So what does winning a popularity contest mean when it comes to understanding governance and international relations?

Belinda just announced that she will not be seeking the leadership of the Federal Liberal Party. Her friends say that she cannot get over the french speaking hurdle.
I have to laugh. Steven Harper has no problem with French. She lost to him in the Conservative leadership contest, she sells out and crosses the floor to save the Liberal mandate, and now bows out of this contest.
I think Steven Harper has won this little battle between them. She is eating crow now. Ha ha ha ha.

Since it appear that little ronnie erwin has found himself a new handle (and a new IP address?) I move for a motion that C.I.R.E. be reorganized into C.I.I.A.M.C. Any seconds?

silver spoons don't necessarily translate into talen.

Typical poll !

Ask a pointed question and get the answer in the direction you pointed the question.Then you can diddle any common sense offered by people responding.

We all want decent ,honest people in our governments...unless you are either brain dead or Gordon Gecko living out your credo of GREED IS GOOD !

Typical poll, but! Do they vote for people with these characteristics? Not on your life. When did anybody who told the truth (maybe things like "there is no way we are going to be able to do this" ever get elected?

Elections are like polls,you have a choice on how you answer and it is never clear what you are really voting for/who...so ,you answer within the parameters set.

real simple ,when you have RAT #1 RAT #2 RAT#3 and some GOOD FAITH INDIES with no money or power...you either vote or abstain.

just like polls,you can diddle common sense til the cows come home.POINTED QUESTIONS = DESIRED RESULTS...

RAT#I + BRAINWASHING/ADVERTISING+MONEY/POWER= POLITICIAN IN POWER/DESIRED RESULTS

Careful Elliot, you are beginning to sound like a lefty.

oh my god you're right!

- this is the wish-list for Canadians, eh? That is how we happen to have elected Harper to take the helm. Either our perceptiveness is significantly impaired, or polls don't quite reflect reality - which may or may not bring into question their usefulness.

Polls

The latest are frightening for the Lib's.
In Ontario and Quebec, the conservatives have gained 8 to 10 points over them
The Lib support is only within a percentage point of the NDP at 22 - 23 %.
I guess all in good.

HALLELUIA!!!!Re: polls. Didn`t you just know that sooner or later we would actually get a grown-up for a leader?

Well I'm just hoping that anyone who's impressed by Ignatieff's supposed brain will read his love ode to the American Empire entitled "Who are Americans To Think That Freedom is Theirs to Spread."

Also: "Canada's Prince of Darkness" by John Chuckman.

And ponder his silly, transparent fascination with torture:

"The debate over torture is not as simple as it seems. THOSE OF US WHO OPPOSE TORTURE under any circumstances should admit that ours is an unpopular policy that may make us more vulnerable to terrorism."

"Those of us who oppose torture..." Yeah, right! (This has to be one of the ugliest sentences in the English language!)

Ignatieff's entire polemic is to pretend to offer objectivity while subliminally offering encouragement to the dreamers of power and empire.

I love good old-fashioned enthusiasm! Unfortunately IAMC, in grade 12 you're going to take Cdn history and you'll learn that there is a honeymoon period for most governments for awhile after they take power.

By the next election Gomery will be forgotten, Harper and Company sound bites from Parliament will be wearing on people's nerves and the natural ruling party of this country with their spiffy new leader, that everyone who is anyone will agree is just what the country needs , will be back in power.

See, if I still had the enthusiasm of youth I'd be all a twitter about the possibility of a surging NDP trouncing the Libs. But I know tis but a dream from which I will soon awake to see yet another Lib campaign from the left and rule from the right, and yes, I said rule. You can bank on it.

Gee, why the quick brush off for the much talented Ashley MacIsaac.

Given the Liberal Party's bent on trickle down economics under the guidance of their last PM's hand, I suspect the east coast fiddler could get quite excited about delivering on that practice.

Frank, you would have thought the 'honeymoon period' would have been eaten up by the Emerson affair. Apparently not. You will have to admit that Canadians are loving this new Conservative administration or be exposed as a left wing moon bat refusing to face the facts.
Steven Harper rules Canada. woooooooooeeee

IAMC, the honeymoon period for the Cons is certainly over in Van-Kingsway :)

But no one outside the lower mainland seems to give a rat's ass about it.

moonbat? I'm not even sure what that is... Are they good eating?

