across the entire social strata board, top to bottom, the "educated" classes as much as "the lower orders".

all about $

It slipped out that there are remote controlled valves designed for such oilwells, to be installed at the seabed and stop the flow.
However it was decided it was too expensive for this rig.
Nuff' said?

Booker

Good article in Harper's Magazine about the vanishing liberal
http://harpers.org/archive/2010/04/0082894
Hope the link works for you.

Ramona 777

It would have to be a class action suit, considering that our governments are on the side of the oil companies, et al.

co-conspiracy

Yes, when it comes to identifying who’s responsible the mirror must be held at an angle that includes ourselves. It’s hard to escape the fact we are part of the conspiracy; but it’s not just oil. Check the label on your clothing. Are folks concerned about child labour, working conditions and wages in Malaysia, China and India? Where does your food come from? How about your vehicle and your household appliances? The list of self-incriminating purchases and activities is endless.

But there’s several snags to the co-conspiracy theory: Is it possible to have food and material goods grown or produced locally, in quanties that meet demand, without the benefit of the imported oil subsidy? Are you willing, and more importantly, able to pay the cost? Are you willing to divest yourself of the income obtained from those businesses and industries that rely on their well-oiled connection to the global market?

Refining ones connection to oil might be possible in smaller rural communities, but most city dwellers have fewer options. And the folks responsible for providing alternatives that will significantly reduce urban dependance on oil are doing the opposite.

more distillation required

While there’s no doubt … given humanity’s current dependence on fossil fuels … that more people means more pollution problems added to our already overtaxed ecosystems, the belief that a simple reduction in global population numbers will solve this problem misses a critical point.

It’s an indisputable fact that, of the 6.8 billion folks currently inhabiting the planet, only a small fraction use and abuse most of the resources. So, although it may seem logical that reducing the number of sheeple will reduce pollution and lighten the load on scarce resources, we already know that those consuming the most will not tolerate, much less support, any government that wants to restrict or reduce their usage of resources, or restrict their plans to encourage others to do the same. That’s what capitalism is all about.

Imagining that the same small fraction would support a government that wants to reduce their numbers ignores the raison d’etre of the power elite.

Offshore will not be wanted

So they'll turn more to the Alberta Oil Sands.

Canadian Oil Sands Trust: Stock Price, 12 months: +19.42%

Light Sweet Crude: May 2009: $55
May 2010: $85

The Oil Sands become more viable.

stonebreaker

Your fellow Liberal supporter, realisticman, thinks you should invest in Alberta oil stocks.

Let us know how that turns out for you.

Ramona777 nailed it!

"Laws don't stop grand-scale catastrophes like this. An angry public that unites to demand change to our energy system might do something but that would be too uncomfortable for many.
Or else fine companies like BP to the hilt, in effect bankrupting them"

Without sacrifice, no sustainability!

It's in the courts

Thu Apr 29, 2010

HOUSTON (Reuters) – Shrimpers in Louisiana and Alabama have filed class-action lawsuits against oil giant BP Plc and owners of the drilling platform that exploded in the Gulf of Mexico, as claims for economic losses anticipated from the disaster began to mount.

Two similar lawsuits, filed late on Wednesday in U.S. District Court in New Orleans and on Thursday in the adjacent Gulf Coast state of Alabama, accuse the companies of negligence. ...

The suits name as defendants London-based BP Plc, which holds the lease to the offshore well; Swiss-based Transocean Ltd, owner of the Deepwater Horizon drilling platform that exploded in flames on April 20 and collapsed two days later; Halliburton Energy Services Inc, which was engaged in cementing operations of the well and well cap; and Cameron International Corp, which supplied the rig's blow-out prevention equipment that failed.

Each of the lawsuits seeks economic and compensatory damages of at least $5 million, the minimum sum required by the federal Class Action Fairness Act on which jurisdiction for the suits are partially based. They also seek an unspecified amount of punitive damages."

BP Employees: 80,000.
Operating Cash Flow (2009): $27.7 billion.
Total Assets Value: $235 billion.

World Oil Consumption 2009: 4 billion tons.

Tar Sands

Ah yes! Alberta/Saskatchewan tarsands -- the world's only Green oil project.

Thanks Freebear!

Yes, we have to make sacrifices and come to terms with our own wastefulness.
There are those who champion "progress" but progress for whom? The African who risks his life each day to either scavenge for food and oil to keep our Beemers running?
The Bolivian working in a horrific Canadian-financed mine so we can build more stupid gadgets?
The Thai shrimp farms that have decimated the country's natural geography (one reason the tsunami was so devastating) so we can eat cheap shrimp?
Progress does not equal a better life for most of the world's inhabitants. It only enslaves us into thinking so.

Probably

Mid-East oil is less reliable and off-shore is ...

"The world's most populous nation is experiencing huge growth in auto sales. ... The Chinese market is already the biggest in the world by sales, having passed the struggling US car market in 2009. Car sales in China jumped 45% last year and are projected to rise 20% in 2010. ..."

http://www.moneyshow.com/investing/Jubak_Journal.asp?aid=Jubak_Journa-19634

I should buy shares in the dish soap company!

Gulf disaster will be measured as an increase in GDP; increassing growth; how wonderful for the economy; from livlihood to compensation cheque!