Canadians like me are overjoyed to see the coattails of Paul Martin. If I had to put up with one more day of his doing one thing while saying another I don't think I could have stayed sane.

But I'm just telling you IAMC, don't think the entire Cdn political landscape has changed in a few months. Everyone didn't leave the country to be replaced by an almost exact duplicate.

The Liberals are the most successful political party in the west and they didn't get there by accident (as "Working Man" has so often reminded us).

Harper only managed a razor-thin minority at a time when the Libs have been tearing each other apart. Many sat on their hands in the last election. Wounds take time to heal.

But they will find a new leader, have a big party, kiss and make up with each other and then no matter how good a job Harper does at muzzling everyone in his party his shtick will look old and tired compared to Michael-torture if necessary but not necessarily torture-Ignatieff or whoever.

But it is good to be enthusiastic. I wish I could join you and think the NDP will replace the Libs but it is way too early to be doing a jig over that either.

By the way IAMC, the poll you're referring to was taken before Parliament had even sat or anyone done anything bigger than a photo-op. I know the saying "hope springs eternal" and all but you gotta be realistic.

Frank
No it's an Environics poll just revealed yesterday on CBC. Don Newman's political hour at 2:00 PM yesterday.
Get with the program.
The CPC is wildly popular in Ontario and Quebec now. If an election were held today, the Lib's would be wiped off the map and be as irrelevant as the NDP.

IAMC, its not on the CBC or TO Star's website and I couldn't find it on the Environics one either.

Got more info?

Frank
Sorry, I don't. I am sure of what I viewed less than 24 hours ago. If you don't believe me, well whatever.

IAMC, don't pout, I do believe you. If I didn't why would I have gone hunting for it? I simply would have liked to have checked it out for myself before believing the Cons are wildly popular back east and everyone who isn't a Con is now irrelevant.

Is it possible Newman was simply referring to the last Environics poll which could have been taken weeks or even more than a month ago?

Frank
google 'environics research group' and look for yesterdays press release.
It's there.

Thanks, read it.

They're up 5 points. I still say that's a modest honeymoon as opposed to a "Harper-mania".

The only way Harper could have screwed up in the first months was by declaring war on Denmark.

Right now he has less support nationally than the BC NDP do in BC so I suggest you don't stock up on champagne just yet.

The Libs will rebound

Frank
Did you scroll down a look at leadership approval poll. Harper is at 60%. That's a remarkable number. I guess Canadians have found the leader they want.
In spite of Emerson. It appears MSM is out of touch with Canadians.
The question asked in this article has just been answered. It's Steven Harper.

Yep, on leadership he's at 60 but that doesn't translate into votes, Cdns are just happy he's not Paul Martin.

And yes the MSM is way out of touch with Canadians but that's because the right-wing controls most of it. Not to worry, the internet is rising fast.

The CBC, The Toronto Star, The New York Times, CBS, CNN, I could go on. MSM is hardly right wing. And you are right the internet is on the rise. With 'The Blogging Tories' , 'Small Dead Animals' , 'Captian's Quarters' , 'Steve Janke Angry in the Great White North' , 'The Tyee'
'Borgue Newswatch' , 'Neale News' .
There are plenty of sites revealing the truth.

Frank is correct: Canadians like me are happy simply because he's not Paul Martin.

I hadn't realized how stressful Paulo had been, until I found myself relaxing while watching SHarper speak. Gone were the windmilling hands, the wild eyes, the eyebrows vertical with anxiety, the hesitancy about simply saying anything straight out.

Before Paul, we'd had Jean who made us laugh but we never quite knew what he'd just said, or what he'd say next.

But Mr Hair-in-the-fridge appears to have thought about the issues, has arrived at conclusions, and is capable of enunciating wtf he concluded. So far as I know, he hasn't cooked any ridings, dabbled in organized crime, or elbowed any longtime loyalists off the freeway. In fact, judging by his treatment of Stockwell Day, SHarper may be a minor saint.

But style doesn't trump substance. Mr Hair-in-the-fridge is leading this country debt and into a world war at a time when we have no enemies overseas and no reason to send our soldiers into battle. It isn't going to feel a darn bit better -- and Jean Chretien would be welcomed back onto my island -- once SHarper's leadership amounts to copying Dubya's blueprint for ecumenical success. Even with the revised version of Judas, he will be intolerable. Pity.

the last 3 in your list would also be in my list of right-wing MSM. But in the Cdn context it is instructive you could think of only two "liberal" sources before having to leave the country so to speak.

I could go on much further in my list of Cdn MSM on the right.

The Sun, The Province, Times-Colonist, Kamloops Daily News or whatever its called, in fact the entire provincial Black chain of garbage. The Calgary Herald and Sun. The Edmonton Journal and Sun. The Sasatoon Star-Phoenix, the Regina Leader Post, the Winnipeg Sun.

The Globe and Mail, the National Post, the Toronto Sun, the Ottawa Citizen, the Montreal Gazette, the Halifax Chonicle etc

Leaving print I would throw in the entire Canwest-Global network as well as the CTV network, Chorus radio etc

Steven Harper and his bunch do have a lot of the attributes mentioned in the article.Unfortunately they are Right Wingers who sing from the same Hymn book,money makes the world go round,world go round,world go round...

War is nothing but big business and being Peewee Rambo means you can really look good buying all those toys for the military and stimulating your economy to make you feel good til you bury your young kids/soldiers.

I hear a lot of people saying ,PEEWEE is a REALLY NICE GUY,he is not at all like DUBYA they are only in business together.It's only social intercourse,they won't be breeding...

YEAH SURE !

Yeah Thomas you're right. It's too bad we don't have a great leader like Jean Chirac.

Chirac is a right-wing conservative. The US and Cdn right were happy when he took over from Mitterand.

Jean Chirac (?) Often thought Harper and Jacques Chirac seemed a lot alike, actually! But, Jean Chirac - not so much!

Chirac is obviously a weak leader. Not like Margaret Thatcher who was willing to take on the out of control unions.
Anyway, if you want a laugh, the Liberals are having a leadership conference in Edmonton of all places and it's on CBC Newsworld right now.

Well the people of Edmonton, excepting Oiler fans natch, are the best people in Alberta. I lived there for awhile and if you're going to find Alberta NDP'ers, that's the place to go.

I don't have a tv while I'm working here, what are they discussing that could be so important its on tv?

Anyway, the French people are not going to be cowed by a Maggie Thatcher. they have a long history of protesting and its worked out well for them. Even Napoleon, who was always threatening a "whiff of grapeshot" knew his days were numbered if he couldn't keep delivering the goods.

How has protesting worked out for Francey. It appears to me the country is spiralling into an economic basket case. Leadership appears weak and the people are spoiled. I see doom and gloom for this communist country.
And I see no hope on the horizon.
But they still feel superior to Americans, funny isn't it ?

One of the highest standards of living in the world. Good pay, vacations that are the envy of the rest of us, top rated health and education and a shorter work week etc.

We should all be so doomed.

How an American working at Wal-Mart or McDonalds with no health care coverage, little if any vacation time and has to live out of his car can look down on the French is beyond me.

Frank
Standard of living according to The UN Human Development Index
1. Norway
2. Sweden
3. Australia ( long live John Howard )
4. Canada
5. Netherlans
6. Belgium
7. Iceland
8. United States ( long live George Bush )
9. Japan
10. Ireland
11. Switzerland
12. United Kigdom ( long live Tony Blair )
13. Finland
14. Austria
15. Luxemborg
16. France
17. Denmark ( long live cartoonists )

I think an American working for Microsoft or Boeing can justify looking down their nose at Francey.
This country is ruined and soon will be slipping further down the list.
Chirac is no Margaret Thatcher .

Quite a number of socialist countries high up on that list, eh!

Looks like France is doing darned well even under that measure. So if they're 16th in the world why are they doomed?

As for Boeing and Microsoft, Wal-Mart and McDonalds employ far more people. The average Frenchman gets longer vacations, works a shorter week etc than the average American.

You have yet to make a case for France being a doomed basket-case. In fact, your own posts make France look pretty good.

France is too bureaucratic, the Govt. has lost control to Public Sector Unions, taxes are too high, vacation times are unsustainable, the citizens are spoiled, Muslims are taking over the country, couldn't pass EU Charter, they subsidize farmers to grow wheat, they are anti American. Look at the riots on the streets, why do they have the false feeling of entitlement ? High unemployment of young people and when the Govt. tries to help they riot.
France is a riot.

Stats IAMC, I need stats. Show me how their productivity has fallen to the same level as Niger's. How the workers can't make ends meet and are turning to crime. How their high tax rates are undermining the country. If you have a "Spoiled Citizen Index" where the US ranks 55th and the French are first I'd like to see that (which assumes the people being spoiled is a bad thing).

Muslims aren't taking over the country, it just seems that way if you're living in North America. Islamics make up only around 5% of the population. That's like saying the Protestants are taking over.

As for subsidizing crops, the US and Canada can't point at anyone else and complain about subsidies because farmers in both countries are up to the neck in subsidies.

Our high unemployment of young people also makes it foolish to point at the French as if they invented it.

Rhetoric and bluster alone, even when pushed enthusiastically is always welcome, but we've done that.

Be patient with IAMC Frank, he got doused pretty thoroughly with some Venezuelan oil on the that 'nasty' French riots site.

Actually Muslims make up about 10-12% of the population, or 5 to 6 million people. Which is the highest population in Western European nations.
It's like the Green Party, just enough to push an agenda when it comes to swing votes.
This tactic has been used by The Liberal Party of Canada, whereas they use race based politics to exploit minorities.
The influence of Muslims helped to create the previous riots, as they were demanding jobs.
Now that the Govt. has come up with a way of providing them jobs, the citizenry is revolting against this attempt.
There is more to this crisis than meets the eye.

IAMC, the estimates of the population go as low as 3.5 million and I believe the lower numbers are more credible. Also that number is inflated because it includes converts and those who are secular in all but name.

Its not a take-over of France any more than the US has been taken over by Mexicans.

As for the Liberals, pandering to different groups is their bread and butter. Its always worked for them and I doubt they'll be giving it up any time soon.

Frank
I believe the numbers I posted are more credible than the numbers you posted. But my point stands, they are a like our indo-Canadian population. Something that politicians will try to exploit.

But IAMC, your point is pointless because it doesn't lead anywhere. Whether there are 3.5 million (a study was done based on census) or 5 million Moslems in France does not a "take-over" make.

Also, you've failed to produce any stats to back up your assertion that France is a basket case. In fact, the only stat you did put up, showed France in pretty good shape.

Frank, What do you call it when 10% of the citizens have to be appeased ? I mean look at the influence that homosexuals have in our society with only 1% representation.
10% is huge. Do you really believe this has no influence on politicians in Francey ?
Get real man.

Good government

According to a study on the French census the Moslem population is 3.7 million out of a total population of 60 million. 3.7 is a huge number but 56.3 million is also pretty big.

I would certainly hope it does, just as I would hope that 3.7 million Canadians could have their voices heard too.

Frank
I share your promotion of immigration. I really do. I am aware of the fact that our charter protects the rights of minorities. I wouldn't have it any other way.
I do though, wish to protect my right to do business with whomever I want to.
If we can be fair with each other, then we can get along.
But if you are trying to rearrange my life to suit yours, then I call those views to be offensive, and hope you respect my rights as well as you expect me to respect yours.
If the rights clash, then I want to win.

What i find lacking in recent world leaders including those here in Beaverland is foresight and vision. There was a era not long ago when intellect ruled the lands. Sometimes it meant leaders were in some ways seen as aloof and apart from some of the populace. But there was insight and a greater plan in place. Trudueu, Kennedy's Castro, even the likes of Barrett and Levesque. Now when i gaze around the globe it seems that few world leaders can be accused of having too much intellect. Bush would never be accused of possesing an over abundance of brain matter and deep thought. Nor would Blair. Chretien Martin and now Harper can never be accused of being on the cutting edge of vision and intellect. This may be seen by some as a positive however with the world needing some long term planning and a greater understanding of evnviromental issues and of world poverty and the solutions that must be put into place it scares me to see the kind of short sighted leadership we have inheritated.